Civ II Wasn't All That Good Compared to III

I happened to write a very long post (bordering on essay) on this very subject last night, but then I made the mistake of previewing it, which accidentally lost me the whole text! :(

I feel safe to comment on this because as it happens I've liked all the Civ games so far (the proper ones, didn't like CtP), plus I even enjoyed Colonization very much :p

I agree very much with what people are saying about Civ2, and I see it's about the same that I wrote about it last night; Howitzers, super-wonders, crazy rail-roading terraforming engineers, etc etc, Civ2 was, in the end, too *wild*. There was too much power available to the smart player which the AI would never think of using, let alone exploiting. Civ2 was very fun to play, until you'd milked it dry in Deity, as most of us did.

What kept Civ2 going so long was indeed the scenarios and customizability; and let no-one say I'm not qualified to pass my judgement, I played Civ2 thousands of times in all kinds of ways (including dozens of scenarios) and spent a lot of time creating scenarios too (complete with units sprites etc).

As to Civ3, I'm pleased with it, on the whole. Most of the new concepts are very good additions to the genre, most notably culture, resources, civ attributes and UU's, and the Golden Age. I also like bombardment and the improved diplomacy. The AI is a lot better at fighting its wars now, *compared to Civ2*. I also praise Firaxis for balancing the wonders and the settlers.

I dislike the tech tree though, especially the modern age (why can you build nuclear subs when you still don't know about nuclear weapons, and why can you get the tech for Modern Armor without knowing about Aluminium? It's flimsy). And as stated over and over, there are bugs and the interface has many flaws. Also the orange blobs known as pollution are not adding much fun to my games, au contraire!

Okay, I've pretty much said what everyone is saying, but I wanted to make one point:

In my own personal case, I got Civ2 without having anticipated it for a long time. It was like a surprise gift from Heaven! So I was too happy to be critical of it from the start. But I had known about Civ3 since 1999, and spent much time on forums debating the wish list for it. All that anticipation was bound to end in some disappointment, once I'd face the real Civ3, as it did. Of course Civ3 wasn't everything I'd hoped for, far from it, and of course it couldn't recreate the magic of Civ1, back in the old days. I don't think any Civ sequel ever will.

I don't know if others experienced the same, but think about it; did you have the same expectations for Civ2, the same long period ending in inevitable disappointment?
 
Also wanted to comment on the "AI cheats" subject:

If AI cheats are too frustrating, there's really no need to play Civ3 on Emperor or Deity. Just play on Regent or Monarch and enjoy the game. The highest difficulty levels are there for those who are bored and want some serious challenge.

The AI can only be made so good given available time, manpower, and know-how (remember - the game's supposed to make a profit for its makers). So to vary the difficulty, Firaxis must resort to other methods (the so-called cheats). The fundamental concept there is nothing peculiar to Civ3, it can be found in many other games, and even in some sports.
 
All three games have their strengths and weaknesses. For me, I have lots of time constraints and no longer have hours to play civ3 so i play about 60% civ2 now and 30% civ3, civ1 gets 10% of my time. I have NO favorite anymore.
 
Originally posted by Zouave
In your silly arrogance and juvenile name-calling you miss the main point.

Civ 2 and Civ 3 cannot be directly compared because one is over five years older than the other - a generation in computer terms.
So those who like "purty pictures" and cute graphics and sounds and other SUPERFICIAL STUFF will of course like Civ 3.

Never was there the kind of disappointment, frustration, and anger about the game when Civ 2 came out following Civ 1 - the kind of disappointment we've seen with buggy Civ 3. People universally loved Civ 2 when it came out, and it wasn't a buggy mess when it did come out and, yes, you bet it had scenarios.

I said this many months ago and I say it again. Civ 2 had legs for over five years, and even now remains one of the great Classics of Computer gaming. I still have scenarios I have yet to get to. Civ 3 is already losing its legs as posters speak about "Civ 3 burnout". You can be certain that over five years after its release Civ 3 - unlike Civ 2 - will NOT still have legs and will NOT be considered a Computer gaming classic. Five years after November 2001 Civ 3 will be just a fading memory. That is for sure.

You are too unfair for CIV3...

When I got CIV2, I continue to prefer CIV1. CIV2 won't never be a classic like CIV1 IS.
CIV2 has also its own problems, especially one: you complain about the settler diarrea, but in CIV2, that was the road to certain victory... AI was stupid, borders didn't exist and so I founded cities everywhere, and then I kill the AIs ALL AT THE SAME TIME!!! They don't stand a chance. That wasn't possible in CIV1 and in CIV3. To me, that was a big backward in gameplay.
Be fair.
 
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