Do you think that bio-fuel should be simulated somehow?

[777]

I just watched rather interesting program considering about bio-fuel and it's cabapility of producing at Finland. It made me think that since it's really topical subject in science ATM, should it be simulated in cIV somehow?

We all know that at somepoint, sooner or later, fossil fuel will get obsolete and/or it's import will be harder and more expensive during the time. In year 2005 it was highest point of oil producing and from now on it get's lower and lower by year.
IIRC nowdays they're making bio-fuel from sugarcane which they refine to ethanol and then mix it with gasoline, so actualy usage of oil based fuel would be 15%. That makes it E85 (85% ethanol and 15% gasoline) Other resources could be turnip rape oil, wood and peat.

So it would be actually rather interesting idea to have oil obsolete at sometime or then make them to exhaust during certain time, etc etc. Discussion

 

[`DG`]

Yes, as part of a "future" mod which extended the tech tree with other futuristic techs and presumably units.

All i can think of that an introduction of bio fuel could do would be to obsolete oil as a requirement, possibly +1 movement for vehicles and maybe reduce the pollution of power stations, and slow global warming. Not enough to make a significant change to the game by itelf IMHO, but an interesting part of a mod extending the timeline of Civ4.

 

[Crighton]

ehtanol could be worked in with a corn resource since it exists now in various places and is a somewhat workable alternative (logisitcally its still a whole lot easier to dig a well in a desert than to plow under the millions of acres that would be needed to supply current demand).

Thinking of which geo-thermal would be a nice rareity to have in the game too.

And sorry, but no moding should be done regarding using wood chips for power and so forth, lets be real any and all forests will have long been chop rushed into settlers or some such many many turns prior.

 

[Chamaedrys]

reduce the pollution of power stations, and slow global warming.

unfortuanetly it don't reduce the pollution, because ethanol is produced by dividing glucose in ethanol and CO2

But it would help to keep to the factories (and tanks) running.

It could be put in the game by a bio-fuel-facility that produce oil. The original Oil resources should dissapear at some time.

 

[Crighton]

could be a late era oil substitute for civs that managed to survive but not have any oil resource, probly be discovered just as the enemy tanks come rolling accross teh border

 

[Meffy]

One could modify the XML for diplomatic text. "Montezuma, your threats become tiresome -- but do keep blithering; our scientists have developed techniques for extracting methane fuel from your words."

 

[Chamaedrys]

One could modify the XML for diplomatic text. "Montezuma, your threats become tiresome -- but do keep blithering; our scientists have developed techniques for extracting methane fuel from your words."

the solution for industrial and acustical pollution

 

[777]

unfortuanetly it don't reduce the pollution, because ethanol is produced by dividing glucose in ethanol and CO2

I recall that in program they calculated that it depends on what resource have been used to make bio-fuel. IIRC peat and sugar had lower harmful emissions that in oil based fuel. If you generalize bio-fuel and don't think what it's made of, it really decreases pollution and green house effect Another usage for bio-fuel is that if we start to use more bio-fuel like wood chips for making energy in power plants for electricity and heat, we will have more oil for using it to vehicles and planes and so we can longivity oil resources.

Here are some rather cool ideas what would be nice to see in expansion pack

 

[Perfect_Blue]

There are so many different types of fuels. I knew some hippies that ran around the country in a van that they'd rigged to run on vegetable oil. Hemp, corn, freaking water; I've heard lots of discussions about alternative fuels. A shame none of these options are really being invested in. I guess the business fat-cats couldn't rip people off as much with alternative, cheap fuel.

 

[Chamaedrys]

Another usage for bio-fuel is that if we start to use more bio-fuel like wood chips for making energy in power plants for electricity and heat, we will have more oil for using it to vehicles and planes and so we can longivity oil resources.

Here are some rather cool ideas what would be nice to see in expansion pack

Yes, there should be more modern/alternative things in the late game

 

[Raisin Bran]

its a nice concept ... but only applicable starting at year 2000 in the game.

One thing I learned on bio-fuel like ethanol is that it is hard to produce and you need to refine it more that normal ''oil''. It dosent give off the same energy as ''oil'' so this is why they have to combine it with other fuels to be efficient.

I can be mistaking (Im not a chemist) but this is what I heard.
To emplement it to a game it would have to be a ressource that lets you make units but in a very limited quantity.

 

[777]

its a nice concept ... but only applicable starting at year 2000 in the game.

Why is that? I mean it's irrelevant because every game you re-write history and oil resources starts to wear of when you're starting to use them.

 

[Crighton]

I recall that in program they calculated that it depends on what resource have been used to make bio-fuel. IIRC peat and sugar had lower harmful emissions that in oil based fuel. If you generalize bio-fuel and don't think what it's made of, it really decreases pollution and green house effect Another usage for bio-fuel is that if we start to use more bio-fuel like wood chips for making energy in power plants for electricity and heat, we will have more oil for using it to vehicles and planes and so we can longivity oil resources.QUOTE]

Nuclear power is going to be the most optimal route to go. It concentrates massive ammounts of power production into an exceedingly small area with no harmful output (it's steam from the cooling tower that rises into the atmospher that you see at nuke plants). With nukes all your doing is taking something already radioactive, using it, and then putting the radioactive leftovers back into the ground. Couple that with switching homes over to electric heat (from said plant) and that would total billions of gallons of oil savings per year.

technically you can use petroleum products for more than just simple gasoline and home heating fuel (plastics of various kinds, etc.).

 

[Raisin Bran]

Why is that? I mean it's irrelevant because every game you re-write history and oil resources starts to wear of when you're starting to use them.

Well its to give a reference in time .... I sould have said ''after researching computers'' as an example ........ what I wanted to say is to keep it as a late game concept ... If you want you can beeline to the ethanol tech.

But we haev to keep in mind that the technology has not been available until a few years ago. If you make the tech available too soon, well IMHO would not be realistic (I know for a fact that not all is realist in the game) .... the tech should be there for to help civs without oil.

 

[SkippyT]

Let's use Icelandic hydrogen in stead of oil and no global warming but 25% more expencive..

 

[jray]

Why is that? I mean it's irrelevant because every game you re-write history and oil resources starts to wear of when you're starting to use them.

And since the Republican Party isn't hard-coded into Civ4, it's quite realistic that alternative fuels could be commonplace in the 20th century.

 

[Hamminator]

Bio-Fuel like the robots in "The Matrix" run on?
Seriously though that would probably be under Future Tech.

 

[Zombie69]

Biofuel right now is more of a future tech. In civ, there are no future techs represented, except by the catch all "future tech". Therefore no, there's no need to add it to the game.

 

[tombeef]

Bio-Fuel like the robots in "The Matrix" run on?
Seriously though that would probably be under Future Tech.

Yes, sacrifice population to provide power to power plants.

Can lead to unhappiness, in which citizens revolt by; not displaying any emotions, and endlessly discussing what is real.

 

[Mewtarthio]

I recall that in program they calculated that it depends on what resource have been used to make bio-fuel. IIRC peat and sugar had lower harmful emissions that in oil based fuel. If you generalize bio-fuel and don't think what it's made of, it really decreases pollution and green house effect Another usage for bio-fuel is that if we start to use more bio-fuel like wood chips for making energy in power plants for electricity and heat, we will have more oil for using it to vehicles and planes and so we can longivity oil resources.

Nuclear power is going to be the most optimal route to go. It concentrates massive ammounts of power production into an exceedingly small area with no harmful output (it's steam from the cooling tower that rises into the atmospher that you see at nuke plants). With nukes all your doing is taking something already radioactive, using it, and then putting the radioactive leftovers back into the ground. Couple that with switching homes over to electric heat (from said plant) and that would total billions of gallons of oil savings per year.

technically you can use petroleum products for more than just simple gasoline and home heating fuel (plastics of various kinds, etc.).

The only problem is that you can't exactly fit a nuclear generator into your car, now can you? And if you could, I would not want to get in a wreck...

Still, those other power plants are good for lessening the amount of petrolium used overall (freeing it up for plastics, gasoline, etc.) and potentially for creating more portable forms of power (whether you use the power to make hydrogen fuel or just stick a big capacitor into an outlet).