Asset file hinting at future and/or cut content

[queenpea]

(Far) better than than two Americas.

But one is America, and the other one is America (Founder's Edition).

 

[Evie]

Nah, I still prefer sailing the High Seas and hoisting the black flag.

 

[agamemnon_of_the-bronze_]

But if you accept the Chinesse logic, Qing is a *Manchu* civ, not a Chinese one.

(I'm not onboard with it, and I don't want the doublet, just saying, this is the complaint, so any solution that leave Qing the only Chinese civ in modern actually fails to address it).

I'd actually be fine with a Modern Spain DLC, since exploration Spain, much like Prussia, is another case of a civ who is named for one civ but actually designed after their successor/predecessor. In this case, Ex-Spain really is Castille in all but name, so a modern Spain DLC could just easily change the name, add a new civ called Spain in modern, and be done with it.)

(But don't add Atomic to have TWO Spains!)

i would love a modern spain that focuses more on tourism and culture possibly.

 

[Evie]

Modern ends in about 1950, so I'm not sure that design really fit the Modern Spain we're talking about here.Though I'm not sure what I would center Spain'S design on.

It's true that this the Modern period would still include a good chunk of the work on the Sagrada Familia...

 

[agamemnon_of_the-bronze_]

Modern ends in about 1950, so I'm not sure that design really fit the Modern Spain we're talking about here.Though I'm not sure what I would center Spain'S design on.

It's true that this the Modern period would still include a good chunk of the work on the Sagrada Familia...

they could possibly focus it on picasso from a art POV and the spanish civil war as a cultural struggle. that would be a stretch but would really be very flavorful.

 

[Alexander's Hetaroi]

Best we can do is Pirate Republic.

Me: So, remember England, they had Sea Dogs last game and this game they could be unique Great People?
Firaxis: How about instead let's have the Pirate Republic and have Flying Gang Great People?

Modern ends in about 1950, so I'm not sure that design really fit the Modern Spain we're talking about here.Though I'm not sure what I would center Spain'S design on.

It's true that this the Modern period would still include a good chunk of the work on the Sagrada Familia...

What comes to mind when I think of modern Spain is the revolutionary works of artists like Picasso and Salvador Dali. Unfortunately works of art don't currently exist, but even then, I don't see a point in a Modern Spain really based off of that and an unfinished Wonder which might get completed next year.

 

[agamemnon_of_the-bronze_]

Me: So, remember England, they had Sea Dogs last game and this game they could be unique Great People?
Firaxis: How about instead let's have the Pirate Republic and have Flying Gang Great People?

What comes to mind when I think of modern Spain is the revolutionary works of artists like Picasso and Salvador Dali. Unfortunately works of art don't currently exist, but even then, I don't see a point in a Modern Spain really based off of that and an unfinished Wonder which might get completed next year.

i suggested picasso in post above yours. spain as a cultural center would be very cool and a great turn away from imperialist spain.

 

[Evie]

Good catch on Picasso and Dali, I don't know how I forgot them. Probably because despite making the case for 1950 I was more focused on the up to 1900 part of Spanish history.

Though in fairness, the reference to the Sagrada Familia was *also* pointing at more - namely the absolute hotbed of architectural innovation and invention that was Catalonia in the very late nineteenth and early twentieth century, with both Catalan Modernisme and Noucentisme combining (and opposing one another) to become the signature look of Barcelona, and a big part of the tourism draw, of which Gaudi, when he wasn'T setting in motion a century-long project, was an absolutely major actor.

Considering Dali was Catalonian, and Picasso spoke of Barcelona as his true home, I think a general "Barcelonian cultural scene 1880-1940" could actually really work well.

 

[moondog385]

Speaking of that it would be really nice if once they released the Qajar, they would rename Persia to the Achaemenids. Or I wouldn't mind the compromise of the two being Achaemenid Persia and Qajar Persia. At least some consistency would be nice.

And then Sasanian Persia in Exploration

 

[agamemnon_of_the-bronze_]

Good catch on Picasso and Dali, I don't know how I forgot them. Probably because despite making the case for 1950 I was more focused on the up to 1900 part of Spanish history.

Though in fairness, the reference to the Sagrada Familia was *also* pointing at more - namely the absolute hotbed of architectural innovation and invention that was Catalonia in the very late nineteenth and early twentieth century, with both Catalan Modernisme and Noucentisme combining (and opposing one another) to become the signature look of Barcelona, and a big part of the tourism draw, of which Gaudi, when he wasn'T setting in motion a century-long project, was an absolutely major actor.

Considering Dali was Catalonian, and Picasso spoke of Barcelona as his true home, I think a general "Barcelonian cultural scene 1880-1940" could actually really work well.

yes cultural modern spain, would be an instant buy for me. hate playing exploration spain and then have to switch to france or germany.

 

[queenpea]

What comes to mind when I think of modern Spain is the revolutionary works of artists like Picasso and Salvador Dali. Unfortunately works of art don't currently exist, but even then, I don't see a point in a Modern Spain really based off of that and an unfinished Wonder which might get completed next year.

Or they give us a militaristic Spain à la Franco, so we have another fascism-inclined big bully civ to attack us instead of boring old Prussia.

 

[queenpea]

Good catch on Picasso and Dali, I don't know how I forgot them. Probably because despite making the case for 1950 I was more focused on the up to 1900 part of Spanish history.

Though in fairness, the reference to the Sagrada Familia was *also* pointing at more - namely the absolute hotbed of architectural innovation and invention that was Catalonia in the very late nineteenth and early twentieth century, with both Catalan Modernisme and Noucentisme combining (and opposing one another) to become the signature look of Barcelona, and a big part of the tourism draw, of which Gaudi, when he wasn'T setting in motion a century-long project, was an absolutely major actor.

Considering Dali was Catalonian, and Picasso spoke of Barcelona as his true home, I think a general "Barcelonian cultural scene 1880-1940" could actually really work well.

I don’t want this until we have actual great works of art in the game.

 

[TheSpaceCowboy]

(Far) better than than two Americas - it's a clearly distinct entity even if a very short-lived one, and one that I would expect to have fairly unique gameplay in a way a conventional country like the America2 (or France2, UK2, Germany2, Russia2, etc) is is far less likely to.

I'm so tired of the anti-American animus pervading these forums.
American history has been sufficiently impactful on the modern world to justify at least three American civs: Colonial America (Exploration), America (Modern), and United States (Fourth Age)
I'd personally prefer more than that (the Republic of Texas & Dixie), but I'm biased (but in the right direction)

 

[agamemnon_of_the-bronze_]

Or they give us a militaristic Spain à la Franco, so we have another fascism-inclined big bully civ to attack us instead of boring old Prussia.

he is more than willing to go to war, as long as it is against his own people. when it comes to other nations, he observes strict neutrality. he had principles after all

 

[RedCourtJester]

That's putting entirely too much credit into the music theme video.

If the current in-game America was actually supposed to be Colonial America, there'd be *something* Colonial about the design. Instead, it's all about the 1850-1900 period of the United States. It is not in any way, form, or shape "colonial america".

* Chester was written during the revolutionary war, and the orchestration is very much from that era.
* The art background is very clearly depicting revolutionary America
* One of the American leaders is from revolutionary/AoC America period

Not to mention the design pretty broadly covers other parts of American history:

* Industrial Park and Steel Mill - technically as old as pre-revolutionary times (1764 and 1728, respectively)
* Prospectors - gold rushes occurred 1799 (NC), 1829 (GA), 1848-1855 (CA).
* Frontier Expansion - started as early as 1804-ish.
* Yankee Ingenuity - coined 1817-ish surrounding construction of the Erie Canal.
* Railyard - 1826-ish.
* Captains of Industry - coined by Thomas Carlyle 1833 and fleshed out 1843.
* Robber Barons - somewhere around 1865 -1914, give or take.
* Statue of Liberty - 1886.
* Marines - specifically amphibious vehicles seem to only go back as far as 1935.

I could be wrong about some of these numbers, but even though you could say a lot of the ideas in VII America coincide best around the late 19th century, it pulls pretty much from every time period from the colonies to WW2.

 

[agamemnon_of_the-bronze_]

I'm so tired of the anti-American animus pervading these forums.
American history has been sufficiently impactful on the modern world to justify at least three American civs: Colonial America (Exploration), America (Modern), and United States (Fourth Age)
I'd personally prefer more than that (the Republic of Texas & Dixie), but I'm biased (but in the right direction)

i think a scientific california civ would be fun and would sell well to be fair.

 

[RedCourtJester]

I'm so tired of the anti-American animus pervading these forums.
American history has been sufficiently impactful on the modern world to justify at least three American civs: Colonial America (Exploration), America (Modern), and United States (Fourth Age)
I'd personally prefer more than that (the Republic of Texas & Dixie), but I'm biased (but in the right direction)

No.

 

[Pokarnor]

I'm so tired of the anti-American animus pervading these forums.
American history has been sufficiently impactful on the modern world to justify at least three American civs: Colonial America (Exploration), America (Modern), and United States (Fourth Age)
I'd personally prefer more than that (the Republic of Texas & Dixie), but I'm biased (but in the right direction)

Maybe it's no longer quite as good an argument since Civ has gotten quite specific about civ identities in the game, but in general I would argue that Texas and the Confederacy were both just part of the "American civilization", in a similar way to how Athens and Sparta are both part of the Greek civilization despite being independent polities who even waged war against each other repeatedly. Regardless I don't expect either Texas or especially the CSA to ever be included in the game, for a variety of reasons ranging from lack of historical relevance to lack of interest to controversy. Having more than one America is certainly possible and even sensible if they do add a fourth age (three Americas is a stretch IMO), but I think the concern here (which I share) is whether they've made the existing civ in such a way it will be satisfactorily distinct from a potential Atomic Age American civ.

 

[Evie]

1. We've already established the music designer went for a colonial theme, which has precisely no meaning as to the civilization design.
2. Fine, I'll grant that. The art is revolutionary.
3. Leaders are independent from civilizations, so the choice of leader has no bearing on the design of the civilization, and is void of indicative value in trying to understand the civ design.
4. But most associated with the expansion of the great steel mills and indutrial parks of the later Industrial revolution, in the second half of the nineteenth century.
5. But most associated with the California Gold Rush and the conquest of the Far West, in the...second half of the nineteenth century.
6. But most associated with the conquest of the Far West in the second half of the nineteenth century.
7. Fine, Yankee Ingenuity is pretty generic.
8. But most associated with the spread of industrial america, the growth of the transcontinental railroad and the conquest of the Far West in (say it again) and suchlike in the second half of the nineteenth century.
9. But Carlyle was a British man talking about British businessmen. The American use is later and largely synonymous with Robber Barons, a term mostly used of people like Carnegie, Mellon, and of course Rockefeller, in the second half of the nineteenth century.
10. Otherwise largely corresponding with the second half of the nineteenth century.
11. As above.
12. Actually, that's the *one* element of the design that really is universal to the entirety of US history, founded under the Continental Congress, and building their legends (as they say) from the Halls of Montezuma (Assault on Chapultepec Palace, Mexico, 1847) to the Shores of Tripoli (Barbary War, 1805), and onward to the shores of Veracruz (1914), the depths of Belleau Wood (1918) and, of course, in their most famous moment of all, the summit of Suribachi (Iwo Jima, 1945). They really would fit any American design.

Yes, taken alone many of those elements would fit into other designs. But they're not being fitted into other designs. They're being put together, and adding them together...that's as clearly as it can be a Gilded Age/Wild West America between the End of the Civil War and the Start of the First World War.

 

[AD1730]

Watching this whole discussion unfold only bolsters my belief that a medieval age should have been planned for, rather than whatever this post-modern age could potentially be.