Automation

[WeaselSlapper]

The single biggest thing I would like to see improved is automation. I have a severe distaste for micromanaging and I find myself doing far too much of that in Civilization.

Here's a short list of things that could easily be automated that would greatly improve gameplay.

• I would like more of an ability to adjust how automated units, and cities behave.
• One major thing that needs to be fixed is workers set to automate trade routes should not build forts on resources, this is very annoying.
• I would like to be able to set air units to Auto-Recon. As soon as I get physics I have airships patrol my ocean boarders so I detect navy sneak attacks, but I usually stop after a few turns because it's too time consuming.
• Automated workers working around a certain city should look at what that city is focused on, i.e. if a city's focus is set on production workers should build production improvements around that city etc.
• I should be able to set a city production specialization so it builds units and building correctly
• All automated units should be able to find the closest airport and automatically airdrop themselves where they are needed most, before flight if they are no longer needed on a continent they should, un-automate so the user knows to get a transport unit to pick up the worker.
• Automate great people joining cities. They should pop up initially and allow the use to choose how he wants to use that great person and if he chooses to have it join a city, it should be able to pick what city it will be of most benefit.
• Set units to focus on circling the globe

I'm sure there are many other things and I'd love to hear more suggestions.

 

[Camikaze]

I think the idea of having more automation is quite good, so long as it doesn't take away, at all, the ability to do the same thing without automation. With air-recon, that could work quite well with the Ambush idea, and the other ideas could probably be (and should be) remedied quite easily through small changes by the game developers. Also, you might want to take a look at some of the ideas in this automation thread.

 

[Tiepolo]

Auto recon is a brilliant idea. It's ridiculously tedious to click recon every turn and I suppose it shouldn't be that hard to include in the game.

 

[Argetnyx]

What are you babbling on about? That is not 'micromanaging'. Being able to control your units and cities is part of the game. If you automated everything, then what would be left to do? If you want your city to produce more, figure out what is holding it back and fix it. Letting the governor of each city do whatever it likes is a recipe for disaster, they will not make the choices of a player, but choices of an AI. Auto-recon can be a disadvantage in that every turn is used up by the recon mission, and you can't control it to attack the enemy navy because it's already gone. 'Too time consuming', that's what keyboard shortcuts are for.

 

[TheMeInTeam]

What are you babbling on about? That is not 'micromanaging'. Being able to control your units and cities is part of the game. If you automated everything, then what would be left to do? If you want your city to produce more, figure out what is holding it back and fix it. Letting the governor of each city do whatever it likes is a recipe for disaster, they will not make the choices of a player, but choices of an AI. Auto-recon can be a disadvantage in that every turn is used up by the recon mission, and you can't control it to attack the enemy navy because it's already gone. 'Too time consuming', that's what keyboard shortcuts are for.

Babbling can go either way. There are tasks that are done so repeatedly in civ that it'd be understandable to automate them. Telling it to just spam recon to one area is an excellent example. You want it to keep scouting that area, so why not let it keep doing it w/o making an additional 80 commands?

The OP mentions workers building improvements based on city emphasis ----> the game already does this actually, so that's in there. It could be tweaked to be more effective though.

The governor is pretty good at assigning tiles EXCEPT in the case of building wealth and research, where it brain farts and goes into idiot mode. Usually the emphasis button gets you what you want otherwise. And why not? If you want cottages around the city, emphasizing commerce should do that. Not everyone likes the tedious little commands.

I do thing some of the suggestions are a little much. One doesn't pop THAT many great people per game, and their uses are varied, and the algorithm for picking which city to use wouldn't be able to plan ----> not a good idea.

Probably the biggest micro-reducer and simplest would to just make shift, alt, and control work on a consistent basis.

 

[Argetnyx]

Remember that I don't play civ4, anymore. So the fact that keyboard shortcut don't work is new(ish) to me. They work perfectly fine in Civ3...

 

[WeaselSlapper]

Granted I haven't tried to automate workers too much anymore in Civ 4 because the few times I've tried they've not been efficient workers. Sounds like they fixed that with one of the patches/expansions, I'll have to give worker automation another chance.

This is not about keyboard shortcuts its about speed of play (in CIV 3 there was an auto bombard feature, I would like that back too). When I watch the computers units running around during their turn I realize that they have a big advantage because they can scout so much more per turn then I have the patience, or time to do.

It's not that I want to give total control over to the computer, I just want the option to automate tedious tasks that don't involve thought and be able to stop the automation when I what that unit to change tasks. That's why I'm glad the governor is much smarter in this version then previous ones, one less thing for me to micro-manage.

I should have been a little more clear about what kind of automation I wanted for great people. As an example if I decide that I want a great scientist to join a city it should be able to decide what action will give me the most science output per turn. Joining a city as a great scientist or creating an academy in a city. I know that I can figure that out with a trip to the domestic advisor and a calculator, but trying to figure out if adding 6 science to the base of one city or adding 50% to the output of another city is something that the computer could figure out in a second, but an action that takes a person several minutes.

As far as what's left for me to do. Manage diplomicy, trades, military, happiness and all the other things that make the Civilization series challenging. Managing what improvements my workers build and all the other tedious things don't provide the challenge, just take the most time.

 

[TheMeInTeam]

I should have been a little more clear about what kind of automation I wanted for great people. As an example if I decide that I want a great scientist to join a city it should be able to decide what action will give me the most science output per turn. Joining a city as a great scientist or creating an academy in a city. I know that I can figure that out with a trip to the domestic advisor and a calculator

This is beyond the ability of the AI. If you merely want to evaluate which gives a higher yield this turn, it can be done in your head in about 5 seconds after opening up the city screen.

But, if you want to know which is stronger over the course of the game (the relevant consideration), you have to account for future multipliers, trade value of beakers now vs later, and how quickly bulbing gets you to more science multipliers that can be placed everywhere, and future raw output in that city.

If the AI could do that effectively, it wouldn't need bonuses. Hell, few if any human players do *all* of that effectively.

 

[WeaselSlapper]

This is beyond the ability of the AI. If you merely want to evaluate which gives a higher yield this turn, it can be done in your head in about 5 seconds after opening up the city screen.

For one particular city, yes it is fairly easy to figure out which upgrade will yield the most advantages. However, when you have 30+ cities figuring out where to place a great person to get the most benefit can be a great pain.

Of course you can't expect the AI to take future possibilities into consideration and that's not what I'm saying should be done. I'm just saying that it would be easier for the computer to figure out where to put a specialist if I decide that he should be used to join a city instead of bulbing him or hurrying production. I'm not suggesting that great people start automated, just give me an option to allow the computer the figure out the best mathematical place to put a great person.

 

[Argetnyx]

This is not about keyboard shortcuts its about speed of play (in CIV 3 there was an auto bombard feature, I would like that back too). When I watch the computers units running around during their turn I realize that they have a big advantage because they can scout so much more per turn then I have the patience, or time to do.

They took it out? Some advantage, that's just called laziness.

Managing what improvements my workers build and all the other tedious things don't provide the challenge, just take the most time.

Tedious? Not providing challenge? What has civ4 dug up? It may be tedious at times but not all the time. It is much more satisfying to know that you are in complete control than having your workers everywhere doing things that you don't want them to.

By the way, civ4 has overdone the improvement specialization, there is no longer any choice of what you want to build. It's either this, or no resource. Talk about annoying!

Anybody that says gameplay is more important than realism, I have only this to say: Life sucks, deal with it.

 

[exhile]

Granted I haven't tried to automate workers too much anymore in Civ 4 because the few times I've tried they've not been efficient workers. Sounds like they fixed that with one of the patches/expansions, I'll have to give worker automation another chance.

I agree. Even automation in Civ3 was horrible. However, automation is needed once in the late stages of gameplay since there are way too many units to keep track of.

This is not about keyboard shortcuts its about speed of play (in CIV 3 there was an auto bombard feature, I would like that back too). When I watch the computers units running around during their turn I realize that they have a big advantage because they can scout so much more per turn then I have the patience, or time to do.

It's not that I want to give total control over to the computer, I just want the option to automate tedious tasks that don't involve thought and be able to stop the automation when I what that unit to change tasks. That's why I'm glad the governor is much smarter in this version then previous ones, one less thing for me to micro-manage.

I should have been a little more clear about what kind of automation I wanted for great people. As an example if I decide that I want a great scientist to join a city it should be able to decide what action will give me the most science output per turn. Joining a city as a great scientist or creating an academy in a city. I know that I can figure that out with a trip to the domestic advisor and a calculator, but trying to figure out if adding 6 science to the base of one city or adding 50% to the output of another city is something that the computer could figure out in a second, but an action that takes a person several minutes.

As far as what's left for me to do. Manage diplomicy, trades, military, happiness and all the other things that make the Civilization series challenging. Managing what improvements my workers build and all the other tedious things don't provide the challenge, just take the most time.

The automation to move a unit from one tile to another has my blessing since some distances require 3-7 turns. If there was a command in the city screen to designate a completed workboat to automatically go to a tile and catch fish, that would make tasks much easier. The same goes with unit queue or building queue where one city keeps on pumping out Knights every 3-4 turns.

 

[WeaselSlapper]

They took it out? Some advantage, that's just called laziness.

It's not laziness, it's I don't like to waste my time. I don't have forever to play all the time, if I did I would probably agree with you. But when I only have a limited time to play and if I have to waste 15-60 seconds doing tedious tasks it makes playing the game unnecessarily slow and annoying.

Tedious? Not providing challenge? What has civ4 dug up? It may be tedious at times but not all the time. It is much more satisfying to know that you are in complete control than having your workers everywhere doing things that you don't want them to.

Clearly you have a lot of time to devote to video games, I don't. I would like to be able to be in complete control of my units at all times but from a practical standpoint it slows the game down too much and means that I get to do the parts of the game that I enjoy less. I'm not saying they should always be automated all the time, but I am saying that I should have the option to automate more if I choose it. If you want to be "in complete control" just don't press the automate button.

Anybody that says gameplay is more important than realism, I have only this to say: Life sucks, deal with it.

Realism in a video game is an oxy-moron. The entire premise of Civilization is completely unrealistic, but that doesn't stop it from being a fun game. And game play is always just as important as realism. Think about it if a game has amazing graphics but the controls are annoying you're going to hate the game.

 

[Argetnyx]

It's not laziness, it's I don't like to waste my time. I don't have forever to play all the time, if I did I would probably agree with you. But when I only have a limited time to play and if I have to waste 15-60 seconds doing tedious tasks it makes playing the game unnecessarily slow and annoying.

True, sometimes when I'm in a hurry, I automate in Civ3.

Clearly you have a lot of time to devote to video games, I don't. I would like to be able to be in complete control of my units at all times but from a practical standpoint it slows the game down too much and means that I get to do the parts of the game that I enjoy less. I'm not saying they should always be automated all the time, but I am saying that I should have the option to automate more if I choose it.

I do have much time, mostly.

If you want to be "in complete control" just don't press the automate button.

stole my words!

Think about it if a game has amazing graphics but the controls are annoying you're going to hate the game.

Example A: Civilization IV