COTM 23 pre-game discussion

[Redbad]

Moving away from the Settler rather than towards it does involve a risk of having to retrack some steps. We still have no clue to what is hidden in the middle of the map north of the foggy mountain.

It's a risk too having to decide where to settle without knowing what's east of the hills. The settler has to go through the middle. When the worker goes east we'll know in four or five turns if it's worth settle in the middle, in the east or even investigate south.

btw. I won't pop the hut rightaway but wait for Seoul.

 

[Redbad]

Conquest-Class Bonuses:

• Start with Warrior Code. (In addition to Bronze Working and Alphabet)
• Start with 20 gold.

Predator-Class Equalisers:

• Start without Bronze Working.

I find the equalisers intriguing.

For conquest warrior code is handy for killing the odd barb, but what mountains can be moved by 20 gold? If, as Gyathaar states, the map is our greatest enemy, the conquest bonuses hardly help.

The predator equaliser doesn’t look very impressive either. It’s warlord level, so our top-players will have little difficulty achieving any VC they like. One of the few challenges one can think of is beating good players who play at open level. I wonder if taking away bronze will be noticed by them.

 

[Gyathaar]

The predator equaliser doesn’t look very impressive either. It’s warlord level, so our top-players will have little difficulty achieving any VC they like. One of the few challenges one can think of is beating good players who play at open level. I wonder if taking away bronze will be noticed by them.

True.. but I didnt have any other good idea for what to change to make it harder.. I dont want to take away alphabet for several reasons, and making the AIs stronger would in many ways be an advantage instead of disadvantage when on warlord for stronger players - I guess I can take away their 10 gold too

 

[Più Freddo]

I didnt have any other good idea for what to change to make it harder

Did you consider changing the cost factor or removing the scientific trait?

 

[Più Freddo]

It's a risk too having to decide where to settle without knowing what's east of the hills.

Settling is always a risk, but it has to be taken. In a GOTM, I expect to be able to settle fairly close to the starting position of the simple reason that the competition otherwise gets too infested with randomness (and rewards for cheating). Therefore moving the Worker away from the Settler would appear to increase the risk as we can judge it at present.

 

[Redbad]

I follow your reasoning. But it would imply that the settling area is in the middle, as it's the only area that can be settled within say four or five turns. However after the second move of the settler the middle area can be evaluated. At least to an extend if there are only mountains or some decent soil too. When it looks promising then the worker can step back and therefor only loose two turns. When the middle doesn't look promising then the worker steps east and we'll be able to judge the eastern situation.

Edit: one could even consider not to move the worker the first turn. And after the second settler move decide to move the worker east or north.

 

[Redbad]

Maybe it's a good idea to give the conquest players an extra spear or archer. It looks like it may take some time before Seoul will be founded. In the previous COTM it was certainly possible to stumble across some barbs before the capitol was founded.

 

[killerkid]

Since Gyathaar said if we were blue there would be 3 different civs with similar colors. It's definitly the Germans, since there default AND alternate color are blue, and I also think maybe the hittites, since they're still blue, but not exactly the German blue. It can't be maya, because they're alternate color is American blue.

So, the Germans and the Hittites are two of our rivals. Germany starts with WC, and BW, and we don't have warrior code. The Hittites start with pottery and alpha, and we don't have pottery. So for beginning research (whenever we get our city built) I'd do Writing.

 

[plarq]

Since Gyathaar said if we were blue there would be 3 different civs with similar colors. It's definitly the Germans, since there default AND alternate color are blue, and I also think maybe the hittites, since they're still blue, but not exactly the German blue. It can't be maya, because they're alternate color is American blue.

So, the Germans and the Hittites are two of our rivals. Germany starts with WC, and BW, and we don't have warrior code. The Hittites start with pottery and alpha, and we don't have pottery. So for beginning research (whenever we get our city built) I'd do Writing.

Check the open post, I see Gyathaar had stated 7 rivals clearly. No German or Hitties.

 

[Gyathaar]

Did you consider changing the cost factor or removing the scientific trait?

I could remove the scientific trait I guess..

 

[Gyathaar]

Changed the Conquest and Predator bonuses.

 

[Abegweit]

Can you get a worker if the settler builds next to the goody hut? I don't think so because the GH is opened before the city is founded.

I'm pretty sure of this so... Settler north and, if that doesn't reveal anything interesting, the worker goes east. If there's still nothing interesting by the time the decision needs to be made, I open the GH and start working the square.

 

[Più Freddo]

Predator-Class Equalisers:

• Start without Bronze Working.
• Scientific trait removed.

Ouch! What have I done? What have I done?

 

[King Of America]

I have a low-resolution screen.

That's why I don't see the Galley, right?

 

[DJMGator13]

I see Gyathaar is spreading his SGOTM love into a new area.

I hope the restless barbs don't randomly affect the start. The area to the south will give 2 fishes and some gold but without a harbor there will be limited food. I think I'd go ahead and explore eastward with the worker, other than clearing marsh there doesn't appear to be much for him to do.

If this game follows recent lower difficulty games we can expect to be vastly outsized and behind in techs throughout much of the AA. The additional starting units for the AI's usually means settlers. Republic slingshot might even be in question if we can only build 2 cities with limited growth.

 

[Megalou]

These staff guys are good - I'm tempted to make a comeback.

I would not have popped the hut with the worker, unless it were monarch or above. If monarch or above, there would have been a risk of popping barbs, but you can't pop barbs if you have no military. With warlord, the risk for barbs is non-existant anyway.

The direction of the worker is, however, conditioned by one more thing. If there is another food bonus besides the whale, settling in that area would have been possible. We can already see that there are at least two tiles with 2f in a southern location, so settling there would have been my first choice. (Note the "woulds"; I'm not making that comeback.)

 

[Megalou]

On the other hand, have you guys considered that you may pop a town, which would be much less valuable later? The way back to the hut may also be blocked by barbs for some time.

 

[Abegweit]

Towns are a good thing.They can always be abandoned for a worker.

 

[Abegweit]

I hope the restless barbs don't randomly affect the start.

Good point. Turning barbs off might be a good idea.

 

[Gyathaar]

I have never had a problem with early barb arracks in any of my test games (and believe me.. the first versions was much worse than the current version..)

Btw.. also remember you get a 400% bonus vs barbs on warlord