[BTS] Defensive AI behavior.

[TheBirdMan]

I do wonder (no, not wonder - merely miss), that the AI is able to use their artillery and airplanes much better when they are under attack.

I say, when I see an enemystack - land or naval, doesn't matter for me - approaching, then I use all I can find to bombard them with as soon as they are within reach before they arrives at my shores/cities. All counts. But the AI doesn't do that when I attack them. At least not in a way, that it's something I really have to count with.

The AI do use units to attack my units directly causing CollateralDamage as soon as they "see me", but the AI doesn't use Howitzers, EmplacedHeavyBatteries, fighters or bombers - what-ever - to weaken me first even when those units are present in nearby cities. It seems like the AI more-or-less only uses those units offensive.

I'm only playing the Realism:Invictus mod and even in that mod, I can move troops next to an enemycity without being shot at.


When it is so in RI, then I guess it is so in every (or nearly every) other existing mod.


Isn't that issue a little interesting for skilled modders????

 

[Lennier]

RI is a mod; base game there's no bombarding at a distance from land units. So the lack of the AI using that capability in RI may be a function of the engine not knowing how to.

 

[TheBirdMan]

During the years, there have been many things in CIV4 - including the [BTS] expansion - that the game-engine couldn't handle in a decent way on behalf of the AI.

But most often, if a solution could be found - it was found.


OK, I havn't tried CallToPower II nor have I tried CIV5 or CIV6. But else I have played CIV-games since the first version came out about 30 years ago. CIV4[BTS] with the latest version of the R:I mod is IMHO the best and most challenging civ-game you can play right now.


But you know: More wants more. And that is why I ask........ .

 

[PPQ_Purple]

Just play FFH and its submods than. They completely change things up and make everything more interesting by diverging from the standard formula and into fantasy.

 

[The_Reckoning]

In FFH (I recommend MNAI-U currently) the AI does use its mage abilities. They cleverly chose either use the things the AI could, or provide it the ability to do so properly.

 

[TheBirdMan]

Sorry to mention it - but this thread isn't about FFH..........

 

[The_Reckoning]

Oh but it is, from your OP - you're accusing modders in general supposedly of not figuring out how to make the AI use the things they added in Realism Invictus. FFH is entirely pertinent to that topic as it's evidence to the contrary.

On the other hand, this forum isn't for Realism Invictus, that's here:
https://forums.civfanatics.com/forums/civ4-realism-invictus.202/

So which is it? Your thread is about mods in general - in which case FFH is pertinent - or it's exclusively complaining about RI - in which case it's in the wrong place.

 

[TheBirdMan]

Wrong my friend.

I'm not accusing anyone. Just trying to catch someones interest. A person or some persons, that is/are/could be/might be able to come up with "something" useful.


My reason not to post this in the RI forums (there are more than one RI-forum active, even here on this site) is, that the team who made the mod isn't that active anymore when it comes to bigger changes. Make the graphic better, correct bugs, adding a little new feature..... yes, that is still done. Walter H and (as far as I know) a few more is doing all they can. But I do not expect him/them to accept such a "challenge".

 

[TheBirdMan]

Seek and you shall find.


Looks like there is an old mod, where this actually works (see 2nd post from kara42): https://forums.civfanatics.com/threads/ai-not-using-ranged-bombardment.469243/

 

[Snowygerry]

[...]
The AI do use units to attack my units directly causing CollateralDamage as soon as they "see me", but the AI doesn't use Howitzers, EmplacedHeavyBatteries, fighters or bombers - what-ever - to weaken me first even when those units are present in nearby cities. It seems like the AI more-or-less only uses those units offensive.

That is not entirely correct - tactical bombers do attack my attacking forces in a 'defensive' manner, just not artillery.

May be worthwhile to examine the difference in exact coding between both for someone with knowledge of such things.

Also playing RI btw.

 

[vincentz]

I made a ranged attack that the AI embraces in my mod. Almost too much Ships from Frigate and forward also have the ability to range strike (again, too much, as ships should attack directly if odds are good enough, but thats on my todolist). The AI also uses planes to defend. I used the already integrated rangestrike in the gamecore, and modified it, but not heavily (except for the return fire feature), so dont know why it doesnt work on RI.
Maybe they use a wrong AI type?

 

[TheBirdMan]

Passive defence is - at least as I see it - when a unit is able to damage a unit on another tile without leaving "its own" tile and without taking any damage itself. And that is where I see the "problem".

An AI can bombard a human player and a human player can counter-bombard an AI when it becomes his/her turn.
A human can bombard an AI - but the AI do not counter-bombard when it becomes the AIs turn. It might attack the human the simple and normal way. But the AI (most often) takes casualties and that isn't to use it's bombardment abilities in a passive way.



@ Snowgerry: I think tactical bombers actually do attack same way as any landunit would do. They have to "leave" their tile to attack you where you are.



@vincentz: I havn't played your mod, so I don't know how your ships range-strike is working.

As for airplanes: If you think on the interception of incomming planes - no matter if the human or the AI attacks - then this part is working in R:I.