Civilization 5

By asking the developers get rid of the map tiles, what you are ineffect doing is asking they hide them from the player and make them significantly smaller such that you can choose more fluid paths to move your units. I doubt civ maps could ever exist without tiles in some form as it is the tiles the software uses to determine movement penalties/bonuses, etc. Making them significantly smaller only increases the number of tiles to sample each turn to calculate movement, culture, trade, etc. This in turn will dramatically increase the processing time between turns.

Be careful what you wish for!
 
I doubt civ maps could ever exist without tiles in some form

I doubt so too. Because do not forget that the first incarnation of Civ was a board game. With tiles and cards and tokens and... well, you got the idea

I think this is one of the reasons I really like Civ: I'm a board-game-geek :p
 
I like the idea of food/commerce/shields being national commodities, as opposed to city-specific. I think food and commerce should be 'resources' that are tradable just like coal, iron, etc. Provided the city is connected to the rest of a civilization's cities it should get access to the food/commerce pool of the nation.

All trade is dependant on a road/rail connection between cities. Cities separated by water can be connected by a harbour. Improved tiles should need a road/rail linking it to the nation's road/rail network to it to get the benefit from that tile.

Naval units should have an order to 'patrol'. This order will station the unit on a tile and immediately break any sea trade link through those tiles of any civilization at war with the owner of the naval units. This way you can isolate a rivals ciites on an island by placing a ring of units around the island.

I don't know much about Civ4 having never played it, but in Civ3 you have to build an army then add units to the army. Your military is an army! I'd prefer to create a 'division' (e.g. an infantry division), have each nation have an military spending budget, and when I place a division in a city with a barracks (and yes, civ should *require* a barracks to edit that division), I can expand the size of the division by pouring more money into it. Like civ3 armies, the size of the division will expand its health (i.e. the amount of hits it can take!). The graphics could then be improved to reduce the scale of the units and show more than a single individual fighting.

EDIT: Fixed some typos. Ideas stayed the same
 
Total War battles but keep the civ management. You move an army onto an enemy. Instead of zooming in and 3 guys beats each other you can have a small fight. Like a Warrior could be 40 or so warriors attacking on a (Medieval, Rome)-Total War scale.
 
The system that was done in Call to Power 1 + 2 offers IMHO the best mix of strategy (in form of balanced armies) and uncomplicated battles
 
The series really needs a new combat system in its next incarnation. The current "all or nothing" kamikaze style combat is too lethal, especially with fewer, more specialized units of Civ4 in contrast to Civ3 where losing a generic unit, even if Elite, didn't hurt nearly as much. In any case I'm tired of playing Russian roulette with my units every time I attack someone, losing a highly promoted unit at freak 0.01% odds to an obsolete defender. Combat should more often be about damaging the units instead of wiping them off in a single round of combat. All units should have the chance to withdraw - ideally the more veteran unit the better its chances of surviving a defeat.

Another aspect that needs changing is the rules of unit stacking. Something needs to be done so that we will finally see some front lines in Civ warfare. Progressive collateral damage might be a tool to do it with - the bigger the stack, the higher the collateral damage of even a single attack.
 
Oh, if only...

Bring back pollution, corruption, and civil disorder. Also units having home cities. Preferably combined with, rather than replaced by, overall army and empire maintenance costs.

Corruption affecting commerce; waste affecting shields; health affecting foods. Improvements which address any of these issues independently.

Roads and railroad commerce bonuses so it's worth roading/railroading every square. Possibly railroads only giving 5x movement increase, with another upgrade step to make movement free.

Civ2-style firepower and hit points.

Civ3-style culture, independent of happiness.

Civ2-style air units you have to move across the map.

No teleporting paratroopers and no teleporting airports; give me air transport units, and paratroopers that jump from planes.

Civ4-style religion, and probably corporations as well, have not played enough BtS to really have a firm opinion on that.

Civ4-style Great People.

One-population-point initial settler units (as per Civ 2), upgrading to two-population-point units at the end of the Ancient Age, similar to the Civ3 Double Your Pleasure mod.

More ages; at least Ancient, Classical, Medieval, Renaissance, Industrial, Modern, Space. Optional future ages for those that like that.

Shields, not hammers.

Strategic resources with a specific location, that have a fixed finite amount of potential shields, which get used up by building units from them, or by the AI building units from them when you trade them. Needing to move a physical caravan to the AI to complete a trade. Caravans expensive and vulnerable units, and available trade routes limited to avoid Civ2 "power democracy" unbalance.

Shields freely exchangeable between any and all buildings, including wonders.

More variety of units, wonders, and improvements. Many many more than any one game however long can use more than a small fraction of.

CtP-type slavers, and abolitionists, and Emancipation Proclamation or equivalent.

Civ-before-4-type units with separate attack and defence strengths, instead of this silly business of RPS-type vulnerabilities among the early units.

Exponential increase in unit attack strength and defence strength over time, with additional increases in firepower and hitpoints. Costs increasing appropriately.

Civ-before-4-type fixed governments rather than civics. More of them.

Civ3-type unit promotions.

"advanced" mining and farming abilities, to make mines and farms more productive, requiring the square to be remined/farmed a la Civ2 farms, with two or three levels of improvement coming with appropriate techs. Resources on mined/farmed squares getting bigger bonuses accordingly.

Terraforming abilities acquired with later techs. All squares to be convertable to usable land with enough time, investment, effort.

Improving sea squares to use regular workers on board naval units rather than self-destructing worker boats.

Expansion of "fat cross" number of workable tiles for a city larger than 20.

New types of specialists becoming available and other city growth phase-changes, like aqueducts at 6 and sewer systems/hospitals at 12 in Civ2/3; new phase-changes at 20 and 40.

Multi-levelled maps, like in Test of Time, to allow for expansion underwater and into orbit.

Building a starship needing a significant amount of orbital development, making the endgame a whole new expansion phase.

Starship taking a while to make its journey, during which it can be lost if the control centre/orbital facilities are taken.

Less animation, less movies, less putting information into graphics rather than text.

Civ4-type information available on AI attitude-affecting factors.

More focus on the gameplay rather than the appearance. Strip the appearance down and make it cleaner and more functional and more Civ3ish.

Game start adjustable back to 7000 BC, and end adjustable forward to 2300 or 3000 AD.

I'll probably remember half a dozen more once I post this, but that's my wishlist for the moment.
 
Total War battles but keep the civ management. You move an army onto an enemy. Instead of zooming in and 3 guys beats each other you can have a small fight. Like a Warrior could be 40 or so warriors attacking on a (Medieval, Rome)-Total War scale.

That's what I'm talking about, so I'm not completely alone in this after all!
 
Total War battles but keep the civ management. You move an army onto an enemy. Instead of zooming in and 3 guys beats each other you can have a small fight. Like a Warrior could be 40 or so warriors attacking on a (Medieval, Rome)-Total War scale.

I have to agree with nightboy, and mabey they could group the warriors or whatever into armies mixed of warriors spearmen horsemen and archers for good overall balance and mabey later on group the guerillas like 4 groups and a few infantry divisions combined to obliderate the enemy and you can have a new title of tactition. Mabey a new thing for civ, have you as a field general and work your way to king in mabey a civil war(barely touched on in normal civ games) and mabey lead babarian armies and take over civilizations. I know they have a mod like that but who knows.
 
II. It's just a different icon for the same thing. Doesn't bother me at all.
 
Bring back pollution, corruption, and civil disorder. Also units having home cities. Preferably combined with, rather than replaced by, overall army and empire maintenance costs.
No, please no, home cities were the most annoying thing ever, pollution is a micromanagement nightmare and has never been implemented properly, and civil disorder is stupid in civ3 at least, why does a city explode and refuse to stop building just because one citizen group is angry that their city is growing and prospering? That makes no sense. Maintence can certainly be improved, but change your other ideas and they'd only be rolling back the clock to worse things, certainly not improving it.

Roads and railroad commerce bonuses so it's worth roading/railroading every square. Possibly railroads only giving 5x movement increase, with another upgrade step to make movement free.
Don't you remember why they took this out? MM is evil, and why I hated civ3 and don't have it anymore, You'll RR the entirety of your civ eventually, there's no need for further incentive to waste time.

Civ2-style air units you have to move across the map.
This I would like, though maybe rebasing (with a X-turn cost depending on how far across the map you were moving the plane) would be a good option.

No teleporting paratroopers and no teleporting airports; give me air transport units, and paratroopers that jump from planes.
Again! MM is bad, please, no! The system is great as is, just because you don't see the planes the paratroopers jump from doesn't mean they arn't there. ;)

Civ4-style religion, and probably corporations as well, have not played enough BtS to really have a firm opinion on that.
Corporations need to be reworked before they are really usable, right now they seem to be a method to get resources you shouldn't be getting, or sucking money out of a poor mindless AI. ;)

One-population-point initial settler units (as per Civ 2), upgrading to two-population-point units at the end of the Ancient Age, similar to the Civ3 Double Your Pleasure mod.
No thanks, new cities need a cost, which I think civ4 implements well, and forcing you to upgrade settlers is just more MM.
More ages; at least Ancient, Classical, Medieval, Renaissance, Industrial, Modern, Space. Optional future ages for those that like that.
No, that would be way too many technologies, I've played mods like that and it turns research into a trek, not a quest for something like it should be. ;)

Shields, not hammers.
Umm, why? Arn't hammers more realistic?

Strategic resources with a specific location, that have a fixed finite amount of potential shields, which get used up by building units from them, or by the AI building units from them when you trade them. Needing to move a physical caravan to the AI to complete a trade. Caravans expensive and vulnerable units, and available trade routes limited to avoid Civ2 "power democracy" unbalance.
What's with the thing for MicroManagement? No, it'll just waste more player time to move caravans from place to place, and to carefully plan out how long each resource will last. (think of losing the uranium resource and being unable to build the last two pieces of the spaceship.

More variety of units, wonders, and improvements. Many many more than any one game however long can use more than a small fraction of.
Umm, why? I know it'd be great to wait 7 years for all the units to be made, but what exactly would be the point? I'd just be annoying trying to find what unit it was and what it did. (Think of the learning curve, civ4 is bad enough...)

Civ-before-4-type units with separate attack and defence strengths, instead of this silly business of RPS-type vulnerabilities among the early units.
Why the millions of units, but not the specialization of units with civ4? You're not making much sense here.... I want to be able to choose what my units will be good in, and stratigize with that how I want to play my game.

Exponential increase in unit attack strength and defence strength over time, with additional increases in firepower and hitpoints. Costs increasing appropriately.
What exactly is different from the regular civ4 system?

Civ-before-4-type fixed governments rather than civics. More of them.
Again, why? I want to choose how my civ works, no just yell at my advisors to make the government more like a monarchy and wait a year to start. :p

"advanced" mining and farming abilities, to make mines and farms more productive, requiring the square to be remined/farmed a la Civ2 farms, with two or three levels of improvement coming with appropriate techs. Resources on mined/farmed squares getting bigger bonuses accordingly.
Yay! More MM! Just what I always wanted....

Terraforming abilities acquired with later techs. All squares to be convertable to usable land with enough time, investment, effort.
This would be good, definitly agree with this. :)

Building a starship needing a significant amount of orbital development, making the endgame a whole new expansion phase.
Because we arn't already having enough fun waiting for the crazy space ship to get to Alpha Centari? :rolleyes:

Starship taking a while to make its journey, during which it can be lost if the control centre/orbital facilities are taken.
No, please, no, I hated it when they brought it into civ 4 BTS, and I'd hate it if they did it again.

Less animation, less movies, less putting information into graphics rather than text.
Again, why? There's no point in regressing the game instead of advancing it, it isn't a boardgame.
 
IMO it depends on the type of MM being done. If it's plausibly something a real ruler could have or would have MMed in a real kingdom, I'm for it on the grounds of realism. If not, the obverse.

Rebasing an air unit, for example, I'd err on the side of not MMing that. Just tell it to find its way from x base to y base, work out the details, General!
 
I agree with most of what IamJohn says. just assume each paratrooper unit has a plane assigned to it. city maintenance can also be assumed to have corruption as a part of it.

one idea i have for civ 5 would be to allow you to assign different cities to work on commerce, culture, or commerce instead of your entire economy. This would/could mean more micromanagement. Sometimes I would just love to be able to have one city focus entirely on research, while have another city focus on culture, and others on bringing in the mullah. I think this would be able to be implemented for those who don't want to manage their nation that much by having an option that would allow you to set all your cities to one thing like the current system.
 
No, please no, home cities were the most annoying thing ever, pollution is a micromanagement nightmare and has never been implemented properly, and civil disorder is stupid in civ3 at least, why does a city explode and refuse to stop building just because one citizen group is angry that their city is growing and prospering? That makes no sense.
Don't you remember why they took this out? MM is evil, and why I hated civ3 and don't have it anymore, You'll RR the entirety of your civ eventually, there's no need for further incentive to waste time.

I understand that there are people in the world who don't like micromanagement, I'm just very much not one of them; I think taking those things out of Civ 4 was a poor decision from a gameplay perspective, and considering that Civ Revolution seems to be stripping down and streamlining the base game further, I'd rather Civ 5 went in the opposite direction.

Again! MM is bad, please, no!

Well, if anyone is listening, I want my vote for "more MM Good!" to be heard as well as the voices against it.

Come to think of it, a Civ 5 where all these various micromanage-or-not elements were options one could switch on or off would be good.

No thanks, new cities need a cost, which I think civ4 implements well, and forcing you to upgrade settlers is just more MM.

That's kind of the point.

No, that would be way too many technologies, I've played mods like that and it turns research into a trek, not a quest for something like it should be. ;)

Only if you have a Big Goal rather than a set of options that are each letting you get ahead in different useful ways.

What's with the thing for MicroManagement? No, it'll just waste more player time to move caravans from place to place, and to carefully plan out how long each resource will last.

a) it's fun.
b) it gives additional areas in which to develop skills which add to your mastery of the game as a whole.

Umm, why? I know it'd be great to wait 7 years for all the units to be made, but what exactly would be the point? I'd just be annoying trying to find what unit it was and what it did. (Think of the learning curve, civ4 is bad enough...)

Still finding new things in the game after years and years of playing appeals to me.

Why the millions of units, but not the specialization of units with civ4? You're not making much sense here.... I want to be able to choose what my units will be good in, and stratigize with that how I want to play my game.

I'm all for specialisation of units and appropriate strategies. I think separate attack/defense strengths give you more directions for that specialisation, and the RPS thing is too limiting.

Yay! More MM! Just what I always wanted....

I appreciate that tastes vary, but some of us do want that.

Because we arn't already having enough fun waiting for the crazy space ship to get to Alpha Centari? :rolleyes:
No, please, no, I hated it when they brought it into civ 4 BTS, and I'd hate it if they did it again.

You've never experienced the tension of the classic Civ2 endgame trying to build a faster starship than the Zulus when they have already launched, or to grab their capital within a handful of turns so they'll lose it ? That's something I miss.

Again, why? There's no point in regressing the game instead of advancing it, it isn't a boardgame.

Well, some of us think that all this processor-heavy graphics is a regression from the heart of the strategy game. It's bells and whistles, and it does nothing for gameplay except make it slower, or harder to read. Text is unambiguous. Pictures aren't.
 
wouldn't more MM make it harder for firaxis to program teh AI's and give humans more of an edge over an AI that doesn't already know how to best implement each aspect of Civ 4 bts? of course the AI could go through a whole renovation for Civ 5, but still I think MM gives humans an edge over the AI.
 
1. I would love to have the option under the Options menu to play "into the Future" and use some of the shiny futuristic units and tech from Beyond the Sword in a regular game instead of the one scenario. Obviously its not for everyone so it should be an option that can be selected or not.

2. Improved Diplomacy. Its said everytime anyone talks about Civ, SMAC, MOO etc etc. But the basic do you want this (y/n) system is kinda basic for todays expectations. I'd love to see border disputes, demilitarized zones, occupations, sabre-rattling, reparations, protectorates and surrender conditions that have more bearing then a single city or capitulation.

3. When the game asks if you want to give a city independence, how about if it was more of a 'sub-region' of your nation. You still 'own it' but a computer generated 'sub-leader' controls its productions, growth etc. That way if you control an island with 4 or 5 cities that really doesnt have any effect on your current strategy you could sublet it to your sub-leader to run. This worked pretty well in Romance of the Three Kingdoms.

4. Some way to ignore certain events like requests from captured cities to be turned over to their homeland etc.

5. I love resources, i want more of them. More base resources should be easy, like Fossils to boost science production or something. I was wonderign about negative resources.. like hostile animals (that maybe generate Barbarian Animals?) or locusts that reduce nearby farms or something.

6. Barbarians. I'm wondering if we can make the barbarians more interesting. I've always though they'd be neater as 'sub-factions'. They only communicate with Factions who share a border or who are connected by roads whatever. They trade. They don't need to declare wars since their not 'cultured' so they can just send troops into neighbours lands at will (if you have bad relations mostly). Maybe you could even buy their help in attacking enemies. You could create 'Missionary' tile improvements to help them see your way and get better relations or eventually join your nation willingly. They'd need to have a generic 'Warlord' type leader profile.

7. Religions are a good idea, i just think they still need a bit of tweaking. Their not so much an emersive historic feeling as a hardline-stat based addition. I'm thinking that Religious-based Wonders/units would be intriguing. I can barely wait to build the Spanish Inquistion or send Crusaders at my enemies (again).

8. Corporations have the same issue as Religions.. I'd like to see them more as autonomous sub-factions. I'd like to see them spread of their own accord. Maybe you can suggest that the Corporation spreads to such-a-such city but it makes the final decision. Currently it feels more like a communisitic state-controlled system which is kinda bland.

9. Spies need a little more work. I still think the SMAC Probe teams had some more emmersive/useful options. If you cant manipulate your enemies into fighting each other your missing half the point to spies. I'd like to see another Spy unit to represent Covert Ops Teams with more military applications.

10. Space. If the 'future stuff' returns in Civ 5, how about colonizing the moon (or mars)? It gets its own Map which you can switch back and forth to, you build cities, improvements etc. Think Risk 2015-ish. Their would be obviously increased costs to building off-planet, more dangers etc.

I kinda felt Space got overlooked pretty heavily in the Civ series.. no space station, no hubble telescope, no Mars Rover.. really it got one lame Wonder (Apollo Program). So obviously add Satelites (scientific, spy, etc etc) a Space Station national wonder, Mars Rover Wonder, Huble Telescope Wonder.. I can't remember off the top of my head if Seti was even in this version or not.. if not add it.

11. Coming back to the point of modern technology, i kinda felt the tech tree stopped about 10 years ago. Why are their no predator-drones, cyber-warfare, etc. It seems like alot of the technologies developed in the last ten years were just not included (admittedly I realize the game was released a while ago but most of this stuff was around pre-release)

Anyways, thats my 2 cents.. hmm.. okay 11 cents. Best of luck.
 
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