Do you know what the Tirpitz is?

What's the Tirpitz?

  • A Carrier

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • A Battleship

    Votes: 41 95.3%
  • A well defended Islands (WW2)

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • A worldwide Circus

    Votes: 2 4.7%
  • A Bomber

    Votes: 0 0.0%

  • Total voters
    43
An interesting quote:


Battleships - Even though these great warships do not figure in this novel at all, I can't resist commenting on them. From the earliest days of naval warfare, even the dumbest commanders have known that the thing which is the number-one most important gotta-have-it asset in a fight is weight of metal on the enemy. You can screw up the tactics, but if you've got the biggest guns and the heaviest shells coming down on the bad guys accurately, you will probably win. There are all sorts of annoying exceptions to this rule, but it still holds most of its water.

The BBs were the rulers of the sea up until the Japanese took their little trip to Hawaii in 1941, then were supplanted by the carriers (out of sheer necessity since the American battleships had been abruptly turned into hazards to navigation). The battleships were relegated to a supporting roll and, except for getting dragged out of mothballs for every war we've had since World War II, were pretty much finished.

In the eighties, we recommissioned all four of our Iowa class battleships and deployed them around the world. They carried sixteen-inch guns and fired rounds weighing around 2,700 pounds apiece. The effect was like shooting an entire showroomful of Ford Escorts, packed with high explosive, about twenty-five miles. When the rounds hit, they made instant holes in civilization that were the size of tennis courts. I got to see the New Jersey fire a broadside at somebody in Beirut once, and I still haven't found the words to describe it.

This was also effective because the people who were fired upon immediately quit annoying their neighbors and repaired to their graves. The surviving terrorists went home for an underwear change and all was quiet for awhile.

The battleships have all been mothballed again now and it doesn't seem the same anymore. When one sees a battleship steaming along, one is seeing Navy and all that that meant through the centuries. There is no weapon on earth that will make a little tinpot dictator sit up and take notice like a battleship slowly cruising off his coast well out of pistola range with her guns trained on his presidential palace. It sort of gives him a little peek at his relative importance in the grand scheme of things. If that peek stops one firefight, however small, or saves one life, or ensures the fairness of one election, then the battleship has earned her keep.

But, since those things usually happen outside the Capital Beltway, and Dan Rather doesn't mention them, they matter not at all to the geniuses in Washington. Those events have no bearing on the next election, and every congressman knows that money to measure the effect of cow farts on the ozone layer is far more important than wasting it on a battleship. They're quite correct, too. It'll help next year, when the bill to teach cows to say "excuse me" comes out of committee.
 
My money would be on the Iowa too, but it still sucks that we never got to find out what the result would have been.

Somehow, I suspect that the crew of the Iowas in WW2 didn't think that it sucked at all.
 
Originally posted by Simon Darkshade
It would have been the New Jersey, as she was the only one deployed off Vietnam, part of the error of not using all the bloody firepower available when they should have.

As I said, war stories and fairy tales. Still a broadside from a battleship sitting off, say, Da Nang, would be awesome to watch. The 16" and 18" guns could sweep the depth of the country into Laos or Cambodia.

Originally posted by Simon Darkshade
I have modified specs, with changes in secondary armament, and a few more guns, and various other missiles. They are being employed in a fictional alternate history context, so they have a few fictional/experimental missiles fitted.

I am working on a large program whereby line drawings and 3D models can be produced of BBs, as well as working out battle capabilities, gunfire models, etc. This is a bit of a long term project, as it involves inputting a very large amount of data - all known engagement data, and all assorted types of variables. It could be a nice finished result, whereby inputting your chosen specs gives you plans and a visual model, as well as comparative capabilities. :ack:

But I will dig up some of the modified stuff on the Darkshade class BBGN, a vessel that if built, could sink anything, and withstand anything short of a nuke.
You might post some drawings in the drawings thread, or here in History. I would like to see the the mighty Darkshade.

J
 
Originally posted by Case


Somehow, I suspect that the crew of the Iowas in WW2 didn't think that it sucked at all.

Of course not, I'm speaking from a battleship amateur's point of view here, not from that of a crewman.

It is certainly a question that is of interest.
 
Originally posted by onejayhawk


As I said, war stories and fairy tales. Still a broadside from a battleship sitting off, say, Da Nang, would be awesome to watch. The 16" and 18" guns could sweep the depth of the country into Laos or Cambodia.

You might post some drawings in the drawings thread, or here in History. I would like to see the the mighty Darkshade.

J

Indeed. Another of my favourite anecdotes is of a similar nature. Whether it is precisely true or not is irrelevant; it certainly goes down quite well with a fairly knowledgable audience after dinner, for example:

A US Navy destroyer is patrolling the waters off the DMZ in 1969, and gets a radar contact coming towards it.
It raises the contact on the radio:
"Unidentified vessel, this is a US Navy ship. Please identify yourself"
No response.
The message is repeated, with added vehmence:
"Unidentified vessel, this is the USS Lawrence. Identify yourself immediately, or we will be forced to take active measures"
No response.
A last warning then:
"Unidentified vessel, this is the USS Lawrence, a US Navy destroyer equipped with two 5" guns. Identify yourself or we will open fire"
A response:
"This is the USS New Jersey. You may open fire when ready." :D

As for the plans, I am working on them; they have elements of the Iowas, the Montanas, and the Yamatos.
 
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