Deposed cities

[mikeinmukilteo]

Is there a way to not allow this to occur? By that, I mean a game override or setting. I thought I had read there was, but can't seem to find it.

Thanks for your help.

 

[Calis]

Is there a way to not allow this to occur? By that, I mean a game override or setting. I thought I had read there was, but can't seem to find it.

Thanks for your help.

There is an option to "prevent cultural conversions" when creating a new game.

 

[mikeinmukilteo]

Where is that option? The only things I can find are under RULES, and these only allow or disallow victory conditions.

 

[Calis]

Where is that option? The only things I can find are under RULES, and these only allow or disallow victory conditions.

On the same screen as the victory conditions, you'll find the option for disabling culture flips. I am not sure, but I think it's called cultural conversions.

In the evening I can give you a screeny.

 

[Menacing Wolf]

Is there a strategy where you can prevent your population from joining another city? What can you build or make to prevent that?

 

[Raliuven]

If you are talking about cultural flips, just make sure you have more culture than the opposing nations. So if your city does not, at the very least, control the immediate 8 tiles around the city, you have a problem. Anytime another Civ's boarders are pushing your boarders away, that is where you can look for immediate problems. To prevent the flip you have some options.

First, flips occur in part based upon the number of foreign citizens are in the city - those are citizens not of your culture. A city that is in a riot because of unhappiness is particulary vulnerable to flips. Either starve down the native population or make sure they are happy. At higher levels you may find that starving the city is the only way to keep it under control, but it won't help your world reputation any. To make people happy, build marketplaces (in non-corrupted cities) - this increases revenue and happiness.

Second, make sure you've got more culture then the neighboring civ. One way is to remove the neighboring civ. If you are trying to be peaceful, then build cultural buildings. Many people prefer libraries and other educational buildings because it helps with research as well. Temples and religious buildings will do the trick and increase happiness (you'll find players are divided on the usefulness of religious buildings). Wonders also give culture but they are costly to build and I would be weary of putting one in a city that is already under cultural attack. The Forbidden Palace gives culture but can flip. Only your capital city is immune.

Third, garrison the city. The more troops you have in the city, the less the chance of a flip. But if it does flip, you lose ALL of the garrison troops. I think most experience players just park their army outside the city and if the city flips, they retake the city the next round. This had the added benefit of 'killing' one of the population which is basically the same as starving them down.

Finally, once espionage is on the tech table, the AI loves to use it to cause your border cities to flip. If you are in Democracy, you are immune to this. Otherwise it can be very annoying, particulary because the AI can do it without starting a war and you need to declare on them to get it back.

You'll find that at higher levels, many players will sack the city for the slave workers and just replace it with one of their own nationality. It is less work and far safer (though not foolproof).

 

[MysteryX]

If you play a Religious civilization, almost all the culture flips will be your opponents' cities defecting to join you. Just build those religious buildings early because you build them fast, and go with Democracy because you only suffer 1 turn of anarchy when you switch governments.

 

[ChaosArbiter]

To make people happy, build marketplaces (in non-corrupted cities) - this increases revenue and happiness.

To clarify, Marketplaces increase the effect of Luxury Resources after the first two. A Marketplace by itself doesn't affect Happiness or Luxury at all.

 

[Calis]

Here you can see, where to uncheck to disallow cultural conversions:

 

[Raliuven]

To clarify, Marketplaces increase the effect of Luxury Resources after the first two. A Marketplace by itself doesn't affect Happiness or Luxury at all.

Sorry, should have explained better. Thanks for clarifying that. I didn't intend to be misleading.

 

[mikeinmukilteo]

Thanks for you help. It looks like I can't kill off the cultural flips from the games. That screenshot must be from a different edition; I have vanilla.

If cities depose in the first half of the game, I figure it is deserved. But it is annoying late in the game when you take over a city, only to have it flip immediately (or very soon) back to its original civ.

 

[GamezRule]

That Screenshot is from Conquests/Complete. I thought it was the same for Vanilla. I have only played about 100 turns in Vanilla though.

 

[ChaosArbiter]

If cities depose in the first half of the game, I figure it is deserved. But it is annoying late in the game when you take over a city, only to have it flip immediately (or very soon) back to its original civ.

In the late-game, unless you've been really slacking as far as expansion goes, you should be able to get away with burning cities down. Sure, you'll take attitude hits, but unless the city is really important (major wonders or something), you'll get at least as much productivity by destroying the city and replacing it with your own, then joining 2-3 Settlers to get a size 6 city right off the bat - assuming, of course, that you need the city to begin with. If you just need them for the Domination limit, a loose spread with a Temple or Library to fill in the gaps should be perfect.

 

[Jyhawk]

If an AI has been eliminated and you have some slaves from that AI, how does it affect the new/deposed city if you join those slave workers to the city?

 

[Calis]

If an AI has been eliminated and you have some slaves from that AI, how does it affect the new/deposed city if you join those slave workers to the city?

Once an AI civ has been eliminated, you can join its slave workers to your cities without affecting the flip risk. There is no civ to flip back to.

Don't ever join barbarian slaves (created by Maya javelin thrower), as you are always at war with thet"civ".

But anyhow, think carefully about joining slaves, as they cost you no upkeep and, thus are invaluable for your civ.

 

[Jyhawk]

Is there any reason to use settlers to build up the population in a city rather than workers? Workers are easier to build/replace. Is there anything you can do with a settler other than build a city?

Edit - I have another question about controlling a deposed city. I have been playing on monarch and am currently trying to make the jump to emperor. I've found that I can keep a deposed city under control with military units alone, though this can take a lot of them. If I keep one unit in the deposed city for every head of population, it seems to suffice to keep the city from flipping. This can require a lot of units, but like I said, it seems to work. A side benefit to this method is that as the citizens in the city are assimilated, the city acts as a source of replacements/reinforcements too. Is this method viable?

 

[Raliuven]

Well, if you have overproduced settlers in the late game and they are just sucking up gold, then sure, they can make for a very fast population boom. For example, you have +++ settlers standing around with nothing to do and you have just researched hospitals. You can use the settlers for some really quick population booms since growth after pop 13 take a huge amount of food (80 without granary, 40 with granary? Check that?). You can grow settlers in smaller, corrupt towns for 10-20 food and boost the population in your inner core. IMO this tactic is more viable on larger maps where you may have dozens or hundreds of farms to slow build settlers and workers.

Settlers can only do one basic thing - they build cities. But you can use this function in some interesing ways. You will see many posts regarding 'combat' settlers. This is when you have the settler accompany your forces to either make a beachhead or take over a small area so your units can use the roads/RR.

Examples: You land your forces on an enemy island. You use the settler to create a city and then rush a harbor, barracks, walls as needed to give your army a base to heal and hold. When the city founds you will also have control over some of the area, allowing your units to use the roads and RR while penalizing the enemy civ. This gives you a foothold during invasion. Be careful, however, because the AI WILL attack units in a city it might normally attack in the wild, including armies.

Similarly, let say you are boardering an enemy civ and you are at war. You both have RR and it is causing you a lot of pain to invade. Hide a settler under an army and advance it towards a border city. If you have a strong enough army, the AI will not attack it. Move the settler 1 square away from the enemy city and found a new city. If you do it right, your cultural borders will now extend back to your lands. You instantly capture the railroads and you can use them for instant movement. Move all of your cavalry/tanks (multipe-movement attack units) to the new border. Since they are only 1 tile away from the enemy city they can invade and instantly attack, capturing/destroying the city. If you capture it, it may even put your new boarders 1 tile away from another AI city and you can immediately repeat the process.

 

[Bartleby]

If you're building up cities overseas then settlers are better because you can transport more population that way.

 

[Jyhawk]

Raliuven - Thanks. Excellent information and insight. I have used settlers to build close to the enemy before, but you add some nice methods of going about doing so. Your insight into using settlers to build up core cities at the expense of highly corrupt outer cities is also extremely useful.

I added an edit to my previous post that you may have missed regarding using military units to prevent a city from flipping. Do you have any insight into that?

 

[Spoonwood]

If you play a variant where you can't add in workers, then adding in settlers works out as better than not adding settlers. I admit it... that does seem obvious. I guess if you have cash laying around also, adding in settlers can grow your population in a specific city faster.