Civilization Fanatics Chess Tournament

Which tournament system to you want? (See below for details.)

  • Round Robin

    Votes: 3 37.5%
  • Swiss

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • Elimination

    Votes: 4 50.0%
  • Don't know or don't care

    Votes: 1 12.5%

  • Total voters
    8

mep

Prince
Joined
Dec 27, 2001
Messages
322
Location
Jerusalem
There has been some interest here for a tournament. I, for reasons as yet to be discerned, volunteered to direct. :rolleyes:

In order to do this, a few details need to be worked out.

First, since you can't have a chess tournament without players, who, besides me, is in?:goodjob:

Second, an official starting date is needed. I'm thinking about March 31 or April 7.

Third, to keep the games moving, a time control is needed. I propose 10 moves in 360 hours. After the tenth move an additional 360 hours would be added for the next 10 moves. This wound give an average of 1.5 days to make your move. Your time is only used when it is your move. Also, it is the responsibility of the player to claim a win by time forfeiture when applicable.

Fourth, the tournament system will be decided by the poll. Irrespective of the system decided, it can be either one game or a two game match (one as black and one as white against each opponent). I prefer the two game match, especially for round robin.

For those who don't know:

Round Robin: each player plays one game/match against every other player.

Swiss: Players are grouped by score and sorted by rating. Each group is divided in two ant the top half plays the bottom half. For example, if after the third round six players have 3 points: 1 plays 4, 2 plays 5, and 3 plays 6.

Elimination: Similar to a Swiss, but players are eliminated after losing a certain number of games (1 for single elimination, 2 for double elimination, etc.).

For a small number of contestants (what I figure the actual case will be), the best system to use is Round Robin. It has the advantage of everybody playing the same number of games, being able to schedule their games themselves somewhat at their own leisure, playing as many games as the can handle, and not having to wait until all (or at least most) of the previous round's games are finished. As the field grows, however, the number of games can be come cumbersome.

Swiss can also be a viable option, unless the field is too small. In a small field you into problems of needing to avoid pairing the same two players more than once. This can greatly upset the advantage of the Swiss in separating the stronger from the weaker, and visa-versa. Also, in a small field, it start to look a lot like a Round Robin, but without the advantages. Should we end up using a Swiss system, the number of rounds will need to be balanced to the size of the field.

The problem with Elimination is that most of the players player play only a few games before they are eliminated. In single elimination, half the players could be eliminated after just one round.

For the most part, how this tournament is organized is open for discussion. And unless there are specific questions to the effect, issues such as adjudication of hopeless positions and tie breaks can be addressed at a later date.

So what do you think?[dance]
 
Round robin seems the fairest.

I don't know how a time limit could work.What happens if we lose the server for a couple days for example?Certainly a reasonable period has to be in play.I can't see waiting 1/2 year for a move ;)
Something like 1 move per day(minimum) and notification if a player is anticipating a delay in posting.Unexpected problems..well they are unexpected so there is no way to notify :)..perhaps if a player is unheard from for..say..5 days?, then that is a forfeit.It may have to be something like:Rd1 starts on xx and must be finished by xx(how long is reasonable for a game?...a month?..2 weeks?

start date should be anytime really,providing there is sufficient interest.It won't be an all day commitment or anything.Just have to visit the site,check your game type thing.

The more players the longer it will take.Prospective participants should keep this in mind.It may run clear thru the summer(in NA)...so if you are whisking away to remote internet-less locations for 2 months of fun and sun...well..it'll be done by the time you got back :D
I'm basing this on postal chess experience which is what we have here..basically.Without the wait of snail mail.
 
Originally posted by Smash
Round robin seems the fairest.

I don't know how a time limit could work.What happens if we lose the server for a couple days for example?Certainly a reasonable period has to be in play. I can't see waiting 1/2 year for a move ;)
Something like 1 move per day(minimum) and notification if a player is anticipating a delay in posting. Unexpected problems..well they are unexpected so there is no way to notify :)..perhaps if a player is unheard from for..say..5 days?, then that is a forfeit.
What I proposed was an average of 1.5 days per move. Posts are time stamped, so it should be easy to calculate. A strict 1 day 1 move could be problematic at times for people. Having X hours for Y moves gives people some flexibility, while keeping the games moving. Should the server go down, the clocks stop. That should be good enough for most cases; special circumstances can be evaluated on a case by case basis.
It may have to be something like:Rd1 starts on xx and must be finished by xx(how long is reasonable for a game?...a month?..2 weeks?
With Round Robin this wouldn't be a problem. But with Swiss, if everybody is waiting on one game, the game can be counted as a draw for the sake of pairing the next round. However, the actual score would be used when it becomes available. This would basicly be an adjournment without the stopage of play. A game in which the position is hopelessly lost (beyond just being lost) or hopelessly drawn, and people are waiting on it, or at the request of one of the players, can be so adjudicated.
start date should be anytime really,providing there is sufficient interest.It won't be an all day commitment or anything.Just have to visit the site,check your game type thing.
An offical start date shouldn't prohibit a game from starting earlier, but rather to make sure the games get started in a timely maner.With prior notification, special arrangements can be made.
The more players the longer it will take.
If we use Double Round Robin, players can play muliple games simultaneously (perhaps it should be a requirment), and in effect shorten the overall length of the tournament.
 
Ok..very good.You seem to have a handle on this.Carry on :)
 
Good idea, I would like to participate.

The system has to depend on the number of people, but I would rather round robin (two game macht) if we are not too many.

For the control of time, 360 hours for 10 movements is ok for me. Not 1 day per movement or something similar because I can only post from Monday to Friday.
 
I´d like to participate, too!
But please not more than 1 move per day, sometimes I have time for much more moves but we also have to see that we are in very different time zones.

I voted elimination, because it will be the fastest! But with less than 7 people a round-robin will be fine, too.
:D
 
So far, including my self, we have three people in and four votes. Furthermore, all three say they want RR, yet there are only two votes for RR and two for elim.

In order for the vote to be useful there needs to some degree of parity.



Edit:
It look's like I crossed with Lucky. But still, it's 2 to 2 instead of 3 to 1.

Oh well. :rolleyes:
 
I like double or triple elimination, organized Swiss style. I'm in.
 
On second thought, I think I like the Round Robin Style. That way, those who can play 2 games at once would be allowed to. Could somebody please change my vote from Elimination to Round Robin?
 
Originally posted by Reddwarfian
On second thought, I think I like the Round Robin Style. That way, those who can play 2 games at once would be allowed to. Could somebody please change my vote from Elimination to Round Robin?

I think Smash (or is it Samus these days? :D) could fix it. If I were given Moderator rights I could change it myself. But barring that, I'll just have to remember to make note of it.
 
So far the following are in:
  1. mep
  2. Smash
  3. Jorge
  4. Lucky
  5. Reddwarfian
  6. Dell19
  7. GenghisK
  8. Caldasar
  9. StormTroppe
    [/list=1]
    Taking into account Reddwarfian's change, the vote is leaning in favour of Round Robin. I'm thinking we should finalize the details on Sunday and then give it until the following Sunday for the games to start. (If both players agree, the game could start earlier.) If there are any late comers they could start late; as long as it isn't too late.

    I think it is fairest if each pairing is a two game match. This way, nobody has any advantage do to color.
 
ok I changed your vote.Didn't even know I could edit polls :D

That also makes it pretty close in the poll.Maybe a RR followed by an elimination.Top 4 in a PAGE Playoff system.1 plays 2>winner thru to final.
3 plays 4>winner plays loser of 1vs2.Loser eliminated.
Winner of that game plays 2 with winner advancing to final.

Maybe thats putting the cart before the horse....

I'm not sure if I should enter or not.8 is a better number than 9 as far as tournaments go also.
 
Originally posted by Smash
I'm not sure if I should enter or not.
:( As you're the #1 ranked player here I was most looking forward to playing you.
8 is a better number than 9 as far as tournaments go also.
For Elimination, eight is better nine, but for Round Robin, it's only one additional match each.

Also, thank you for correcting the poll.
 
We could do it the football way...

Have two groups of 4 and 5 players who play a round robin competition and then the top 2 players from each group play a knockout tournament. This would reduce the amount of games that need to be played quite considerably. At the moment each person will have to play 16 games. If each game takes 40 posts for me then my PC will just rocket up the table...My way the maximum games played would be 12 games

How about having the tournament in a separate forum where the posts do not count?
 
It will be a Double Round Robin. In other words, all participants are to play two games against each opponent;one as White and one as Black. The official starting date is Sunday, March 31, though feel free to start earlier. For the purposes of the time control, the game is considered started either after Black makes his first move or the day both players agree upon, which ever comes first. Barring any objections, I am simplifying the time control. Moves are due by the end of the day following your opponents move. So if your opponent were to make a move at noon, you would have 36 hours for your next move. All times are GMT. In addition, for every 10 moves you get an additional 5 days, cumulative, to consider your moves. If will be needing a recess at some point, please inform your opponent(s) and I in advance. Since everyone has 16 game to be played, please try to play at least 4, preferably 6, games at a time.

I will be starting a thread for the results. As results become available, I will update the chart.

If there are no questions, let the games begin!
 
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