Citizen Discussion: Proposal to repeal or alter Article K of the Constitution

[Bill_in_PDX]

I agree with you cyc in that it would be important to set down some standards on when a chat must be stopped. But I also want the DP to have further descretion to stop anytime they see fit.

In the case of trading medicine in term 3, I saw it as a cowboy chat group (to use your rather good visual) running off and making a major technology decision without full citizen review.

So yes, limit the turns and capabilities of the DP and chat, but don't limit the ability to call a halt whenever deemed necessary.

 

[eyrei]

I think it would be safe to say the DP can call a halt to the chat when any decision needs to be made that has not been polled on the forum. This is not to say that a stop must be called, but it can be. If a topic has been polled, the DP cannot stop the chat for that decision since it has already been made.

 

[Cyc]

See, here we go again rolling around the ideas about "stops" to be implemented. We, excuse me, YOU should start another thread pertaining to the rules of closed-doors turns. There is a lot more to discuss than certain times the DP should consider stopping his turn session.

 

[Bill_in_PDX]

Well if that is pointed at me cyc, then I am sorry, but I was responding to you, who brought it up in the first place with your comment about what dis and Shaitan were doing.

I know this is a sensitive subject to many, but I am confused as to how this is not pertinant to the discussion.

Are you saying that we should impliment restrictions on cowboy (cowgirl as the case may be) Presidents, but chat groups as a whole should be given wide latitude when something hasn't been decided via forum?

I know I must be missing your point here, and i want to understand, so please try to pound it into my thick skull. ;-)

Bill

 

[Shaitan]

Originally posted by Bill_in_PDX
I know I must be missing your point here, and i want to understand, so please try to pound it into my thick skull. ;-)

@Cyc - Wanna borrow my gavel?

 

[Cyc]

Sorry, Bill. Sometimes I come across as the blunderhead.

1. This thread is entitled "Proposal to repeal or alter Article K of the Constitution". Any polls coming from this thread should deal with the repealing or alteration of Article K of the Constitution. That's the easy part. A discussion thread with a title relating to the new "private" turn sessions and the rules pertaining to the operation of those sessions should be opened in this forum, so that polls relating to it's discussion can be spawned from it. And actually this was addressed at your second paragraph, Bill.

2. (Actually 1.) I wasn't singling you out, Bill. Nor was I pointing at eyrei. I was speaking to everyone. A lot of people respect what you two write, so I figured that people would say "OK, we need to discuss "stops", and that's it!". I thought I would nip it in the bud.

3. I am not for open, free, wide latitudes for the turn-chats. I was opposed to Donsig's changing of the build queues. I was opposed to CT's changing of build queues, I was opposed to the sale of techs on the fly. I was opposed to a lot of things that were rampant in the turn-chat. But rather than whine about them, I rolled my sleeves up and got to work trying to make sure that things went as well as they could. I remember when in the first two terms, I was so flabber-gasted, I would just throw up my hands and walk away. The people who now want to take the game behind closed doors started the flood of complaints. I have always tried to make sure things were above board. I just get tired of fighting.

 

[Bill_in_PDX]

Originally posted by Shaitan

@Cyc - Wanna borrow my gavel?

Hey! Now wait just a minute, that gavel is way to dangerous to be passed around willy nilly!

Besides, I am worried about cyc's avatar. I don't know if it is some kind of lobster claw or a indian artifact...

Bill

 

[Bill_in_PDX]

Originally posted by Cyc
2. (Actually 1.) I wasn't singling you out, Bill. Nor was I pointing at eyrei. I was speaking to everyone. A lot of people respect what you two write, so I figured that people would say "OK, we need to discuss "stops", and that's it!". I thought I would nip it in the bud.

Well eyrei maybe, but there are just too many examples to count of how no one cares what I write

I understand now, and will endeavor to stay on topic, so that you can keep the focus where it needs to be.

For the record (and for the two deaf and blind people who await my opinion on the matter), I am opposed to elimination by law of the turn chats, even though I myself am unable to attend them during their traditional timeframe.

 

[eyrei]

For the record:

My only opposition to the turn chats is the additional power it gives to those who happen to be able to attend. I guess Cyc is right that I am not on topic here, since what I want is a change in the rules regarding turn chats.

 

[Cyc]

Quoting Bill:
Besides, I am worried about cyc's avatar. I don't know if it is some kind of lobster claw or a indian artifact...

Actually, it looks like a fish to me. I originally gave it a good looking at because of the colors (it was much bigger), but the title of the work is "Borg 1". So go figure.

 

[Falcon02]

For your information your Avatar is one of the main symbols which represent the Borg from Star Trek sorta like the Bird holding the two planets in it's talons for the Romulans or that circle with the stars inside and olive branches on the sides to represent the United Federation of Planets or even that trianglish thing, in case you haven't figured that out by the title of the work. I haven't a clue why they picked a figure like that for it, but go figure.

Back on topic....
My objection to making it optional is it gives the DP too much power to do whatever he wants without having to awnser to a chat log. Also with the Turn chats the DP has more reminders of things to do and about Polls that exist, and the results, when I was DP I normally asked someone else to look for the results of a poll, cause I was too busy. I don't see how eliminating the turn chats some terms will solve the problem of the people in the chat having too much power, it just takes the power from a small group to one person. Even if the DP doesn't wanna break any rules or go against the will of the people, he could concider some decisions not worthy of going to the Forums when having more people there gives them more opinions and could bring up that one issue is worthy of going back to the Forums. That's why IF we do go with the Optional turn chats there MUST be new laws making sure that the DP will be accountable for taking issues to the forum when the come up.