Can we mod a way to keep religious units out via diplomo?

[Larsenex]

Simple enough. My alternative is to simply turn off religious victory which I may do. It would be nice if we can have some diplomo options to keep out religious units without provoking war.

Why is the onus on me to start a war on you for you doing something you said you would not do?

Anyone here able to guide me how or perhaps I can assist you if needed? (to mod this request.)

Cheers.

 

[durfal]

Turning off Religious Victory doesn't help cause religions stay in the game and only the victory condition is not enabled. The AI just goes on spamming Religious units and fighting religious wars just like before and even if you don't found a religion the others try to keep converting your cities and fight religious wars in your territory and so blocking your roads and paths.
So the only thing that can be done is a mod that removes all the religious units from the game.

 

[CivFanMUC]

To reduce spamming you could make religious Units very expensive, like that:

UPDATE Units SET Cost = Cost * 10 WHERE UnitType = "UNIT_MISSIONARY" OR UnitType = "UNIT_APOSTLE" OR UnitType = "UNIT_INQUISITOR";

 

[LDiCesare]

Not exactly that, but you can probably force the religious units to obey the normal open borders rules with this:
ChangeUnitAbilities.xml :
Find the line <Row Type="ABILITY_RELIGIOUS_ENTER_FOREIGN_LANDS" Tag="CLASS_RELIGIOUS"/>
Delete it.
You could tie that ability to something, for instance there is ABILITY_ARCHAEOLOGIST_ENTER_FOREIGN_LANDS that is activated when you build some wonder.
I'm not sure about making a separate "Open borders only for religious units" menu in the diplo, but I'm not sure I'd want one.
I think just removing the religious units the right to go anywhere they like without open borders would be enough.
Hope this helps.

 

[Lord Yanaek]

I think just removing the religious units the right to go anywhere they like without open borders would be enough.

That would probably make religious victory totally impossible thought.

OP, you can use your own religious units to fight them without declaring a war (a religious war isn't considered a war and won't probably even annoy the AI sending Apostles your way, unless he's Saladin of course).

What we really need is for any broken promise to open a very favorable Casus Belli with almost no warmonger penalty as long as you don't capture cities (some Casus Belli reduce the warmonger penalty for taking cities, this one would just largely reduce the penalty for declaring war), this way you could kill them with your normal units.

Fighting a defensive religious war is rather easy thought as your apostles will be close to your holy sites to heal, and each time you kill one of theirs, their pressure drops in a large radius and your pressure goes up. I actually managed to convert several AI cities simply by defending mine against their Apostles

 

[LDiCesare]

That would probably make religious victory totally impossible thought.

OP, you can use your own religious units to fight them without declaring a war (a religious war isn't considered a war and won't probably even annoy the AI sending Apostles your way, unless he's Saladin of course).

What we really need is for any broken promise to open a very favorable Casus Belli with almost no warmonger penalty as long as you don't capture cities (some Casus Belli reduce the warmonger penalty for taking cities, this one would just largely reduce the penalty for declaring war), this way you could kill them with your normal units.

Fighting a defensive religious war is rather easy thought as your apostles will be close to your holy sites to heal, and each time you kill one of theirs, their pressure drops in a large radius and your pressure goes up. I actually managed to convert several AI cities simply by defending mine against their Apostles

First of all, it's what is closest to the OP question as I could find. You are not answering his question nor suggesting an answer to that question.
I agree with the OP in that I think we need a mechanism of diplomatically, peacefully, keeping the other religions at bay.
Using your own religious units is not a solution anyway because more often than not, you can't have any (play as not Saladin on deity and don't beeline religion). Furthermore, you don't even need to. IF there are enough civs, they'll fight each other religiously and will never win, but they'll annoy the hell out of you with all their missionaries all over the place. Putting them in their own layer would make things easier but really, I want them out of my land because it gives visibility to their player.
As for the way casus belli and declarign war/breaking promises work, the diplomacy as it currently stands is downright stupid. Your ally will hate you for joining a war he asks you to join for instance. I haven't looked at whether this could be modded.

 

[Lord Yanaek]

First of all, it's what is closest to the OP question as I could find.

Yes it is, i wasn't questioning this. I was just pointing the (possibly overlooked) drawback of your method. From what OP posted, i was under the assumption removing religious victory would be a "last resort".

You are not answering his question nor suggesting an answer to that question.

I was giving him an alternative to declaring war as it seemed to be his concern so i think it was relevant. Similarly my suggestion for a Casus Belli was directly related to his concern of not having a way to punish someone who don't keep a promise without becoming the "bad" guy.
That the current diplomacy is totally out of whack is true but doesn't invalid the point of having a favorable Casus Belli. Your example of a Joint War is caused by bad application of warmonger penalties. If you have a Casus Belli that eliminates the penalty, even the broken diplomatic system won't cause you troubles (some Agendas might still cause a few AIs to hate you, but that's another story)

Also OP never said he didn't found so my assumption was he wanted to protect his religion, hence my suggestion.

I understand your concern for map clutter, it can be a pain in some situations. I wouldn't worry about visibility thought. Traders also gives visibility and you won't be able to prevent them, plus i doubt the AI gains anything by being able to directly look at your land (unlike a human player). If your concern is multiplayer just use "real world diplomacy" and if words are not enough, a good axe will do

 

[LDiCesare]

The problem is there is sometimes no alternative to declaring war: There is no way you can be assured of having a religion. You can sometimes conquer someone else and use their religion as a countermeasure, but it's not a guarantee.
So when you start a game, you are not sure you'll be able to do anything peaceful against religions unless you play Salain.

 

[agonistes]

Fighting a defensive religious war is rather easy thought as your apostles will be close to your holy sites to heal, and each time you kill one of theirs, their pressure drops in a large radius and your pressure goes up. I actually managed to convert several AI cities simply by defending mine against their Apostles

True, but you know, it does get annoying after awhile. I either want them to respect borders, or I'm just going to remove the units altogether. Somehow.

What would be fantastic is a gameplay option to turn religious units on or off.

 

[Mentos]

It plays much better with border control of religious units.
To further increase the border control, any idea how to prevent traders to enter foreign territories or city states of foreign suzerainity without open border treaty or war? I don't see any trait like the religious and archaeologists.

 

[Horem]

Dale has a mod out that makes Religous units repect Open Border agreements. Probably the closest your going to get Diplo wise atm.