Ancient Sid SGL?!?!

[Pluto]

Playing a Sid game as the French with standard size random map (appears to be archipeligo), max number of random civs, random barbs.

When I discovered Mathematics, I popped a SGL. I've never considered what to do in this situation (safe to say, it's never happened to me before). I could rush the Temple of Artemis or the Great Lighthouse right now or wait until I get Literature, which I can research in about 40 turns. The problem is that I'm at war with the Americans and could use a quick MGL, and I believe having a leader will prevent me from getting another. I'm currently tied for the tech lead, with 6 techs (including Republic or Monarchy and Lit) left in the ancient age.

I have contact with all but one civ, and don't think the Great Lighthouse will help me here.

I'm not too crazy about the ToA either - if I was playing on a lower level, I might go for a 100K culture win since I've never actually done that, but that's not going to happen here unless I get domination or conquest first. It's probably real boring anyway. On the plus side, the extra culture could help me if I can take down some American cities and it would get the leader out of there so I can maybe get a MGL.

Waiting for the Great Library would ensure me tech parity until Education. That's pretty good, especially since I could get Gunpowder sooner than I would otherwise. However, I'm already at tech parity and might be able to maintain it for a little while longer, it won't get me that many techs, and will prevent me from getting a MGL in the meantime.


I'm leaning toward the Great Library. Any advice?

 

[Pentium]

I guess you're going for conquest victory, like most of the people who try Sid. If that's so, I'd rather rush the ToA, so you get free culture in every city. That means you can be more confident in taking cities, because you know you'll get a border expansion quickly.

Those stacks look both dangerous and MGL-full. So my advise is to use the SGL right now.

 

[Bucephalus]

I'm afraid I couldn't beat Sid if my life depended on it, so I can't offer any advice as such. However I can tell you that it is possible to have two leaders at once. I have had two SGL's, and a SGL with a MGL. Hope that helps.

 

[Pentium]

I haven's beaten Sid as well, but I've been as little as 7 turns (or a SGL) away from building the UN.

IIRC, you can get a SGL any time, but you can't get a MGL if you have any GL, military or scientific one.

Edit: Also, you can quite easily build the GL without a SGL. The AI will ignore Literature until very late, and by then you can build it from scratch.

 

[ac196nataku]

Blah. I was going to say Pyramids until I realized it was islands. Umm, I would guess that the GL would be best considering the tech differences on Sid. How useful would Lighthouse be? From your map it looks like you can get everywhere without risking things in Sea tiles...

 

[SimpleMonkey]

I'd say ToA for the culture expansion. It's pretty good warmonger's wonder, actually.

Good luck taking out Abe! Letting him throw troops at you should net you a MGL pretty soon, and holding on to an SGL will keep one from popping up. MGL will not prevent an SJL from showing up,though, IIRC.

 

[vmxa]

I would take the Lighthouse if this is an island. That could make life so much easier. You will not be able to stay in the culture race anyway, so no real need for the ToA.

Getting the GLIB is not hard, even at Sid. I get it most of the time, even when I am not first to Philo as the AI will seldom go for Lit right away and won't have a large city to build the wonder.

 

[Offa]

Lucky you. Build the Great Library in a small unproductive town. Gift it away just before you learn education and recapture it as late as you dare (see Sir Pleb's HOF game).

 

[zerksees]

I agree with what Offa said.

I was under the impression you could have an SGL and MGL at the same time, though I have never experienced that.

Tech parity is doable, but with the GLib in a worthless town you can take it back later and get a ton of techs for free. This frees up gold for other things like unit upgrades/unit support. Use the 40 turns to build up some more elite units.

 

[vmxa]

You can have both at once, IF you had the MGL first. The reason is no check is made for SGL, so you can have as many SGL and MGL as you want.

Well of course you can never have more than one MGL as there is a check for leaders before generating an MGL. So that means only one MGL at a time and none if you already had an SGL.

 

[Desertsnow]

At my (current) level of competence, I wouldn't touch Sid with a ten-foot mouse-click, so I don't know if my advice is any good, but I do love the Great Library. Its culture value is no great deal (2 per turn) but it lets me keep tech parity up until the mid-medieval age at least, so I can concentrate more on happiness or military or expansion whatever my empire needs.

 

[vmxa]

In a nutshell the GL is great for Sid and AW games and maybe some other variants. May be useful at deity, least useful at DG and probably not worth it on lower levels all things considered.

The lower the level the less it can contribute.