[NFP] Boxed in - how to deal with this situation?

[IsabelBraganca]

Settings:
Emperor - Epic - Continents - Standard sized map - Secrets Societies mode
I'm also using the mods from UC-district expansion and one that add new city states and types of city states.

I started building scout and got a second from the hut. I used the governor title I got to get Armani. The cultural city state gives 10% culture bonus for each building you finish. After the scout, I started a monument. A barbarian camp spammed just outside my capital and waves of barbarians will probably come. The monument is still not finished. I need 240 gold to levy the troops.

Spoiler :

 

[Noble Zarkon]

After the scout, I started a monument.

Well that's a risky choice on Emperor!

I would probably buy a slinger next turn and switch the build to warrior (and then another), make sure you are working your best production tiles. You've no improvements for them to pillage and they can't raze your capital so it's not too bad. Keep the slinger in the city and use the warriors to attack retreating as they get injured. Once you have 2 warriors and a slinger go clear the camp out.

Good luck!

 

[IsabelBraganca]

I would probably buy a slinger next turn and switch the build to warrior (and then another), make sure you are working your best production tiles. You've no improvements for them to pillage and they can't raze your capital so it's not too bad. Keep the slinger in the city and use the warriors to attack retreating as they get injured. Once you have 2 warriors and a slinger go clear the camp out.

The slinger costs 215 gold because I'm playing Epic speed. If I build the slinger and leave it inside killing the units, I can levy the city state (4 warriors-240 gold) working the gold tiles after I finish the slinger. If my math is correct, I should have 240 gold 4 turns after I finish the slinger. The barbs are not my main concern; I guess I'll receive a declaration of war soon because I have 3 AI close by. And Nubia will have the Pitati archers...

 

[Vargas1]

Cyrus doesn't look all that close, so you may be ok there (but keep an eye if you get a buildup of troops from that direction). Getting an archer asap should be your priority I think, because a single archer with the home continent bonus could control the field below Washington given the amount of hills and mountains around there. I'd also really want to get a city up next to the Fountain of Youth, not just because it's a useful wonder but because there are some good spots there for HS/campus adjacency. You're probably inviting a declaration from Kristina if you do that, but again given the home continent bonus and the terrain, you should be able to set up a pretty decent defensive position. Once you've got your defense set up, you can probably expand at least one city to the south and one to the west. But I think the key will be to get out some archers to set up defensive positions. Even with the bonuses for Pitati archers, your home continent bonus should be enough to hold them off.

 

[intellectsucks]

My first instinct is always to fight my way out but that might actually be the best course here given how close everyone is. Get archers, then focus your next cities on getting horses, either northeast or south. Rush horsemen, get 4-6 and take out either Nubia or Kristina. Don't ignore defense though! Whoever you don't declare on will probably be declaring on you shortly afterward. An archer or two held back and then walls in your forward city seems essential. My initial thought is to send your horse army after Kristina, as she tends to get a decent early to mid tech lead and is more likely to go after that wonder, which will be a big boost for Bull Moose Teddy. She's unlikely to get far enough ahead that you can't horse rush her though. Have those scouts focus their exploration on revealing as much of your targets territory as possible so that you can plan your attack.

Building that monument really put you in the hole, you could have alternated military and settlers and gotten both the wonder and the horses; now it looks like you might have to choose. But don't worry, if you don't get a city near that wonder in time, you can just take that area by force.

Once you've eliminated one of your two closest competitors, you should have plenty of room for big time expansion, allowing you to either keep rolling with military or shift to a peaceful game. Remember, Teddy Roosevelt was well known as a conservationist and reformer, but he also lived by the philosophy "Walk softly and carry a big stick"

 

[PiR]

Even though they are close, right now you could (if you had settlers) forward-settle in 6 OK spots it seems. I would personnally focus on that, but I tend to play mostly peacefully.

 

[intellectsucks]

Even though they are close, right now you could (if you had settlers) forward-settle in 6 OK spots it seems. I would personnally focus on that, but I tend to play mostly peacefully.

I find that if I can't get to 10+ cities, I struggle to make traction against the AI. In a situation like this, expanding peacefully to 10 cities looks like it would be stretch, which is why I recommended an aggressive approach (you know besides the fact that I just love killing the AI ). How would expand peacefully beyond the 5-6 spots that you identify on the map?

 

[Vargas1]

If you can get a core of 5-6 cities peacefully, on a continents map I find it’s not too tough to expand away from that core to add more cities later on. You won’t get prime real estate, but you can find somewhere that’s half-desert but with enough food to grow, or tundra with some resources. I also find if you get the Hic Sunt Dracones golden age that can help a lot - get a couple of settlers built and ready together, and go found two or three 4-pop cities at once at the edge of someone else’s empire and you can usually survive any loyalty issues.

 

[Socrates99]

Get archers asap then rush horsemen or swords depending on your resources. You're Teddy, you shouldn't have too much trouble defending and expanding with war. Especially with the FoY so close. Having that barb camp next door is great. It'll be easy to get the archery and bronzeworking eurekas plus nice era score for the classical. I'd wreck Kiristina and lock down the FoY while keeping an eye on Nubia for the inevitable surprise war. It can be a risk but I like pumping out that first settler as soon as I hit 2 pop in the capital. Getting that second city out early can be a massive boon especially in this case since FoY will help in war and again, get era score towards that sweet sweet classical golden age.

You can be pretty violent early on and still play peaceful. I'm assuming CV with Bull Moose. Go ham in the ancient and classical then settle down in the medieval/renaissance and you should still be able to makes some friends. Warmongering isn't as frowned upon in the early game.

 

[PiR]

I find that if I can't get to 10+ cities, I struggle to make traction against the AI. In a situation like this, expanding peacefully to 10 cities looks like it would be stretch, which is why I recommended an aggressive approach (you know besides the fact that I just love killing the AI ).

Yeah, it totally makes sense, probably more than what I suggested, to attack the AI. Just offering an alternative for those who don't master well the early wars (that's my case, I'm better with middle or late wars).

How would expand peacefully beyond the 5-6 spots that you identify on the map?

If one of the close CS has a useless power, then probably conquering would be 1 more city.
I would also explore to the north-north, maybe there's place to expand in that direction.
As soon as I can, I would explore to the west, through the ocean to find America, hoping there's place to settle there - makes sense for that civ?

 

[intellectsucks]

Yeah, it totally makes sense, probably more than what I suggested, to attack the AI. Just offering an alternative for those who don't master well the early wars (that's my case, I'm better with middle or late wars).


If one of the close CS has a useless power, then probably conquering would be 1 more city.
I would also explore to the north-north, maybe there's place to expand in that direction.
As soon as I can, I would explore to the west, through the ocean to find America, hoping there's place to settle there - makes sense for that civ?

Early war can also depend on the AIs mood. Sometimes it seems like they stop producing anything but units and your 4 horsemen end up getting slaughtered by their 6 archers and 4 spearmen.

I don't know that I've ever settled cities on a different continent (but then I mostly play Pangaea maps...). What considerations should you be looking out when attempting it?

The slinger costs 215 gold because I'm playing Epic speed. If I build the slinger and leave it inside killing the units, I can levy the city state (4 warriors-240 gold) working the gold tiles after I finish the slinger. If my math is correct, I should have 240 gold 4 turns after I finish the slinger. The barbs are not my main concern; I guess I'll receive a declaration of war soon because I have 3 AI close by. And Nubia will have the Pitati archers...

IsabelBraganca any update? How did you decide to handle it?

 

[PiR]

I don't know that I've ever settled cities on a different continent (but then I mostly play Pangaea maps...). What considerations should you be looking out when attempting it?

Be careful with loyalty of course if that continent is occupied. I often keep the government plazza just for that! With Hercules and a governor it can mitigate a huge pressure. Golden age also of course.
Sometimes multiple tiles islands are also great opportunity with no loyalty issue.
There are 2 cards to improve the growth/economy of the cities not on your original continent.
The advantage would be to find very different luxury resources, make trade routes with civs far away from you, and in case you want to go for domination well you have your own zone of operations closer to the far-away civs for later.

(not exhaustive of course)

I just like it for gameplay, as circumference of the world, that is something I enjoy as it is historically accurate.

 

[Vargas1]

If you’re playing a true continents-style map (e.g. one with separate large landmasses), the key to expanding to a new continent is to manage your loyalty. You can always find somewhere in the deep tundra at the poles where loyalty won’t be an issue, but those are likely to be pretty bad cities. If you want to settle better land, then you want to get a loyalty foothold and grow your cities quickly so they can get to a size that mitigates loyalty pressure. Settling multiple cities at once can help, as can using the Hic Sunt Dracones golden age. You can also hang onto a trader and send him from your city as soon as you settle, ideally to somewhere that will give a lot of food. Also using your first builder to chop any rainforest or bonus food resources to get up a little bit in population.

 

[IsabelBraganca]

Thanks all for the tips. I lost the 19 turn file. I forgot to save and started a new game. Forgetting to save is usually not a big issue because the game autosave every turn. However, this time it was too late because the autosaves had being overwritten.

The third try was the charm.



I settled near the natural wonder. My troops avoided Amanitore to forward settle me, but I'm left with one archer and one scout after the skirmishes with the barbarians. I was in doubt about putting the horses on the second or third ring, but I will let them on the third. It will cost me more money to buy the tile, but I will save one worker charge, be able to sell the fur to get the money and get a better spot for a forth city, once the loyalty pressure gets better. When I get a governador title, I'll be able to handle negative amenities, so I need the silver. Philadelphia has lots of loyalty pressure right now, it's positive but low. I'm going after Persia, and I might sell the silver to levy some troops.