Good game,
Jouzou! Good game,
bcool!
With a cultural victory I decided against rushing Hannibal. I guess I could have done so with the dog soldiers. Not sure if I made the right call there. I did steal a worker from him so he did pose somewhat of a threat to me for a long time until I got him into the same religion as I had.
I decided to stone-age him through repeated Worker-stealing and then, when I was ready, I took his city with a lot of Dogs. The main reason was I didn't want to face his Numidian cavalry later on. Also, no space on the "continent" for both of us.
The expected difference in our games should be:
- jesusin gets to Liberalism later, due to war distractions
- jesusin gets more GAs in the end, due to more cities
Research was painful in this game so I ended up using great scientists to accelerate getting liberalism. I dipped into caste system and got 4 great scientists to bulb philosophy, paper, and I used 2 for education. I'm not sure if this was better than getting 4 artists instead to use as cultural bombs or early settled artists.
I used 1GS to bulb Philo, 1 for an Academy (ok if you consider also de 4cpt), 1 was settled in the capital (that was a blunder, I should have bulbed part of Educ; it only got to produce 600b and some 50h).
4GS instead of 4GA is a big investement. 1 or 2 is always worth it. It is probably ok on this map. Now, with 4, I would have expected you to get to Liberalism by 100AD.
Note: settled artists are very rarely better than culture bombs.
I used the oracle to bulb caste system and founded Confucianism. (...) I didn't get the pyramids since I didn't have stone. So I didn't have the option to accelerate the cathedrals with gold. I ended whipped and chopping out the cathedrals mostly under organized religion, but it was still quite painful without the resources.
I never tried for Oracle. It was gone by 1600BC in my game. I got Pyramids, quite late, 1AD. The expected difference between our games should be:
- bcool gets to Liberalism sooner
- jesusin's research after Liberalism is much faster
I never went into US to buy cathedrals, that's a very expensive method. I whipped my cathedrals in a 5 turn interval. I only had 3 cathedrals to build per city and the last one was slow-built, so only 2 whips per city.
Actually, I whipped some 4 times per city, for temples and the like with big overflow. The reasoning was, now my city size is so small, whipping a bit more doesn't matter, as this first pops will regrow fast.
So, you got 4 religions in all?
I did have marble so I chopped several marble wonders for their benefits and cultural. I got the Oracle, MoM, Sistine Chapel and the Parthenon. I also built the statue of zeus wihout ivory since it has a decent hammer/culture ratio.
Same here. SoZ might have been a mistake, it took too long.
I got liberalism (and nationalism) on 640 AD. I switched to 100% culture on 860 AD (I thought finishing divine right was better than an earlier switch to 100% cutlure)
But you changed to FS immediately at 640AD, right?
I built the Taj Mahal in a side city while my 3 legendary cities were busy building cathedrals.
I've done the same in some hammer-poor maps. Here, I switched to slavery for 5 turns immediately after Liberalism and used the overflow from the cathedrals and other whips to accelerate Taj Mahal.
I also built the AP in a side city for the hammer bonuses from all the confu temples and monasteries I had.
Lucky you! I never got Theology and AP was built for a foreign religion.
Going for Theo and a 4th religion would have been a good idea in my game. After my fast REXing my economy was in shreds, so I didn't dare to risk being first to Music. I think I overestimated Monarch AI.
I suspect I end up switching to caste system and pacifism way too late. I end switching 1120 and only then went full out trying to bring great artists into the world. I had 10 great artists 2 prophets 5 scientists. I used one prophet to bulb theology, I used the other to buld the confu holy city. I used 4 scientists to bulb philosophy, paper, and 2 for education, and I used one for an academy (in the capital which was a bad decision I'm sure)
I went for CS+Pacif at 1AD. Then out of it for 5 turns after Liberalism.
There was not much left for whipping at 1AD in my game. As I said, my REXing was fast, son I could use the 500BC-1AD period for missionaries and temples.
The 5th GS for Academy has to be a mistake, I agree. If you bulbed 4 GS and 1 GPro, then there wasn't much to research normally anyway.
The 2nd GPro must have been pernicious too. A GA would have given you much more.
I almost never build Stonehenge.
I'm sure I committed a crime when I used a great artist to trigger a 12 turn GA (I didn't get anything else after the switch to caste system and pacifism and I really thought the increase in great people production and hammers/commerce in all of my cities was about equal to one 4000 culture bomb but I didn't do the numbers)
I settled the free great artist from music in my future Hermitage city, and used the other 8 for cultural bombs.
I also used a GA for a Golden Age
In my experience there are several things to comment here:
A GA is not well used as a GAge, the extra yield from the tiles and the extra GPP don't add up to 4000c... unless you save several turns of anarchy during the Golden Age.
If you look at the end of your game, how many turns would an additional GA have saved? 3? 2? If you save 2 or more turns of anarchy through the use of a Golden Age then the GA is well used.
I would say your settled GA didn't add up to 4000c either. Would you please do the numbers for me? It's 12cpt, 14 with Sistine's, 28 with FS, +7 for each additional cathedral...
This is a huge difference between our games. I bombed 18GA, you bombed 8.
The biggest difference between our games is the city placement and city use. I only cottaged my capital and really only worked 5 cottages during the game (3 of them by an auxiliary city). All the rest of the land in all other cities was farmed.
I ended up winning in 1605 AD. I'll be interested in seeing how jesusin does. And would welcome any comments that might help my cultural games.
It is always a pleasure to compare cultural games. Especially when getting into the details.
I hope someone can comment on my comments so that we all can learn even further.
Other info that might help compare our games would be:
- number of cities at 1000BC and 1AD
- number of religions
- date of the building of the 6th cathedral
- base culture per city at 1200AD
I knew that for any chance at a win I had to control my side of the continent and that wasn't doable anymore so I quit.. Had to have a re-run and even with prior knowledge I still only pulled off a space race after 2000 and by 1 turn! Had to put a halt to a culture win by pacal by dumping 12 transports full of infantry and cannons on a near legendary coastal city and razing it, which didn't improve my popularity and left my army stood north of the river in russian territory with no route back because I sued for peace without re loading my troops back on the transports.. They sat there for the rest of the game as I didnt want to delete them in case they were stopping a dow. Pacal wouldn't give me open borders after my previous behavior.. Any how I beat Peter to launch by less than a turn on my second play but obviously cant submit. Good fun though! keep the swerve balls coming KCD!
I thought barbs only got techs after a certain number of other civs got them first. They actually researched something by themselves, and first?!! Wow, bad luck there. But I'm sure it made crushing them all the sweeter.
14 
and 19 
