Caveman 2 Cosmos

[raxo2222]

I don't understand this insistence on not allowing people to build obsolete units. Why shouldn't they. There are many cases in history where obsolete units win because of numbers.

Ask @Thunderbrd
Maybe if Nth unit in upgrade line is unlocked, then N-2th unit in upgrade line could be forceobsoleted.

@Dancing Hoskuld will we able to build tamed horse/camel/elephant to spread animals, if we don't have animal in vicinity?
Unit trading is too unreliable and confusing for both players and AI.
Reliability and simplicity > Realism
Trading animal resource should be equivalent of trading animal unit or getting subdued unit, that can place this animal resource.

 

[tmv]

I don't understand this insistence on not allowing people to build obsolete units. Why shouldn't they. There are many cases in history where obsolete units win because of numbers.

I guess it is a side effect of the unit progression being not nearly strong enough compared to reality - which is unfortunately necessary to avoid an extremely strong steamroll effect (although I would really like a more realistic progression once in a while, at least as an option).

The obsolete units wouldn't get built so much if (with SM on) a company of modern infantry (or alternatively a single modern tank) could easily wipe out several Roman legions.

 

[Thunderbrd]

Maybe if Nth unit in upgrade line is unlocked, then N-2th unit in upgrade line could be forceobsoleted.

Supposedly it already works something like this.

The insistence where prop contrl units are concerned is to avoid the fact that it tends to be that lesser versions, while not as powerful at controlling properties individually, are more economically efficient at doing so. To change this would be to massively upset the current effective balance we have, which has nevertheless been discussed as a project to move forward with eventually.

 

[raxo2222]

Supposedly it already works something like this.

The insistence where prop contrl units are concerned is to avoid the fact that it tends to be that lesser versions, while not as powerful at controlling properties individually, are more economically efficient at doing so. To change this would be to massively upset the current effective balance we have, which has nevertheless been discussed as a project to move forward with eventually.

Now Xth unit in line is forceobsoleted when X+1th unit is unlocked at least in hunters and explorers line.

 

[Thunderbrd]

Now Xth unit in line is forceobsoleted when X+1th unit is unlocked at least in hunters and explorers line.

From what I understand, this is the code default for any line.

 

[raxo2222]

From what I understand, this is the code default for any line.

And what I suggested was making it more leniant, that is forceobsoleting 2 generations old unit.

 

[Thunderbrd]

And what I suggested was making it more leniant, that is forceobsoleting 2 generations old unit.

I'm pretty happy with the way it is and have found that coding to be a bit fiddly. Any attempt to mess with it could easily introduce bugs we really don't want. I don't think it's a good idea to make it more relaxed tbh.

 

[Niveras]

Has there been a change in how holy cities are selected? Divine Prophets enabled. I am on SVN 10274.

Every religion that I've researched seems to get founded in an AI city instead. When this first happened with Shamanism, I figured the AI just managed to get it few turns earlier and popped his GP on the same turn I completed the research.

Now, I've attempted to found Andeanism, Ngaiism, and Yoruba, and all the holy cities went to random AI cities. I still got the prophet, and I hadn't even attempted to spread the new religions yet; it seemed as though the religion was being created in the world in a random city on the turn the tech was researched rather than waiting for the religion to actually be founded. I don't think I am being sniped, as I first thought on Shamanism: I'm fairly ahead on tech and even if I wasn't, I think four occurrences are too consistent to have been sniped out of all of them.

It is hard to tell if this is working as designed or a bug. I did see a relatively recent SVN (Nov 12, 10251) but it is unclear to me whether this change might be causing the behavior. I wouldn't have thought so since it sounds like whatever code that is should still only run when a GP attempts to spread a religion.

I am also playing starting from the Ancient era vs. Prehistory. I know that this can cause problems sometimes and there is a popup warning against it, I am not sure if might be interfering here too.

 

[Thunderbrd]

Interesting.

What must be happening is that a number of AI are holding onto prophets. The change made it so that a religion can only be researched once in the game (once the tag is applied to the religious techs anyhow - not sure if that's happened yet but it doesn't need to for the second part of this.) It also then had to make it so that, as a result, the techs aren't necessary to get the religion so long as someone in the game has researched it. At that point, an existing prophet anywhere can found the religion which I'm thinking is making for a race to found the religion once the tech is unlocked that they AI is beating you at with the prophets they are holding onto because, slow as turns may be, the AI is actually shockingly fast at determining what to do so has probably already founded the religion before your turn even begins.

That's not an optimal or expected response to this adjustment so perhaps must be reconsidered to at least give the discovering player a full round before others can get at it. I believe I can probably make it so that the discovering player's (better yet team's) prophet(s) has a round before others can get at it.

Another possible option might be that the favored religion code is based on the discovery of the tech and not the founding of the religion but I think we can rule that out because if it was that, then we'd have probably had an issue with this sort of thing before now.

 

[Thunderbrd]

Announcement: the v3.19 patch that I'm linking us to seems to have a problem with the download. We could find an uncorrupted one and it was lucky we had an old copy. Should we try to fix this somehow for those who would upload C2C and follow the instructions to getting it up and running?

 

[Yudishtira]

Downloading from moddb I get no errors (just that warning about 'unsupported' etc.) and a zipped file that's 167Mb. Does that sound right (I've never done this before)?

Edited to amend: it's 167meg not k sheesh makes a difference...

 

[Thunderbrd]

Downloading from moddb I get no errors (just that warning about 'unsupported' etc.) and a zipped file that's 167K. Does that sound right (I've never done this before)?

I was able to get one but it was corrupt. Do u have a link directly to your source?

 

[Yudishtira]

I was able to get one but it was corrupt. Do u have a link directly to your source?

Doing it again it says:
https://sjc2.dl.dbolical.com

 

[Thunderbrd]

It times out. Huh. Anyhow, we had trouble with the new download where the old file we downloaded years ago worked great. Note that I found BtS wouldn't even run without the 3.19 patch.

 

[raxo2222]

Doing it again it says:
https://sjc2.dl.dbolical.com

Your link is broken.

 

[Yudishtira]

Your link is broken.

That was the link that moddb gave me the second time I went back to answer Tbrd's question. I didn't continue with the download because I had already successfully downloaded the file.

These links seem to go down and come back up all the time, which I presume is why download sites offer as many 'mirrors' as possible.

The main thing I would've thought is that the link for downloading the 3.19 patch which is given on Civfanatics does still work.

 

[raxo2222]

That was the link that moddb gave me the second time I went back to answer Tbrd's question. I didn't continue with the download because I had already successfully downloaded the file.

These links seem to go down and come back up all the time, which I presume is why download sites offer as many 'mirrors' as possible.

The main thing I would've thought is that the link for downloading the 3.19 patch which is given on Civfanatics does still work.

Or you miscopied/mispasted something, as it is here:
https://www.moddb.com/games/civilization-iv/downloads/beyond-the-sword-319-patch

This link works unlike above one - this is on MODDB page of this patch, you need to click "download" here.

 

[Thunderbrd]

My point is that the one we successfully downloaded was broken and didn't work so I'm hoping others don't have a similar problem and maybe we should somehow upload one of our own just in case.

 

[Thunderbrd]

Ok, so we want us to remove all posts on the SVN thread that are not detailing SVN updates... alright BUT in return I ask a favor of us all. A new policy so as to help keep us from missing things that happen: PLEASE ignore all rules about double posting there and if you make multiple commits before someone else commits, DO NOT add those to a previous post - make a NEW post for each and every commit. This will make it harder to miss what is being done.

Can that be agreed upon policy please?

 

[Toffer90]

Ok, so we want us to remove all posts on the SVN thread that are not detailing SVN updates... alright BUT in return I ask a favor of us all. A new policy so as to help keep us from missing things that happen: PLEASE ignore all rules about double posting there and if you make multiple commits before someone else commits, DO NOT add those to a previous post - make a NEW post for each and every commit. This will make it harder to miss what is being done.

Can that be agreed upon policy please?

Aye aye cap'n.