Diplomacy useless and illogical?

[starfox]

The other day I wanted to trade something (dont remember what) and offered 50 gold (lump sum.)
The advisor said it would be acceptable
Then I proposed 50 gold per turn and the advisor said they would probably feel insulted!!

Come on!

They also never want to trade towns (even tiny ones) even when you offer lots of gold, map, techies etc...
(Once or twice I was able to get a free town when they were begging for peace tho...)

Do you think that diplomacy is really useful?

 

[ACM]

Yeah, very useful. I often use diplomacy to make all civs gang up on a civ which is becoming too powerful. I sometimes bribe the enemy (you'd be surprised to know the wonders 50 gold can accomplish when the opponent is short of cash) to get them to like me.
A democracy pumping up lots of gold can get everyone to like you and go for an easy diplomatic victory. With diplomacy it's possible to win the game with very few wars. If you play your chips right, any war can be avoided or cancelled after a few turns (when the enemy resumes conversation).
Don't forget that when everyone likes you, deals are much easier to be accepted, and buying techs is always a good deal.

 

[mote]

I've sucessfully demanded 2 towns and traded for a third.

I think it's time to ask yourself. "Is it time to switch deodorants?"

As for diplomacy in general. I like it. It's not as personable as SMAC, but it's more flexible. I do wish you could just ask you advisor what a good gold amount was rather than going.. 20? no... 30? yes? how about... 25? yes? how about... 23? no? ...24? Finally!

(I had no idea the computer saved you from making outrageously generous offers (ie. 50 gold/turn). That's very nice of them, but maybe they should fix that in a patch).

 

[kamosa]

In the last game I focused on trading for all of the luxuries. This had a positive effect on happiness and corruption and when the Persians were found to be living in lands that could best be described as "strategic to the goals of our country", I was able to parley my good relations with several countries into a coalition of every county against the Persians. This made them split their forces and left the "key" cities open for my taking without much blood shed. After the unfortunate demise of the Persians, the cities taken by my allies quickly flipped to my side in bloodless coups.

The AI doesn't give trades that are fair at face value, but you can work the system to give yourself significant advantages.


Tips:

1) A strong trading partner is a more likely ally. Trade often with your nearby countries. Sometimes just stop by and offer them a gift of 10 gold or an extra luxury or two. You can always cancel after 20 turns, but the good will remains.

2) When you go to war prevoke the enemy into declaring war on you. Don't sneak attack as this will create problems for you down the road.

3) Cause wars to happen on your turn. Don't let the AI have the first crack at swinging world opinion to their side. If you need to go to war, provoke them on your turn, so that you have control of the diplomatic scene and you can make the first offers to the non-involved countries.

4) Get those luxeries. Even if you have to give up a few gold per turn, it's worth it. Getting all six luxuries can really makes a difference