quill18
Warlord
Will start my turn shortly and should have a post up this afternoon (EST).
AK-02 american chopper
- Thread starter Admiral Kutzov
- Start date
quill18
Warlord
Oh, and I'll post this right away for the curious:
quill18
Warlord
With coast tiles visible to our north and west, I'm going to guess that we're in the top-left corner of the map. As a result, I'm going to sweep my explorers in an east-south arc first to find our neighbours and map out some high priority settling locations.
Turn 2 - Pop a hut for 79 gold.
Turn 4 - Meet a neighbour:
I don't really know much about Joao's personality. Can someone give us an overview?
Turn 7 - Hunting completes, start on Mining. (8 turns)
Turn 9 - Meet our second neighbour:
So I'm guessing we have Joao to our east and Liz to our south.
Turn 11 - Hinduism is FIDL. Clearly, we have at least one spiritual civ.
Turn 12 - Our worker completes. I send him to the adjacent deer tile and start on a warrior. He will complete in 8 turns, which is currently when Washington will grow to Size 2, though that will be accelerated by the deer. I'm thinking that we're going to be Size 3 when we begin to build our second worker.
With no less than three 5F1H, I think we'll be in good shape to whip the city down to 2/3 pop every 10 turns.
On the other hand, with a happiness cap of 6 with the silver (needs The Wheel), we can work 1 deer, the silver, and 4 GrassHill Mines at break-even levels (16H including the city). With Writing, we can work 2 deer, the silver, a GrassHill Mine, and two scientists -- which I think is the way to go for some crazy early research.
I would probably NOT whip here unless it was for the last unit before a military rush. Especially if we're wonder-building (Industrious, Marble), we'll want the
output of a pop 6 city.
I'm taking a short break. Feel free to post any course corrections!
EDIT: The eastern-most Dye is in Portugese territory. I'd place his capital 2E1N of that.
Turn 2 - Pop a hut for 79 gold.
Turn 4 - Meet a neighbour:
I don't really know much about Joao's personality. Can someone give us an overview?
Turn 7 - Hunting completes, start on Mining. (8 turns)
Turn 9 - Meet our second neighbour:
So I'm guessing we have Joao to our east and Liz to our south.
Turn 11 - Hinduism is FIDL. Clearly, we have at least one spiritual civ.
Turn 12 - Our worker completes. I send him to the adjacent deer tile and start on a warrior. He will complete in 8 turns, which is currently when Washington will grow to Size 2, though that will be accelerated by the deer. I'm thinking that we're going to be Size 3 when we begin to build our second worker.
With no less than three 5F1H, I think we'll be in good shape to whip the city down to 2/3 pop every 10 turns.
On the other hand, with a happiness cap of 6 with the silver (needs The Wheel), we can work 1 deer, the silver, and 4 GrassHill Mines at break-even levels (16H including the city). With Writing, we can work 2 deer, the silver, a GrassHill Mine, and two scientists -- which I think is the way to go for some crazy early research.
I would probably NOT whip here unless it was for the last unit before a military rush. Especially if we're wonder-building (Industrious, Marble), we'll want the
output of a pop 6 city.I'm taking a short break. Feel free to post any course corrections!
EDIT: The eastern-most Dye is in Portugese territory. I'd place his capital 2E1N of that.
quill18
Warlord
Turn 13
His scout is to our SE.
Turn 14 - Buddhism is founded. Turn 14? Think that's a non-spiritual civ that beelined through Mysticism maybe?
Turn 15 - Mining comes in, we start on BW (15 turns).
Turn 17 - Camp completes, I send my worker to mine the silver.
Turn 19 - Warrior completes. Washington will hit Size 3 in 3 turns, warrior will take 5. I queue one up anyway -- I'll let it finish and then start our worker partway into Size 3. Good? Bad? This warrior is heading east to explore the land near Joao.
Turn 22 - Joao adopts Slavery (we have 8 turns to BW).
Washington hits Size 3. A slight reconfiguration shaves a turn off the warrior build.
IBT: A bear almost makes a snack of Warrior #2 (survives with 0.3). I'm renaming him Paul Jr. Warrior #1 becomes Paul Sr.
Turn 23 - Our 3rd warrior (Mickey) completes this turn. The mine is also completed. Despite the slightly lowered productivity, our worker will complete in 6 turns whether we work the mine or the deer. The silver shaves 2 turns off BW, yay!
I send Mickey to explore the spit of land to our NW. I want to keep him close for defense.
Turn 27 - Paul Sr. also survives a bear fight with .3 health, and earns his Woodsmen I promotion.
Turn 28 - BW comes in. Drumroll, please.......
Interesting... 1NW of the copper would give us a river city with access to Deer, Copper, and PIGS -- one of the few bonus health resources available. (We can also get fish relatively close to our capital, but it's not ideal.)
EDIT: Yes, the INDUSTRIOUS De Gaulle has Marble in hit BFC. ARG!!!!!! Marble wonders will not be an auto-win for us.
This would be my early dotmap:
Research is set to Masonry.
Rest of the turnset will be played/posted soon...
His scout is to our SE.
Turn 14 - Buddhism is founded. Turn 14? Think that's a non-spiritual civ that beelined through Mysticism maybe?
Turn 15 - Mining comes in, we start on BW (15 turns).
Turn 17 - Camp completes, I send my worker to mine the silver.
Turn 19 - Warrior completes. Washington will hit Size 3 in 3 turns, warrior will take 5. I queue one up anyway -- I'll let it finish and then start our worker partway into Size 3. Good? Bad? This warrior is heading east to explore the land near Joao.
Turn 22 - Joao adopts Slavery (we have 8 turns to BW).
Washington hits Size 3. A slight reconfiguration shaves a turn off the warrior build.
IBT: A bear almost makes a snack of Warrior #2 (survives with 0.3). I'm renaming him Paul Jr. Warrior #1 becomes Paul Sr.
Turn 23 - Our 3rd warrior (Mickey) completes this turn. The mine is also completed. Despite the slightly lowered productivity, our worker will complete in 6 turns whether we work the mine or the deer. The silver shaves 2 turns off BW, yay!
I send Mickey to explore the spit of land to our NW. I want to keep him close for defense.
Turn 27 - Paul Sr. also survives a bear fight with .3 health, and earns his Woodsmen I promotion.
Turn 28 - BW comes in. Drumroll, please.......
Interesting... 1NW of the copper would give us a river city with access to Deer, Copper, and PIGS -- one of the few bonus health resources available. (We can also get fish relatively close to our capital, but it's not ideal.)
EDIT: Yes, the INDUSTRIOUS De Gaulle has Marble in hit BFC. ARG!!!!!! Marble wonders will not be an auto-win for us.
This would be my early dotmap:
Research is set to Masonry.
Rest of the turnset will be played/posted soon...
quill18
Warlord
Turn 29 - Our second worker completes. We're still 6 turns from completing Masonry...
I adopt Slavery and start another warrior. I'm going to let Washington grow to 4 -- it should be able to work Deer/Silver/Mine/Mine after the chops come in and help finish the GW quickly if it we need more. Additionally, the next player will have the option of 
a settler to help us rapidly claim the copper and/or marble.
I'm still opposed to regular whipping, but rushing 1 or 2 settlers will be pretty significant.
Turn 30 - Anarchy ends. Deer camp completes. Warrior due in 3, growth in 4. Masonry still in 6.
Turn 31
She has founded Hinduism.
Turn 32
Turn 33 - Warrior completes. I send him to guard/fogbust the copper site. NOTE: Our capital has no defense yet, and will also have a happy cap of 4 due to this.
I start a barracks to allow Washington to grow.
Turn 34 - Queue a settler to get a few hammers into him. Masonry due in 2, first chop due in 3.
Turn 36
I queue up The Wheel next. I know the early discussion revolved around Archery, but I feel that we can grab Copper and defend with Axemen instead, which should be better vs. barbs AND give us offensive options as well. Also, we clearly need roads for the marble -- and sooner rather than later, as De Gaulle was hooking up the marble when last I saw it.
I queue up the Great Wall.
I recall Mickey since our happiness cap is 4 right now and we're due to grow.
Turn 37 - I meet the 6th (final?) AI:
EDIT: Note that he founded Buddhism.
A barbarian warrior is screwing around near the copper city site.
Turn 40 - The end of my turnset.
Washington will grow to 5 *and* complete the GW next turn:
Our settler has some in it already (as does the barracks). I wouldn't be opposed to him out for 2 pop and then completing another settler naturally right after. I think we have enough time to snag the copper and the marble cities before going on a run to the Oracle.
However, if we're paranoid I would whip out the settler, build a worker, settle the marble site and get it hooked up while we pre-chop around Washington.
De Gaulle WILL be some kind of competitor for the Oracle, unless we get a hint that he's following another path.
I hope I didn't screw up any plans for the Temple of Artemis by going for The Wheel before the religious techs. Although I'm not 100% sure the Temple is worth rushing too. I'd rather see us claim the copper and marble sites and just nab the Oracle. Since the french have marble, the Temple may just be out of reach no matter what we do.
Sorry that the exploration slowed so much. The bear attacks have been harsh...
I adopt Slavery and start another warrior. I'm going to let Washington grow to 4 -- it should be able to work Deer/Silver/Mine/Mine after the chops come in and help finish the GW quickly if it we need more
. Additionally, the next player will have the option of a settler to help us rapidly claim the copper and/or marble.I'm still opposed to regular whipping, but rushing 1 or 2 settlers will be pretty significant.
Turn 30 - Anarchy ends. Deer camp completes. Warrior due in 3, growth in 4. Masonry still in 6.
Turn 31
She has founded Hinduism.
Turn 32
Turn 33 - Warrior completes. I send him to guard/fogbust the copper site. NOTE: Our capital has no defense yet, and will also have a happy cap of 4 due to this.
I start a barracks to allow Washington to grow.
Turn 34 - Queue a settler to get a few hammers into him. Masonry due in 2, first chop due in 3.
Turn 36
I queue up The Wheel next. I know the early discussion revolved around Archery, but I feel that we can grab Copper and defend with Axemen instead, which should be better vs. barbs AND give us offensive options as well. Also, we clearly need roads for the marble -- and sooner rather than later, as De Gaulle was hooking up the marble when last I saw it.
I queue up the Great Wall.
I recall Mickey since our happiness cap is 4 right now and we're due to grow.
Turn 37 - I meet the 6th (final?) AI:
EDIT: Note that he founded Buddhism.
A barbarian warrior is screwing around near the copper city site.
Turn 40 - The end of my turnset.
Washington will grow to 5 *and* complete the GW next turn:
Our settler has some
in it already (as does the barracks). I wouldn't be opposed to him out for 2 pop and then completing another settler naturally right after. I think we have enough time to snag the copper and the marble cities before going on a run to the Oracle.However, if we're paranoid I would whip out the settler, build a worker, settle the marble site and get it hooked up while we pre-chop around Washington.
De Gaulle WILL be some kind of competitor for the Oracle, unless we get a hint that he's following another path.
I hope I didn't screw up any plans for the Temple of Artemis by going for The Wheel before the religious techs. Although I'm not 100% sure the Temple is worth rushing too. I'd rather see us claim the copper and marble sites and just nab the Oracle. Since the french have marble, the Temple may just be out of reach no matter what we do.
Sorry that the exploration slowed so much. The bear attacks have been harsh...
TheLastOne36
Deity
- Joined
- Jan 17, 2007
- Messages
- 14,045
lurker's comment: Joao is a serious rexer and his traits reflect that. Also i thought Happy resources were rare you have Spices near you. no one is gonna take copper site for some time. It may be worth it to rex Marble site and a Spice site before Joao.
lurker out
lurker out
Admiral Kutzov
Idiot Emeritus
Nice! 
The warrior names were a nice touch. 
Joao is a pain in the posterior. He REX's like a madman.
By completing the GW, we can skip archery for awhile.
I turn on the brain cell and it recommends we REX marble and copper cities. ToA is icing on the cake which is of course oracle. That would probably take us through to the next set. Remember, I'm a noob on emperor.
Not too worried about the spices at this point. Joao is looking like the first victim anyway. Do we want to hook up the copper and try to axe Joao.
I'd like to see were all the AI homelands are. If Izzy is relatively close, we may want to open our borders and snuggle up while she sends us hindu missionaries (that's prolly a debate best left for later; I just wanted to plant a seed). EDIT: Pun unintended.
Given all the food on the map, do we want to chop some libraries and run SE early on?
Roster Check
quill18 - got us a fast start out of the gate
wenz - up, allow some time for comment by the smart people (i.e. everyone but me and igor)
trynthlas - on deck
pigswill - dreaming of swooping from the sky
AK - discussing with igor, recruiting
open -
The warrior names were a nice touch. Joao is a pain in the posterior. He REX's like a madman.
By completing the GW, we can skip archery for awhile.
I turn on the brain cell and it recommends we REX marble and copper cities. ToA is icing on the cake which is of course oracle. That would probably take us through to the next set. Remember, I'm a noob on emperor.
Not too worried about the spices at this point. Joao is looking like the first victim anyway. Do we want to hook up the copper and try to axe Joao.
I'd like to see were all the AI homelands are. If Izzy is relatively close, we may want to open our borders and snuggle up while she sends us hindu missionaries (that's prolly a debate best left for later; I just wanted to plant a seed). EDIT: Pun unintended.
Given all the food on the map, do we want to chop some libraries and run SE early on?
Roster Check
quill18 - got us a fast start out of the gate
wenz - up, allow some time for comment by the smart people (i.e. everyone but me and igor)
trynthlas - on deck
pigswill - dreaming of swooping from the sky
AK - discussing with igor, recruiting
open -
really nice turns, Quill!!
I see it, but will wait for some comments..
How many turns I am supposed to take?
Which city would You like to built first, marble or copper?
As we have the wall in our bag I see one of the game goals completed, any other wonder is a bonus in my humble view...
Arboria maps tend to have fewer build options than usual, that means we will have nothing but units to build, do I hear early rush anywhere??
edit: PS. sorry for bad english..
I see it, but will wait for some comments..
How many turns I am supposed to take?
Which city would You like to built first, marble or copper?
As we have the wall in our bag I see one of the game goals completed, any other wonder is a bonus in my humble view...
Arboria maps tend to have fewer build options than usual, that means we will have nothing but units to build, do I hear early rush anywhere??
edit: PS. sorry for bad english..
pigswill
fly (one day)
Not sure about the maths of whipping a settler for 2 pop tho the chances are that by the time we regrow the whip misery will have passed. If we whip a settler then build a settler we won't be regrowing so it might be quicker to build them straight. Next job for a worker is to connect the silver for an extra happy. Maybe we build a settler straight, send him to copper site (coz given a choice I'd rather have copper than marble) and get copper city chopping for Oracle straight away while capital focusses on settler and worker. Techwise it would mean beelining priesthood straight away. There is a risk that protective civs seem to beeline feudalism which might well get them beelining priesthood so Oracle is certainly not a given.
Admiral Kutzov
Idiot Emeritus
I think I'm going to whine and beg for at least 3 REX'd cities.
I think an ax rush at Joao sounds fine, but I'd also like the Oracle. I don't mind if we use it on MC or COL. Team decision.
I found this for a 3rd REX city.
on an aboria map, we shouldn't pass this up.
I'm leaning toward COL from the oracle because we will need the cash from the CHs
I'd rather chop than whip at this point.
@wenz, run with it about noon your time. That should give everyone time to comment.
@all, if you know someone who has good sense of humor, invite them. Looking for one more.
@wenz -
I think an ax rush at Joao sounds fine, but I'd also like the Oracle. I don't mind if we use it on MC or COL. Team decision.
I found this for a 3rd REX city.
I'm leaning toward COL from the oracle because we will need the cash from the CHs
I'd rather chop than whip at this point.
@wenz, run with it about noon your time. That should give everyone time to comment.
@all, if you know someone who has good sense of humor, invite them. Looking for one more.
@wenz -
I don't apologize for mine, so you don't have to apologize for yours. yours is arguably better than mine.
quill18
Warlord
This is 100% my thinking. Priority is the two city sites, and Oracle.
Seems like the way to go to me.
EDIT: I also support AK's Folly as a 3rd REX city if circumstances allow it.
I support skipping the whip. I was presenting options, but I really do think avoiding it is the way to go. (Except maybe for rushing out the final units of an assault.)
As far as the free tech, my gut is saying CoL, but I don't have a compelling argument for why.
Just took a look at the save , nice start so far 
I agree with AK on the game plan , the AI's are close and Joao is a nice victim for a axe rush.
If I read his borders correctly he already build a city 3 tiles east + 1 north of the proposed marble spot .
I would also REX 3 city's fast , copper city first followed by marble city ( but I would move it 2N 1W yes its heavy overlap with the capital but it will have less overlap with the city from Joao that we will capture if we plan on taking him out.
And the third city is the AKs folly city .
With my marble city we also wont waste any tiles between that clam city and the marble city while otherwise there would be 6 tiles wasted.
I would also whip the settlers , if we whip at 5 and work 2 deers+silver followed by 2 deers + silver + gras hill we will get to 5 again in 9 or 10 turns , just enough for the whip anger to warn off , we get the city's up faster and we will have to be fast to get that clam city before joao does.
I agree with AK on the game plan , the AI's are close and Joao is a nice victim for a axe rush.
If I read his borders correctly he already build a city 3 tiles east + 1 north of the proposed marble spot .
I would also REX 3 city's fast , copper city first followed by marble city ( but I would move it 2N 1W yes its heavy overlap with the capital but it will have less overlap with the city from Joao that we will capture if we plan on taking him out.
And the third city is the AKs folly city .
With my marble city we also wont waste any tiles between that clam city and the marble city while otherwise there would be 6 tiles wasted.
I would also whip the settlers , if we whip at 5 and work 2 deers+silver followed by 2 deers + silver + gras hill we will get to 5 again in 9 or 10 turns , just enough for the whip anger to warn off , we get the city's up faster and we will have to be fast to get that clam city before joao does.
Just curious, because it's a bit out of my normal range of accomplishments, but how exactly will we juggle the goals of an oracle slingshot, an axe rush, and REXing at the same time?
I'm going to assume the AI started with some archers, and Joao probably has two in the capitol (if not more) and will shortly have two in his second city as well, meaning we're going to need a good number of axes to pull off any kind of successful rush. Please educate, as I will surely give it my best shot when my turn comes up, but it would be good to have some direction!
I'm going to assume the AI started with some archers, and Joao probably has two in the capitol (if not more) and will shortly have two in his second city as well, meaning we're going to need a good number of axes to pull off any kind of successful rush. Please educate, as I will surely give it my best shot when my turn comes up, but it would be good to have some direction!
Admiral Kutzov
Idiot Emeritus
shadzy has adopted us. I think the debate is down to marble or copper first and why.
and just to complicate things, i think we'll need some more workers. Wenz knows which end is up, so lets make it easy. Copper or marble first?
I turned the brain cell on again (I'll prolly have to replace it soon with all this heavy use. )
I think we grab marble city. road and quarry like bunnies. then we grab copper. road and mine like bunnies. Somewhere in there we chop oracle after we learn the appropriate techs. then we rush joao. I'm insane. need more input from the team.
chop, chop and then chop more. shadzy, a dotmap about you're thinking would really help me. I've been thinking wide spacing, if we're going compact I'd like understanding.
Roster Check
quill18 - got us a fast start out of the gate
wenz - up, allow some time for comment by the smart people (i.e. everyone but me and igor)
trynthlas - on deck
pigswill - dreaming of swooping from the sky
AK - discussing with igor
shadzy19 - adopted us in spite of the warning labels.
Your wish is my command master 
Primary city's are yellow (copper) , red (marble) and green (clam+deer)
The problem with red dot is that it needs a border pop to work its deers.
Purple can have 2 roles : support city for washington so it would work cottages only and give them to washington later or it could work 2 deer and support 2 scientists and still grow the cottages.
Priesthood is about 20~ turns away atm , if we plan to axe rush we are gonna need copper online asap .
The thing im questioning is do we really need that marble up ?
If we are size 6 and work 4 hills the silver and a deer we produce 16h/turn (24h to wonders) coupled with some overflow we build the oracle in 6 turns without marble .
If we go the whip settlers route we will offcourse be around size 4-5 so thats a few additional turns unless we chop 2 trees or something , with 2 chops we can get the oracle in about 5 turns .
At size 6 with marble we would get 40h/turn so we can build it in 4 turns.
I just fear that De Gaulle will build it before we even have priesthood!
Primary city's are yellow (copper) , red (marble) and green (clam+deer)
The problem with red dot is that it needs a border pop to work its deers.
Purple can have 2 roles : support city for washington so it would work cottages only and give them to washington later or it could work 2 deer and support 2 scientists and still grow the cottages.
Priesthood is about 20~ turns away atm , if we plan to axe rush we are gonna need copper online asap .
The thing im questioning is do we really need that marble up ?
If we are size 6 and work 4 hills the silver and a deer we produce 16h/turn (24h to wonders) coupled with some overflow we build the oracle in 6 turns without marble .
If we go the whip settlers route we will offcourse be around size 4-5 so thats a few additional turns unless we chop 2 trees or something , with 2 chops we can get the oracle in about 5 turns .
At size 6 with marble we would get 40h/turn so we can build it in 4 turns.
I just fear that De Gaulle will build it before we even have priesthood!
quill18
Warlord
I have a VERY strong dislike for Shadzy's proposed marble city.
If we don't like the overlap with Joao, why is the overlap with the capital okay? We're also giving up fresh water AND a food resource on a health-poor maptype.
I propose an alternate solution: Raze the offensive Portugese city.
I think the plan should be to grab copper, marble, build oracle while making Axes elsewhere, and then hit Joao.
If we don't like the overlap with Joao, why is the overlap with the capital okay? We're also giving up fresh water AND a food resource on a health-poor maptype.
I propose an alternate solution: Raze the offensive Portugese city.
I think the plan should be to grab copper, marble, build oracle while making Axes elsewhere, and then hit Joao.
preflight check: only one turn till great wall AND size 5, all units are moved, nothing to do in foreign relations, press enter!
turn 1: GW is built, I allow myself a brownie for that
on a more serious note: I will build the marble city first on the original spot. It is a much better place. Those pesky portugeese wont change our plans!
turn 2: Wheel is in, research is set to mysticism -> polytheism (for future marble wonders) -> priesthood. Sir Paul wins aggainst a barb warrior and earns his woodsman II promo.
turn 7: marble city (new york) is founded, starts on a monument
turn 9 & 10: Isabella founds Judaism and adopts org. rel, but stays hindu for now. Sir Paul defends against an archer.
Silver is connected.
turn 11: Thucydides sasy:
turn 13: settler is ready, marble connected and poly comes in: I thought hard about putting some hammers into arthemis temple, but decided against it for now. I really like it, as it gives 5 GPP, but I wanted to leave all options open for the team (rexxing/rushing)
turn 15: copper city (boston) is founded, starts on an obelisk. I´m sorry not naming the cities, it´s too early to think of something funny, next player can rename em after choppers or so..
Sir Pauls new intel:
turn 17: priesthood comes and New York finishes its monument.
I stop here as its a good point for discussion.
This is why I think our capitol is a good worker/settler pump:
The oracle would be built too fast here, so I propose to chop it in New York while researching pottery or writing as pretechs for something useful.
This would also be a good way to fight portugeese culture here.
Greetings form america:
turn 1: GW is built, I allow myself a brownie for that
on a more serious note: I will build the marble city first on the original spot. It is a much better place. Those pesky portugeese wont change our plans!
turn 2: Wheel is in, research is set to mysticism -> polytheism (for future marble wonders) -> priesthood. Sir Paul wins aggainst a barb warrior and earns his woodsman II promo.
turn 7: marble city (new york) is founded, starts on a monument
turn 9 & 10: Isabella founds Judaism and adopts org. rel, but stays hindu for now. Sir Paul defends against an archer.
Silver is connected.turn 11: Thucydides sasy:
Spoiler :
turn 13: settler is ready, marble connected and poly comes in: I thought hard about putting some hammers into arthemis temple, but decided against it for now. I really like it, as it gives 5 GPP, but I wanted to leave all options open for the team (rexxing/rushing)
turn 15: copper city (boston) is founded, starts on an obelisk. I´m sorry not naming the cities, it´s too early to think of something funny, next player can rename em after choppers or so..
Sir Pauls new intel:
Spoiler :
turn 17: priesthood comes and New York finishes its monument.
I stop here as its a good point for discussion.
This is why I think our capitol is a good worker/settler pump:
The oracle would be built too fast here, so I propose to chop it in New York while researching pottery or writing as pretechs for something useful.
This would also be a good way to fight portugeese culture here.
Greetings form america:
after action thoughts:
nobody signed open borders so I think no one has writing yet.
I would take Metal Casting with Oracle:
- it´s worth more beakers, we can research CoL manually
- those extra hammers from cheap and early forges will go a long way AND give extra happy with silver
- I wouldn´t advice adopting a religion on emperor, this will get us nothing but trouble. So founding Confu has no immediate benefits.
- We took CoL from oracle in AK-01, and I will repeat what I said there: it´s really overdone
nobody signed open borders so I think no one has writing yet.
I would take Metal Casting with Oracle:
- it´s worth more beakers, we can research CoL manually
- those extra hammers from cheap and early forges will go a long way AND give extra happy with silver
- I wouldn´t advice adopting a religion on emperor, this will get us nothing but trouble. So founding Confu has no immediate benefits.
- We took CoL from oracle in AK-01, and I will repeat what I said there: it´s really overdone
pigswill
fly (one day)
While CoL slingshot is overdone I would be concerned about city maintenance at Emperor (possibly city maintenance is something I worry about too much) which will start eating into our research budget once the new cities start growing. On the other hand MC gives us forges for extra production (and GE points if required). IIRC we're industrious and organised so both buildings are half price so that's not a decider.