Are there seriously no land-unit transports in CiV?

[OTAKUjbski]

So I'm sitting here in the Modern Era with Fighters, Tanks & Infantry.

I get bored with the happy family I have going on with my neighbours and decide I want to crack some skulls overseas.

So, I change the production in my 'shipyard' city and ... um ... I can build Destroyers, Submarines, and Carriers but no Transport.

Figuring I missed a tech somewhere along the way, I begin scouring the Tech Tree, but there is no transport!


Am I missing something here?

Does Firaxis really expect us to move 5k+ worth of defenseless embarked troops at a paltry rate of 4 movement with only 1UpT?

If this is true, I feel like it makes Pre-Industrial overseas warfare a bit .

 

[mrt144]

So I'm sitting here in the Modern Era with Fighters, Tanks & Infantry.

I get bored with the happy family I have going on with my neighbours and decide I want to crack some skulls overseas.

So, I change the production in my 'shipyard' city and ... um ... I can build Destroyers, Submarines, and Carriers but no Transport.

Figuring I missed a tech somewhere along the way, I begin scouring the Tech Tree, but there is no transport!


Am I missing something here?

Does Firaxis really expect us to move 5k+ worth of defenseless embarked troops at a paltry rate of 4 movement with only 1UpT?

If this is true, I feel like it makes Pre-Industrial overseas warfare a bit .

You've been gone too long man!

 

[duxup]

Overseas invasions are not easy, nor should they be.

Also transports were a PIA.

 

[Danei]

The whole reason for embarkment being in the game was to eliminate the tedium of needing transports. I don't see why anyone expected there'd be both.

 

[Tale]

Did I just see someone describe 4 movement as paltry? I guess I'm missing out with all my 2 movement units for most of the game.

 

[mattcrwi]

its true and many people have talked about it here. Some people have trouble adjusting to the new system, some are calling for its complete removal (I want civ 4 whiners) others like the way it is and others still propose slight adjustments like one non combat unit can be on a tile with a naval combat unit (like workers on land).

 

[dexters]

Loved that there are no transports. Its aces.

It also makes your individual units as vulnerable as before.

 

[dannythefool]

In theory this would make for greatly enhanced naval gameplay because you have to win the sea before you can use it to transport your troops across.

In practice however, the AI often doesn't put up a fight, so you don't get anything in return for the work you invest in protecting your units... which might explain why it could seem a bit bland.

 

[Doctor Phibes]

Dropping the need for transports is one of the very few things I like about Civ5, I must say. Getting rid of all that loading and unloading, shuffling an extra unit around just to transport others etc etc. One problem though is that I think these should be stackable, exempt from the 1upt, together with a naval escort, so that you can move the whole block in one go.

But - you could have both. It is true that troop transports were often slow and highly vulnerable, but when big liners like the Queen Elizabeth and Queen Mary were used in WW2, they didn't need escorts, they outran everything including U-boats. So perhaps a fast transport unit you can load and unload to? (Though personally, I wouldn't build it, because it's a waste of moves on building and then there's the maintenance cost.)

 

[Windsor]

Does Firaxis really expect us to move 5k+ worth of defenseless embarked troops at a paltry rate of 4 movement with only 1UpT?

2upt - One civilian(including embarked military units) and one military

 

[Sonereal]

2upt - One civilian(including embarked military units) and one military

Embarked military units count as civilians?

Because they count as military still in the games I've been playing.

 

[giffy]

2upt - One civilian(including embarked military units) and one military

This would make it a lot better in my mind. It is a pain to move across the sea because navel units have so many more movement points than embarked units. Plus the visibility range is somewhat limited.

Mostly though its not that the AI picks off my units its that I can so easy take out theirs. a couple destroyers or subs and I can defeat an entire invading army without breaking a sweat.

Boring.

 

[Windsor]

Embarked military units count as civilians?

Because they count as military still in the games I've been playing.

ehm for some reason I was sure you could stack those But you are of course right.

 

[jfuesting]

Embarked military units count as civilians?

Because they count as military still in the games I've been playing.

Mine too. I recall reading somewhere before release that embarked units could be stacked with each other. I may be delirious and misremembering.

 

[zonk]

I'm growing more and more anti-embark...

For one thing, it really nerfs navies to the extent that they become pointless. I'm still using caravels in the modern age to blast embarked AI units because - what's the point in upgrading? I just run and hide in the rare instances where an actual AI naval vessel shows up.

It also makes cross-ocean exploration a lot, lot less fun -- ruins terra maps for me... Building that first caravel was a real achievement in previous iterations - and it added a second exploration phase. You then had to tech up to the appropriate galleon tech, too -- in order to get settlers and such across the ocean.

Now - pop astronomy and send anything and everything everywhere....

As for the "transports were tedious" complaints -- are you seriously saying that its LESS tedious to inch 10 individual units across the ocean - and if you're smart, a few escorts? Eliminating some tedious aspect is all well and good - but I'd hardly call replacing it with an entirely new kind of tedium an improvement.

If you're not going to bring back TPs, fine -- then create a "convoy" unit that allows me to move a complete army in a single click. Require some sort of improvement or something.

I'm not one to generally fault a game for "realism" issues - but there's a point where it gets ridiculous, and for me (and apparently, OP) - this is it.

Might as well just get rid of the concept of oceans entirely and just call it "blue land", with limitations like "cannot build cities here", "produces 1 F/1C", and "double/triple movement cost".

 

[jtwood]

Mine too. I recall reading somewhere before release that embarked units could be stacked with each other. I may be delirious and misremembering.

I thought I read that, too.

 

[So?]

I've said it before, the biggest problem with lack of transports is that it makes land bottlenecks meaningless. If you can find a way to make it difficult to cross the english channel while avoiding the need for tedious transport loading, fine. But I think it would be easier to simplify the process of loading and unloading (which was already pretty damn simple IMO)

 

[mrt144]

I've said it before but...
it seems like a lot of Civ 5 was designed out of spite for some of Civ 4's least popular aspects but without any care or thought to the consequences;

1. The alternative to stacks of doom is an ill conceived 1upt that the AI can't use and has none of the tactics one hoped for.
2. The alternative to loading transports is an ill conceived embarking mechanism that doesn't really add anything to the game and creates its own tedium.

 

[Svest]

I thought I read that, too.

You are supposed to be able to stack an embarked unit with a real ship. However I believe there is a bug with this. Probably something to do with not setting and clearing the civilian and military flags properly when it embarks making it count as both a military and a civilian unit.

 

[So?]

You are supposed to be able to stack an embarked units with a real ship. However I believe there is a bug with this. Probably something to do with not setting and clearing the civilian and military flags properly when it embarks making it count as both a military and a civilian unit.

I saw the demo at PAX with 2k and I'm pretty sure they weren't stacking embarked units.