Blackbetsy HOF Attempts

I may be nearing my population maximum @ 1778 AD / turn 354. Adding about 20 population per turn or so, and CA II has just a handful of cities growing each turn. Research is off, and the lux slider is @ 50% and all my tile working citizens are happy at this point. +91 points per turn the last few turn, up from the low 80's. When I put the data into his calculator, Sir Pleb has us creeping up a bit every turn and we are projected to have over a 21k score at this point, #40 on the histographic chart, and the #2 Large Deity score. I don't think #39 / 22k is going to happen at this point.

I just went through all of the cities that generate culture for me and double checked that I would not get any unwanted cultural expansions. I am 1 tile away from the domination limit, per CA II, and I'm not going to turn a good histographic game into a bad domination one. So we sold off some libraries and temples just to be sure.

1960 tiles and 2597 citizens at this point in 1778, up from 1942 tiles and 2186 citizens in 1745 (turn 339 - 16 turns ago). I didn't search for a maximum domination limit for this game, I just wanted lots of river cows to give myself the best possible start for a win. So I'm completely sure that a better milking strategy would have turned out better, as well as faster conquest. But I'll be honest, I don't know how much quicker I could engage in wars the way I do and do the conquest phase faster. It would require a radical re-thinking of my methodology. My conquest phase this time vs. my 100k game was 6 turns faster (1590 vs. 1620), and I'm sure the first Egyptian war could have been conducted better, but there isn't going to be any 400 AD conquest dates for me.
 
I reached maximum population (2880) about 1820 and now am just dealing with pollution on a turn by turn basis. There is not a single sea tile to grab that wouldn't bring in a new coastal tile, so I'm maxxed all around. Sir Pleb's calculator now has me squeezing over 22,000 points, so its possible I could get the #38 spot on Histographic.

Milking is tedium, and I do wonder what the difference between my city placement is and that of an expert milker. I guess they'd have chosen a map with a better domination limit? At 1876, this seems relatively low for a 60% water Pangaea. I control 1974 tiles, so I have right about 100 sea tiles. I did move some cities off of some flood plains and grasslands, and I do have one city where I wonder whether disbanding it and its population would actually increase my population longer term, or if I would lose tiles. Anyway, when I post my 2050 save, I guess people can look!
 
Is there a way to figure out if it is a 70% or 80% from CivAssist? I don't see any way? I'd have to look at my Mapfinder/XP machine to see what world I had selected.

I know that it's not a *great* score because the Demigod scoring on Large is higher. What is the Demigod score multiplier vs. Deity? Is it 5 vs. 6? Or is it 6 vs. 7? I can't seem to find the scoring chart anywhere - just Sir Pleb's old (pre-Sid) chart that says Vanilla Deity was a 6 multiplier. I know Sid is 8, I wonder if C3C Deity is 7?
 
BlackBetsy said:
Is there a way to figure out if it is a 70% or 80% from CivAssist? I don't see any way? I'd have to look at my Mapfinder/XP machine to see what world I had selected.
Click to expand...
Yes! Go to the Map view, right-click on the map, and choose "Properties"

Damn, ninja'd again... :ninja:
 
OK - found it and it is 70% water. If I do my math correctly, that means that the domination limit is 25% smaller than a 60% map would be, and my population would possibly be 33% larger and my score more like 30k if it translated directly to score.
 
BlackBetsy said:
Milking is tedium, and I do wonder what the difference between my city placement is and that of an expert milker. I guess they'd have chosen a map with a better domination limit?
Click to expand...

60% archipelago. I know I saw a chart comparing domination limit tiles on different map types years ago, but I can't seem to find it. Maybe Blackhat mentioned it once? I don't recall who did the research for the chart. Maybe it was Eman? Only if the map ends up of a lower size does pangea or continents even have a chance of ending comparable domination limit wise. And the larger the map size, the potential number of tiles usable.

I wrote some tip for finishing out milked games a while back.

Oh... Bartleby did the research according to Blackhat at the top of his HoF thread.

Bartleby's table. It looks like a 60% pangea map looks about 400 tiles less than a 60% archipelago map. Even the minimum number listed by Bartley for 60% Large archipelago is greater than the maximum for 60% Large pangea. Though I didn't see 60% landmass mentioned via Blackhat's link.
 
Painfully long, but the end came, 22,215 score:

1723260424175.png
 
BlackBetsy said:
Painfully long, but the end came, 22,215 score:

View attachment 698914
Click to expand...

More points than any large Sid game in the Hall of Fame. Congratulations!

It could rank 38th on the table assuming if nothing else changes.

Pacioli current has rank of 38 and a histographic ranking of 4.87 for the quartermaster's calculation. That could increase your average to 3.67 moving you from 32nd to 24th position in the quartermaster's ranking.
 
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Spoonwood said:
More points than any large Sid game in the Hall of Fame. Congratulations!

It could rank 38th on the table assuming if nothing else changes.

Pacioli current has rank of 38 and a histographic ranking of 4.87 for the quartermaster's calculation. That could increase your average to 3.67 moving you from 32nd to 24th position in the quartermaster's ranking.
Click to expand...
Thanks @Spoonwood. Going to take a break this weekend, but am considering a Sid level game. I would likely go for another game where I conquer the AI and then do 100k or histographic. I am thinking about Standard Histographic (empty table) just because of the size. I would think about 60% archipelago with no Alphabet competitors and maybe expansionist / militaristic opponents. Instead of 4 opponents I might go with 6 to have them weaker and then abandon any map where I'm not alone on a reasonably sized island. Basically, Sir Pleb 2.0.

By the way, a 1350 100k win on Sid Standard like you did here blows me away. Not only conquering all the Sid civs between 500 AD and 1000 AD (this is insane) but also getting the 100k culture done. I just don't understand it. I do note that you used 6 opponents at least.

It is possible that Sid / Huge / Spaceship is a possibility because I think 1874 is a #1 date I can beat. I can always play it out and see if I can flip a Histographic into a Spaceship victory. It seems reasonable; I could have launched a spaceship in the early 1800's if I had pressed for it this game, and I wasn't playing for science (if anything, I was slowing it down).
 
I am running a MapFinder search for maps with 2 river cows on 60% archipelago (arid) with Iroquois as the civ and Zulu, Mongol, Aztec, Japan, Egypt and Arabia as opponents. We are going for Writing in 50 turns and going to spit out curraghs to take advantage of the Alphabet as much as possible. We will abandon any game where we share an island with an AI. I think resource pillaging will happen by way of a road to a town with a Harbor. I am going to give the Great Library a try as well (and I might gift it to a civ and use the Great Ladder strategy).

@superslug this means that if I beat Sid, I am also beating Khan. That's for you, buddy.
 
I am also strongly considering an alternative play with the Vikings. (1) Militaristic means I'm more likely to get an MGL, that's critical. (2) The Beserker is the best offensive unit pre-Cavalry and has amphibious attack. I think I played it once in a COTM, but I haven't played it since. You still get Alphabet with Seafaring and a coastal bonus.
 
If you're looking for a Standard size map, you may want to increase %water to 70 or even 80.

At 60% on Standard Archi, the land-masses often form with narrow land-bridges, "beads-on-a-string" style. Makes it easy to defend your 'bead' on lower levels -- but maybe not from Sid AIs...
 
tjs282 said:
If you're looking for a Standard size map, you may want to increase %water to 70 or even 80.

At 60% on Standard Archi, the land-masses often form with narrow land-bridges, "beads-on-a-string" style. Makes it easy to defend your 'bead' on lower levels -- but maybe not from Sid AIs...
Click to expand...
I played 2 maps and found my starting "island" was shared with an AI. I think for maximum advantage, I might go to 80%. Also strongly thinking about Scandinavia because of Seafaring and the Berserker. Even if I have no saltpeter, I will have 6 attack. May switch to "normal" or "wet" from arid, though, if I'm not agricultural.
 
So far, 7 starts and 7 islands shared with an AI.

Update - got an island to myself, but no iron. But as the Vikings, iron is less important. So far, so interesting.
 
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Well, just got my first game with my own island. Zulus destroyed the Mongols (so no Killing Khan HOF bonus), and then Japanese destroyed the Arabs, so I was down to 4 opponents without doing anything. Built the Great Library and techs were rolling in. Two native luxes and 2 horses; Vikings don't need Iron to build Berserkers. Treasury was over 800, and was 3 techs away from Invention, which means upgrading to Berserkers, a golden age, and going to war. Then the Japanese landed veteran horses and had 2 more galleys on the way on my under-defended west coast. (sigh) Sid.
 
BlackBetsy said:
I do note that you used 6 opponents at least.
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Thanks.

I had 7 opponents total.

According to CrpViewer, Babylon's first capture started in 380 AD. Korea got conquered in 510 AD. First MGL in 530 AD. The war phase ends by 780 AD.

More AIs is likely to help with the total economy due to decreased corruption, because of more palaces. If I had gone with 4 AIs, I doubt I could have gotten as much gold. Sid AIs get rich a good bit quicker than Deity AIs due to their extra settlers and workers, and maybe also the reduced unit support cost.

A city with a name 'Ash 13689 q' has tiles in the '1', '3', '6', '8', and '9' spots. If a unit stands in a city and one uses the keyboard to move the unit around, that corresponds to the tile. The '1' tile got chopped, so did the '3' tile. There exist 12 more spots covered by the city's fat cross which are the 'z', 'a', q', 'r, 't', 'y', 'p', 'l', 'm', 'n', 'b', and 'v' spots. So, Ashur possibly had 60 extra shields going to some build by the 330 AD save. Or maybe Zariqum or Nimrod got some of those shields... but the picture labels those cities 'Nim 1234789 acvbqm' (that's 130 shields!) and 'Zar 136789 tr' for 80 more shields. And Babylon and Ellipi have overlapping tiles with Ashur also.
 
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