Colonization mod...
- Thread starter Dikaioma
- Start date
just to add me to the list of interested: me and a friend also tried to play "colo" a few months ago - but we couldn't - not technically, but because of the graphics. we're just not used to these screen resolutions anymore.
so, yes!, a colo-mod would be great!
so, yes!, a colo-mod would be great!
eatcarrotsnow
Chieftain
- Joined
- Jul 10, 2002
- Messages
- 30
Is anyone helping you, or do you want to work solo?
I'm simply trying to gauge the situation. I've worked on plenty mods, but I don't know anything about python, and am limited in time right now. But, the only reason I bought Civ IV was to try and turn it into a colonization mod. I certainly don't want to speak for you, or sign you up to do something that was not your original intention.
I do want to get people working on this kind of total conversion project if there is any way I can. Please let me know what you think.
I'm simply trying to gauge the situation. I've worked on plenty mods, but I don't know anything about python, and am limited in time right now. But, the only reason I bought Civ IV was to try and turn it into a colonization mod. I certainly don't want to speak for you, or sign you up to do something that was not your original intention.
I do want to get people working on this kind of total conversion project if there is any way I can. Please let me know what you think.
Well, I want to help also if I can. I still need to get serious about learning python though.
I actually went home for the holiday and found my old Colonization game (for DOS on three 3.5" disks, remember those days?) and the manual.
If we all want to do a true conversion of the original game than I think that we can work together if we want to. If we want to make a Colonization II then we'd probably spend a lot of time trying to figure out how the game will play and I know I'd have different ideas than others so that may cause problems.
I'm up for a true (as close as we can) conversion so . . . Dikaioma, eatcarrotsnow, anyonelse? What say you?
I have been tweaking around with the XML a bit and I have Java experience, so I should be able to get a handle on python. I have never done a mod like this before, but I really want to mod and I really liked Colonization.
I actually went home for the holiday and found my old Colonization game (for DOS on three 3.5" disks, remember those days?) and the manual.
If we all want to do a true conversion of the original game than I think that we can work together if we want to. If we want to make a Colonization II then we'd probably spend a lot of time trying to figure out how the game will play and I know I'd have different ideas than others so that may cause problems.
I'm up for a true (as close as we can) conversion so . . . Dikaioma, eatcarrotsnow, anyonelse? What say you?
I have been tweaking around with the XML a bit and I have Java experience, so I should be able to get a handle on python. I have never done a mod like this before, but I really want to mod and I really liked Colonization.
As I said before, I haven't modded anything in a while. Last mod I did was for red alert. I've never messed with python, so this is totally new. I have tried making total conversion mods, but those are pretty time consuming to do by yourself - especially if you may not be skilled in certain areas, like graphics. I kinda put this thread up as an informal "recruitment" so to speak, because I knew there would be people who would love to see a new colonization. So count me in.
eatcarrotsnow
Chieftain
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- Jul 10, 2002
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Aye. Count me in too.
Maybe we should discuss where to begin. For example, what basic changes we need to make in order to transform Civ IV to play like Colonization.
Maybe we should discuss where to begin. For example, what basic changes we need to make in order to transform Civ IV to play like Colonization.
Well, let's see. There was another thread around here talking about colonization, and they were discussing how to get the founding fathers. We decided that the founding fathers would just use the tech tree, and that declaring independance would either be a technology, or a national project. The thing is, if I remember correctly, is that you needed your entire population to be at a certain percentage of rebels to declare independance. So, how could we emulate that? Use the culture model in civ4? I think it should be a national project at any rate.
Another unique item in the game is the trading with the mother country. This one has me absolutely stumped. Is this even modable? Do we need the sdk for this? In colonization, you reached the edge of the map and headed off to the motherland. There was a seperate screen for old world trading. Then we have the goods from the new world. Would the goods be units?
Here is my idea. We can create the ore unit. There would be triggers that spawn these ore units. For instance, if your colony has ore in it's radius and someone was working that square. Upon creation, it would have X amount of health, where X would be the amount of ore the ore unit has. In colonization, your colony had certain starting buildings. I do not remember all of them right now, but for instance, I think you started with a blacksmith shop. The thing is you couldn't use the shop unless you had ore in the warehouse. We can make modifiers that would add or subtract from the ore unit depending on what was going on in the colony. The same could be used for muskets/horse/tools whenever you equipped a colonist. Which brings me to my next point...
In colonization, you had your base units, like colonist, statesmen, fishermen or whatever. These guys could be equipped with those items. I guess this wouldn't be too hard if we use the ore idea, for instance, a statesman becoming a dragoon when you equip him with muskets and horses. The game would get rid of the statesman and create a dragoon and subtract 50 from both your musket and horse units. If those units became 0, the game would just get rid of the musket/horse unit. Also, how could we use XP in this game? Keep the XP model, or use it for something else? I haven't made up my mind.
I dunno, all this seems ineffecient, and I don't understand python yet. This was the things I would do for other games I tried to mod, but weren't very mod friendly, so you would have to "hijack", so to speak, their programming language and kind of trick the game into working differently. It probably wouldn't be necassary to do it this way with python. Alright, your turn!
Another unique item in the game is the trading with the mother country. This one has me absolutely stumped. Is this even modable? Do we need the sdk for this? In colonization, you reached the edge of the map and headed off to the motherland. There was a seperate screen for old world trading. Then we have the goods from the new world. Would the goods be units?
Here is my idea. We can create the ore unit. There would be triggers that spawn these ore units. For instance, if your colony has ore in it's radius and someone was working that square. Upon creation, it would have X amount of health, where X would be the amount of ore the ore unit has. In colonization, your colony had certain starting buildings. I do not remember all of them right now, but for instance, I think you started with a blacksmith shop. The thing is you couldn't use the shop unless you had ore in the warehouse. We can make modifiers that would add or subtract from the ore unit depending on what was going on in the colony. The same could be used for muskets/horse/tools whenever you equipped a colonist. Which brings me to my next point...
In colonization, you had your base units, like colonist, statesmen, fishermen or whatever. These guys could be equipped with those items. I guess this wouldn't be too hard if we use the ore idea, for instance, a statesman becoming a dragoon when you equip him with muskets and horses. The game would get rid of the statesman and create a dragoon and subtract 50 from both your musket and horse units. If those units became 0, the game would just get rid of the musket/horse unit. Also, how could we use XP in this game? Keep the XP model, or use it for something else? I haven't made up my mind.
I dunno, all this seems ineffecient, and I don't understand python yet. This was the things I would do for other games I tried to mod, but weren't very mod friendly, so you would have to "hijack", so to speak, their programming language and kind of trick the game into working differently. It probably wouldn't be necassary to do it this way with python. Alright, your turn!
eatcarrotsnow
Chieftain
- Joined
- Jul 10, 2002
- Messages
- 30
A colony begins with these buildings, just for clarification:
Town Hall - 1 Liberty Bell on its own
Carpenter's Shop
Blacksmith's House
Fur Trader's House
Rum Distiller's House
Tobacconist's House
Weaver's House
Town Hall - 1 Liberty Bell on its own
Carpenter's Shop
Blacksmith's House
Fur Trader's House
Rum Distiller's House
Tobacconist's House
Weaver's House
So I've been reading through the Colonization manual and I actually got the game to work on my machine. As Dikaioma pointed out, there are a lot of things in Colonization that are just not in Civ IV.
The whole ore unit idea is pretty good. I must say though that it is replacing a rather simple stockpile/counter with something more complicated.
Here are some thoughts:
I really want to think that we could revamp the city screen to have inventory. Civ also has great leader points which spawn a GL when it reaches a goal. This could be used for the crosses and a new colonist could spawn when it reaches the goal # of crosses. Maybe when this happens we could have a colonist spawn in the European city and be ready for pickup at the edge of the map? (don't know how to do this with a random map however).
I think that this is a good idea on where we should begin. Maybe we can also figure out what does not need to be changed to transform Civ IV to play like Colonization.
The whole ore unit idea is pretty good. I must say though that it is replacing a rather simple stockpile/counter with something more complicated.
Here are some thoughts:
I really want to think that we could revamp the city screen to have inventory. Civ also has great leader points which spawn a GL when it reaches a goal. This could be used for the crosses and a new colonist could spawn when it reaches the goal # of crosses. Maybe when this happens we could have a colonist spawn in the European city and be ready for pickup at the edge of the map? (don't know how to do this with a random map however).
eatcarrotsnow said:
I think that this is a good idea on where we should begin. Maybe we can also figure out what does not need to be changed to transform Civ IV to play like Colonization.
I always liked the city building schema in Colonization better than the one in Civ. Especially since Colonization used squares, rather than these idiotic, nonsensical, why-the-hell-have-they-changed-everything-BUT-this, fat crosses of the Civ genre.
If you can figure out how to make a city radius extend only a square, or a super-square (the missing four tiles on the stupidly conceived Civ cross), this'll be a huge advance for both Colonization AND Civilization.
Max
If you can figure out how to make a city radius extend only a square, or a super-square (the missing four tiles on the stupidly conceived Civ cross), this'll be a huge advance for both Colonization AND Civilization.
Max
eatcarrotsnow
Chieftain
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- Jul 10, 2002
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So what are the initial thoughts on what we can keep?
I'm happy with the World Layout and City screens.
My concern is in the scale of the map. I play with Bluemarble, but I definately like the map from the American Revolution scenario better. Maybe we should limit the scale of the map.
Of course, I never played with the original map in Colonization either. I used a map that basically was only N. America, specifically the original thirteen colonies. I wouldn't want to limit anyone to just this section.
I'm happy with the World Layout and City screens.
My concern is in the scale of the map. I play with Bluemarble, but I definately like the map from the American Revolution scenario better. Maybe we should limit the scale of the map.
Of course, I never played with the original map in Colonization either. I used a map that basically was only N. America, specifically the original thirteen colonies. I wouldn't want to limit anyone to just this section.
eatcarrotsnow
Chieftain
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- Jul 10, 2002
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Is this still a project?
t-force
Chieftain
eatcarrotsnow said:
I'd be intrigued to know if this is still a WiP. I loved Colonization, and do give it a go every now again - DOSbox and VDMsound are great programmes! - but I'd love to see a modern re-working.
Much as though I'd like to offer my skills and help people with the mod, I have no programming skills at all!!
