Colonies IV BetaTesters' Thread

John Im going to start a playtest tonight but Im going to change some stuff first. From the thread it looks like:

Change SCA to +9 and Bayonet to +7.

Royal Cannon to higher attack value and lower hit points. (What numbers are you thinking of?)

Air Superiority for natives.

Stronger Colonies (Sounds like a .scn change, Ill wait for 0.4)

Firelocks to 5/3*/2.

These are pretty quick changes and Id like to see how they work before the weekend. And then post here with comments. Could you share your new numbers for the Royal Cannon? Thats a big change IMHO and will change the way one has to play seiging the European Cities with Fortifications and castles.

Thanks John Im still having fun with this one BTW. Keep up the good work and start storing the beer outside!:D
 
Originally posted by Ramsses
John, I PM'ed you yesterday but I didn't received anything back.
Can you please look in your PM box?
Click to expand...

Its best to email John he doesn't check PM s much.
 
John I finally did the rules.txt changes and im going to play for a couple hours tonight and then post.

I couldn't help but notice the nil for the Royal palace.

John are we going to do that again ala boney 2?

If so in SP it needs to be buildable for MP ok?

Why are you always trying to torture me? Dont you know Im a sensitive guy? NOT! :D

Seroiusly John that needs to be changed for MP.
 
Originally posted by Patient English
Steve, it's "nil" not "no". That means it has no prerequisite to build. It can always be built. Even by you.

:D
Click to expand...

Thank god. John you know how I get when you torture me!:D
 
OK John got to Jan 1665. ( I played the dam Frogs as usual)

First of all Firelocks. I changed the numbers as you suggested earlier but still not a lot of AI builds. I saw 4 in York, but checked about twenty other cities maybe more and I didn't see any.

Techs researched or traded.
Pend Clock
Central Admin
Canals
Economics
Flintlock
Diplo Policy
Joint Stock
Mercantilism
Corp Law
Const Monarchy
Mechanics
Metallurgy
Refining
State Bureaocracy?
Steam Engine
Transport Network
State Const?
Almost researched West India Company about 5 or 6 turns away. If it had a question mark I m not not sure if researched or I had it at the beginning.

I stayed in despostism (Monarchy), and of course this time the Spanish went to Const Monarchy early.

Final gold status was 262 income vs 250 expenses at a 50%-50% split between reserch and taxes. O% luxuries of course.

What is it about this game that the Brits DO NOT like the French. I cant keep them happy. Went to war with em three times. They declared war ALL three times. First time I took plymouth to make peace. Second Time I destroyed that city near Latour Harbor in Nova Scotia. Third time I they just got tired of war and settled for Peace. Limeys what a pain in the but!:D

I changed Bayonet and SCA but I dont think anyone got that far in 1665.

I built Joint Stock company.

Spanish built Proto Industrialization and Independants built City corp and spanish built Corps diplomatic.

Thats about it. I dont think the Firelock idea worked, but maybe the other civs didnt have the tech long enough?

It seemed like I lost less shipping only a couple usually it seems like I lose about 10 or so at this point. Did you change that? I never got past carracks and galleons. Maybe it was just the luck of the draw.

Everyone else stayed at peace with me and freely traded techs. Im at the level below Diety.

I built four cities in Canada and one city in Guianna (south america)

I found the slave hole near timbuctu after I made the slaves into air superiority. Took awhile to get a pikeman and Arq. ashore and then got about 6 or 7 slaves over about 20 years.

I did not see slaves at the location near the coast but there was an English city there, the brits might have gotten those slaves.

I guess I didn't see a lot of change in cannon going 2 up attack and two down HP. It seemed like the possibility of winning the attack was more random. Is that possible? Or maybe it was terrain related. On the flats the cannons ruled. On the hills the cannons sputtered out. Is that possible?

BTW I tend to agree with Chris on the happiness improvement. I dont think one more is going to kill us and it will be a hard choice between building that and building gold generating improvements. When you look at this for the entire scenario world I dont think there are as amny folks as you think that consider happiness issues that you cant do anything about "intrigueing". Just a thought before you final up the mechanics. If it will make you happy think about doing a "pub". At least it relates to drinking. :D:D

One last question when does one become able to build or improve to the Plantation? I obviously haven't gotten that far yet but I was just wondering. Also what does it do? Food or food and trade?

Im done till sunday, have fun!

SKI :D
 
Ski, the Plantation is all trade arrows, you get them from slaves changing Jungle or swamps.

Also, about the African slaves, the AI tends to have more after 1700.

Just in case your interested, I have now plyed the scenario three times, to the end, as England, Catholic League, and Holland.
 
Just posting to get notifications...

BTW sorry for lack of comments, I've barely had time these past weeks for my PBEM turns let alone very long playtests. :( I'll try to get through 0.4 sometime this week.
 
Originally posted by Darius
BTW sorry for lack of comments, I've barely had time these past weeks for my PBEM turns let alone very long playtests. :(
Click to expand...

Yes, me too, I fear the people at the PBEM forums might be getting a little pissed with me... :(

The scenario looks promising!
 
Originally posted by Alcibiaties of Athenae
Ski, the Plantation is all trade arrows, you get them from slaves changing Jungle or swamps.
Click to expand...

Is there a tech you need to do that Chris?
 
No, you just need to give the Slaves the transform order ["O"] when on jungle or swamp.

0.4 later tonight if I can finish the last tweaks and ReadMe file. (Just got back from my brothers' Birthday Weekend....) There are lots of changes, but I have withheld a few unit tweaks because I want to discuss them with all of you first.
 
John

Maybe we should talk first. If you get the issues posted we can begin the round table discussion while you are completing the other changes. Sound like a plan?:D
 
Sounds like a plan.

The main issue I want to discuss, before re-balancing the entire game, is the issue of terrain bonuses. It seems reasonable to me that a hill or river would give the defender a bonus, but the 50% minimum value can be very unbalancing.

As you were saying Steve, a Royal Cannon rules on the plain, but even 3 or 4 can sometimes achieve not a lot when fighting in the Hills. A Fort on a River/Hill is almost unassailable.

Now, that might be OK, and we are certainly used to it in Civ. However, if I made the terrains ALL have defence bonuses, and adjusted the fighting strength of units to compensate, I could reduce the RELATIVE differences. A hill, defending at say 250%, would be better but not massively better than open terrain at say 200%. Even the presence of a river as well means 300% vs 200%, effectively halving the bonus you get by default (200% vs 100%) .

Attack values would increase to match. Now, judging where to pitch the values and rebalancing all the units, and playtesting them, might take quite a while. Do you think the idea is worth the effort, and if so, what are your bids for the values....?

Other than that, if I remove the Plague unit, I have a spare slot. Perhaps a Cuirassier-type unit? The Dragoons are quite weak, really. The Cuirassier unit would need its own tech, but I could do that. Thoughts?
 
John, I suggest you be VERY careful about unit production cost in this scenario.

Since almost all the types of gov have zero free support, it's very dangerous to require two or three cannon to destroy a defensive unit, as cities are limited by the cut down shield productin, the happiness problems, and the monetary problems.

If you make seiges TOO dificult, it will be virtually immpossible to build a viable army.
You will cause a status quo in MP, and the AI will overwhelm the players.

Remember, balence FUN with FACT to produce BALENCE.

If you recreate the historical model 100%, it simply won't be fun on the civ-2 engine.
 
John

Your idea about the terrain bonues's sounds intrigueing. And if we have to playtest more to make this a killer scenario then so be it.

I just want you to know that I agree with Chris 100%, we need to acheive balance. See below.

Originally posted by Alcibiaties of Athenae
Remember, balence FUN with FACT to produce BALENCE.
Click to expand...

Id like to hear from some of the other experienced scenario experienced scenario designers, maybe some of them have tried this and have insight?
 
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