Cold War Project

[academia]

FYI, I´m trying to recognize and classify units collected from apolyton/civfanatics.

BTW, could someone identify these units?

 

[Darius]

Actually I have a change; I forgot about barbs:

1. USA/Israel/South Korea
2. NATO
3. China
4. USSR/Warsaw Pact Members/Cuba
5. Muslims*
6. Latin America
7. India

Barbarian - All other unaligned

It makes sense to make the remainder barbs to me. Since any all-purpose unaligned civ would be unplayable for humans, why not have it be barbs?

Latin America alone? Really? try to convince me

Why not? You have enough slots to have two unaligned civs, so why not have Latin America be one? Would you rather just have an Argentina?

Why? you don´t like it?

It's ok, but it's small even for a gigamap. If you look the one Pap used was considerably bigger. For instance, in Imp1870 England is as big as the England in 2194's original map. What's the point of a gigamap when countries like that are the same size?

 

[Darius]

For those units:

1.
2.
3. A B-52 (you don't recognize a B-52?)
4. Another B-52, with different colors
5.
6. Some MiG, I dunno
7. A Chinese Q-5 Fantan

 

[mordhiem]

Second from right is a MiG-15/17 (They used the same airframe)

Oh and third from right is a Huey Cobra. Military designation AH-1.

 

[academia]

Ok. what about these major powers:

1) USA /Israel/South Korea/Phillipines/Taiwan/Panama
2) USSR /Warsaw Pact/Cuba/North Korea/North Vietnam/Yugoslavia
3) China
4) NATO
5) Arab League /Iran
6) Latin America
7) Non Alligned
8) United Nations or Free World (barbarian civ)

I couldn´t find information about Non-Allgined countries... well, a list of them. So, i have doubts with some countries. Should they stay in the non-alligned civ? or join another group?
Post your ideas.

List of countries:
1) South Africa
2) Japan
3) Australia + New Zealand
4) India

Most of african and asian countries will be included in the United Nations/Free Countries civ.

 

[Ohwell]

The list of your doubtfuls should all be unnaligned. Japan is sort of US dominated but it was pretty much unnaligned anyway, you could make some airbase "units" for US planes as to simulate bases there though. South Africa, definitely. Australia too.

Not sure about India though.

Also, I think North Korea and maybe North Vietnam should be China.

 

[Darius]

I agree; North Vietnam and North Korea to China.

However I don't understand about your list; why are there two unaligned civs? That seems like a waste of a slot to me. IMO there should be one barb unaligned civ, and use the seventh slot for India, or maybe something else.

And can someone give me historical perspective on one thing: just how tied together were the former members of the British Empire once they achieved independence? For instance, if Britain is entangled in a life-or-death war in 1964, what would Australia, Canada, New Zealand, etc. do? I was hoping for some sort of British civ that resembles the British Empire but really only recreates a coherent civilization, not imperial control. But that might not be feasible given your answers to my question.

 

[academia]

think North Korea and maybe North Vietnam should be China.

Ok.

Japan is sort of US dominated but it was pretty much unnaligned anyway, you could make some airbase "units" for US planes as to simulate bases there though.

Great. I like that idea

However I don't understand about your list; why are there two unaligned civs? That seems like a waste of a slot to me. IMO there should be one barb unaligned civ, and use the seventh slot for India, or maybe something else.

I´m not wasting a slot.
I don´t want to be rude... but there are some african countries that... live in extremely bad conditions. I think that it won´t be interesting for a human player to control them. Moreover, they have worse economic and political problems than latin america; most of them live in chaos or civil war. That´s why I leave it to the barbarian AI.
Personally, i don´t like the option of India as a separate tribe. That´s the only explanation

just how tied together were the former members of the British Empire once they achieved independence? For instance, if Britain is entangled in a life-or-death war in 1964, what would Australia, Canada, New Zealand, etc. do? I was hoping for some sort of British civ that resembles the British Empire but really only recreates a coherent civilization, not imperial control

You know, that´s not weird. If you look my original list, you´ll find a "Commonwealth" civilization...
Yes... maybe... i´d like to hear more about this idea, and obtain more info

 

[Darius]

That´s why I leave it to the barbarian AI.

Dude, if you read carefully you'd know I want them to be barbs too. But on your list you had two unaligned civs, one barb and one not:

7) Non Alligned
8) United Nations or Free World (barbarian civ)

I think there should only be one, and it be barb, that's what I was saying.

You know, that´s not weird. If you look my original list, you´ll find a "Commonwealth" civilization... You know, that´s not weird. If you look my original list, you´ll find a "Commonwealth" civilization...

Ok, I just didn't know what it was called or anything; not my forte. But yes, I think that'd be a good idea for slot 7; I'd think that Canada, etc. would side with Britain, so why not? Maybe you should give Case or someone a ring about this; I have no idea just how close these consider or considered themselves.

 

[Ohwell]

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
7) Non Alligned
8) United Nations or Free World (barbarian civ)
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------



I think there should only be one, and it be barb, that's what I was saying.

I think the "third world" nations like africa should be barbs, but others (Like Japan, India, Australia etc) Should be Neutral, because we don't want the US attacking Australia, do we! Neutrals are needed for a neutral side, if they are barb they just attack everyone.

 

[academia]

I think the "third world" nations like africa should be barbs, but others (Like Japan, India, Australia etc) Should be Neutral, because we don't want the US attacking Australia, do we! Neutrals are needed for a neutral side, if they are barb they just attack everyone.

That´s my point. The problem is that some possible "neutral" countries may qualify for other blocks like USA or NATO or Commonwealth.

 

[Darius]

I think the "third world" nations like africa should be barbs, but others (Like Japan, India, Australia etc) Should be Neutral, because we don't want the US attacking Australia, do we!

This isn't the first time a scenario creator has used a barb civ before; all you have to do is give them nothing but defensive units, and/or some units with 0 movement. They do it all the time.

(BTW, hopefully Australia wouldn't be barb if we decide to do a commonwealth civ.)

 

[Case]

Australia and New Zealand were definetly not 'non-alligned'! Australia and NZ had alliances with the US and Britain, and ANZAC troops fought in most of the Cold War's wars (Korea and Vietnam for instance).

Personally, I'd include Australia and NZ as part of the American civ.

 

[Case]

As I just said in a PM to academia, the Commonwealth has been a meaningless institution since 1945.
Despite what people from countries outside the Commonwealth seem to think, it isn't any sort of an alliance, and really ammounts to little more then a mechanism for distributing aid and advice to Britain's poorer ex-colonies.

 

[Darius]

*ignore this post, he posted as I was typing*

 

[Darius]

Despite what people from countries outside the Commonwealth seem to think, it isn't any sort of an alliance, and really ammounts to little more then a mechanism for distributing aid and advice to Britain's poorer ex-colonies.

True, but what about my original question:

For instance, if Britain is entangled in a major, life-or-death war in 1964, what would Australia, Canada, New Zealand, etc. do?

Would these nations (alliance or no alliance) send troops for the fight, or would they stay neutral?

 

[academia]

One question about multiple files (rules and units)
I was looking the TSFE scenario; trying to understand the procedure for "upgrading" units.
For example: in units4.bmp in slot "X" appears a tiger tank.
But in units8.bmp in the same slot "X" appears a P-51

How do you do that? It maybe a connection between rules, science and units. but i don´t get it.

Somebody know how does it work?

 

[Case]

Originally posted by Darius

True, but what about my original question:

For instance, if Britain is entangled in a major, life-or-death war in 1964, what would Australia, Canada, New Zealand, etc. do?

Would these nations (alliance or no alliance) send troops for the fight, or would they stay neutral?

Canada was strongly linked to Britain via NATO, so Canada would have automatically responded with it's full military.

Australia and NZ would have sided with Britain, and would have probably declared war on the attacker, but wouldn't have sent any kind of meaningfull assistance - Australia and NZ were much more concerned about events in the Pacific then in Europe.

 

[Darius]

I think you just have a program that simply changes the names of the files from "unitsx" to "units". Then you just have to be sure to run that program at certain increments.

 

[academia]

Question:
How many nuclear missiles would you like to see? types and quantity