Colonial War Support for Natives [IMPLEMENTED]

[raystuttgart]

The basic idea was suggested by Sarin here.
Let us discuss the concept though.

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New DLL-Diplomacy Event "Colonial War Support for Natives".
I will explicitly keep it relatively simple to not overexagerate my efforts.

Balancing:

This is just a flavor DLL-Diplomacy Event that happens only a few times a game.
But yes, when it triggers it will make a war against Natives a bit more challenging.

• at least 50 turns played before being possible to be triggered first time
  
• at least 50 turns since it was last triggered
• it will of course be XML configurable (like all DLL-Diplomacy Events)

Trigger Conditions:

• Human Player declares War against a Native AI (Colonial AIs can not trigger it)
  
• that Native AI has good Diplomacy Attitude to another Colonial AI
• that Colonial AI has Diplomacy Contact and bad Attitude towards the Human Player

--> basically the Native AI and Colonial AI like each other and both hate you.

Dimplomacy Dialogue:
(Dialogue choices and effects)

A DLL-Diplomacy Dialogue with the Colonial AI will pop up.
The Colonial AI will inform you that you are attacking his Native allies and give you 2 choices:

A) Stopping the War against the Native AI (Declaring Peace)

• peace between you and the Native AI is declared again
  
• the Attitude of the Colonial AI towards you improves a bit
  
• the Attitude of the Native AI towards the Colonial AI improves
  
• the Attitude of the Native AI towards you stays the same (so the effect of declaring a War will not be reverted)

B) Refusing the Demand of the Colonial AI (Continuing the War started)

• the War between you and the Native AI continues
• the Native AI gets Weapons and Horses but loses some of its Gold
• the Colonial AI gets the Gold that the Native AI loses
• the Attitude of the Native AI towards the Colonial AI improves
  
• the Attitude of the Colonial AI towards you gets worse

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Summary:

This is mainly a flavour event, that will be triggered only a few times a game.

The Colonial AI will not directly get involved in the War itself.
(It is mainly used as part of the event story / dialogue for immersion.)

The Native AI will get Weapons and Horses to equip its warriors in the War against you.
The Colonial AI will get Gold. It is basically a Win-Win for both AIs.

Human Player will face a more challenging War with the Native AI.
(If this DLL-Diplomacy Event triggers.)

 

[ConjurerDragon]

Another step to see a full blown "French and Indian War" and the way to it with colonial nations and their native friends and allies at some time in the game

 

[Schmiddie]

I do not really like the event but I can live with it. Since I never declare ware on natives I will not use it. I ever wait until they declare war...

 

[raystuttgart]

I do not really like the event ...

What specifically?
If I knew what you do not like I could try to fix it.

Since I never declare ware on natives I will not use it.

True, this DLL-Diplomacy Event will only trigger if Human Player starts a War with Natives.
(Otherwise I am afraid of doing to much damage to Colonila AIs.)

 

[raystuttgart]

Another step to see a full blown "French and Indian War" ...

Well, this is definitely "a size smaller".
(Mainly to reduce effort and risk of side effects.)

This just gives the Native AI some Weapons and Horses, thus making the War with the Natives a bit more challenging.
The Colonial AI will not actively participate in the War.

 

[Derek Brown]

Would be a fun change and add some realism

 

[Tugboatspotter]

A DLL-Diplomacy Dialogue with the Colonial AI will pop up.
The Colonial AI will inform you that you are attacking his Native allies and give you 2 choices:

A) Stopping the War against the Native AI (Declaring Peace)

• peace between you and the Native AI is declared again
  
• the Attitude of the Colonial AI towards you improves a bit
  
• the Attitude of the Native AI towards the Colonial AI improves
  
• the Attitude of the Native AI towards you stays the same (so the effect of declaring a War will not be reverted)

Suggestion: This could be followed by a chance of a later connected event: %chance King is humiliated and demands war is resumed with a) natives or b) interfering colonial AI (sends military aid) or refusal leads to loss of relations to king.

B) Refusing the Demand of the Colonial AI (Continuing the War started)

• the War between you and the Native AI continues
• the Native AI gets Weapons and Horses but loses some of its Gold
• the Colonial AI gets the Gold that the Native AI loses
• the Attitude of the Native AI towards the Colonial AI improves
  
• the Attitude of the Colonial AI towards you gets worse

Possible further events:
%chance King is outraged at the attempt by another power to interfere and demands the war is escalated to colonial AI (sends military aid)
%chance King is outraged that you have taken it upon yourself to wage war without permission (due to unknowable politics in Europe. Who knows? maybe the King doesn't want to upset relations with a Royal wedding due?). Cease immediately or obtain negative relations with the King.

 

[ConjurerDragon]

Well, this is definitely "a size smaller".
(Mainly to reduce effort and risk of side effects.)

This just gives the Native AI some Weapons and Horses, thus making the War with the Natives a bit more challenging.
The Colonial AI will not actively participate in the War.

Well, you wrote that the relations between the colonial AI nation and the player nation will be lowered if the player refuses to make peace with the natives - so the risk that the AI colonial nation joins in the war is at least rising.

 

[raystuttgart]

... - so the risk that the AI colonial nation joins in the war is at least rising.

True.

 

[raystuttgart]

Suggestion: This could be followed by a chance of a later connected event:
...
Possible further events:

Please, slow down.

Changing 1 DLL-Python-Event into a series of 4 DLL-Python-Event events (that are connected by different decisions) - is really not a small feature anymore.

Also "Colonial War Support for Natives" will already be rare (due to its specific trigger conditions.)
Thus the follow up events you suggest (with other conditions based on your decisions) would be even much rarer.

I would have to invest really a lot of effort into such a DLL-Diplomacy-Event series and many players might never see them in a game.
(If these players always play peacefully with Natives and not declare War on Natives, they will never see any of those.)

Summary:

I offer to implement "Colonial War Support for Natives" and small suggestions for changes are ok.
But efforts for features need to stay realistic for them to be implemented at all.

 

[Coprolover]

The basic idea was suggested by Sarin here.


Human Player will face a more challenging War with the Native AI.
(If this DLL-Diplomacy Event triggers.)

I think it's best not to give the player a choice. That is, if AI supports the aborigines, then it should not miss the moment. With a limit on the number of moves between triggers, the player will be able to make peace and declare war soon. Better to cancel the limit or significantly lower it. + The system needs to be made more flexible. If the player's relationship with the AI colonist is greater than 6-10, he will offer peace. If relations are neutral, then he will arm the natives. If the relationship is less than 3, then he will enter the war on the side of the tribe.

 

[raystuttgart]

I almost forgot about this one here ...
(So many concepts and ideas, so little time.)

 

[raystuttgart]

Just bumping "ACCEPTED" old concepts so they get further up in the queue again.

 

[raystuttgart]

Bumping this again, because it will be the next feature I implement.

 

[raystuttgart]

This feature is now also fully implemented.

The only differences:

1) I decided to not give the Natives Weapons and Horses, but to directly give it Units.
(So it looks like the other Colonial Player actually organized real support - although letting the Natives pay for it - see below.)

2) The other Colonial AI does not end up getting the gold the Natives pay - after all it is needed to equip the Troops it sends for support.
(Otherwise e.g. the Dutch in this Test Case would have ended up too powerful after getting 8000 of Mayan gold "for free".)

Comment:
The amount of Units the Natives get actually depends on the amount of Gold the Native Nation has. *
(They actually pay for it - meaning if they have no gold, they cannot acquire Unit, which a smart player might use.)

* If the Native Nation has absolutley no money it still gets at least a single Ranger.
(Also it will spawn itself a Great Warrior to lead its army into battle.)

 

[DMP]

Seems very cool and can I ask if we see English AI has war with natives,there is also change this event can happen and we see the message "rumors say that they get support from other colonies" or this event is for human players ?

 

[raystuttgart]

This event is for human players ?

It is basically just for Human Players, because another colonial AI would / should just always accept the peace.
(AI could get a huge problem if the Native AI it is currently at war with gets an additional army.)

However I did not feel like forcing another Colonial AI to end a war with its Native neighbour either.
(Player would at least know if it would make sense for him or not.)

 

[DMP]

Aha ok understand, but still I like it , good job !

 

[lethiel]

Very cool. Pitty that/ if they don't get horsemen though as they appear so/ too rarely in the game.