Early maces, does it work, DOES IT WHAT!!

[IPEX-731BA5DD06]

1st I didn't post this statergy, but Kniteowl did....THANK YOU KNITEOWL

To Paraphrase kniteowl, Research up to Metalcasting..don't research Masonary, but do research Polythesism (Napoleonbee ty)

Build Oracle and take metal casting as tech, Build forges for Great engineer, research Code of laws, Great Profit will now give Civil service. If you get a great engineer in time they'll give you Machinary (T-hawk).

That's the basic stratergy in a nut shell, a few other variations can be done as you see fit.

I used this on a Single player game, Random leader, Standard map size, Continents, Agressive AI, Marathon sped, Prince level *(Sorry forgot to add ), NO TECH TRADING. A favourate of mine

Who do I land as leader, Tokugowa, and what do I have in first 3 rings...3 gold mines for my first 2 cities, with 4-6 floodplains . And I say again RANDOM LEADER.

So off goes my warrior a searching for huts...pop 1 with first city settlement, Gold...ho hum....warrior finds hut...TECH...warrior finds 2nd hut..2nd TECH..warrior finds 4 more huts...2 TECH's and gold...NONE WERE MASONARY EITHER ...No reloads, random.

I'm begining to think, I'm on a island alone...oh well, Astronomy here I come..but then I run into 3 other civ's in about 5 turns..HELLO SAMURAI

Next thing I know, I'm building 3rd city, putting up gold mines...teching at 100% Bronze working....bingo...in 2nd exapansion of first city, Iron working...wham..1st ring of 2nd city...Chop oracle...build forges, next thing I know...*Slam, tinkle, crash, Shoosh*....SAMURaI start appearing...Hello Samuari....Saumari "Hello IPEX-731BA5DD06

My my that's a sharp sword you have there, becareful of it, and play nicely with the other civs....Next thing you know, my Samurai have gone and declared war on QIN..talk about smash and grab..Samurai against Archers even with 40% Cultural defence....no contest.

Umm sorry about that..Now You Samurai, listen to me...PLAY NICELY NOW...OR I'LL TAKE YOUR SWORDS AWAY FROM YOU. GO talk and play with Catherine of Russia, but first I'll just ask for a loan of all her gold $700+, so you don't the wrong idea.

Burat Barah....ITS WAR..AGAIN.....SAMURAI ARE RUNNING BESEARK AGAIN...20%, 40%, 60%...No match...only 1 lost at 97.5% to a SPEARMAN...on a grassland city site...one to an archer in a 40% city and one to a horse archer attack, when it was still healing in MOSCOW.

Well Catherine pack up her civ and went to an island in Galley range, Sorry Cathy....Vicky, can't we talk about whats happened... No....

Burat Barah.....she was behind Catherine in techs...but it didn't help her though....she too packed up and went to exile island...along with Cathy.

Hmm Now looking at my Continental empire, I start building away Courthouses are whipped as is forbidden place...Graneries and library's with Lighthouses where available go in.

Crank our 2 Caravel's check our the other Continent....all archers too....Hmm maybe I'm way OUT in front..

3 galley's later, my Samurai, are now MARINE SAMURAI, but with city raider 3/2 I don't waste them on a seaborne assult at 60%, NO overboard they go..Vicky's closest, her cities gone...sail around to appologise to cathy... , NOT ACCEPTED..... .....Bye bye...March over to Vickies last city in 1 turn.... , sorry doesn't cut your english mustard...but it does cut your archers.

So where do I stand...1 Continent down or up, 2nd scouted out, Kublia khan founds Judaism for me on northern Coast, along with building Pyramids and a 3 city across the top of continent...Think I'll drop on by with 4 Galleons/city.

Bismark is getting squeezed into last place in the middle and Alex in bring up the rear, or bottom of continent.

My I have 5/6 religions, founding 3, Seizing 1 off Vickie and Cathy each, and looking to claim a 6th with Islam.

Summation of situation, Continent was seized in mid 800's, finally claimed off shore islands by 1200's...thought, might a well remove that eye sore. Building or have built Libraries in most mature cities, founding new cities to Culturally envelope MY CONTINENT. Teching to Universities, then build them, grab Islam, build Spiral Mirrannet, as all cities get Confussionism, and temple/monastries. Spreading other religions as great profits occur...Buddhism is only 1 so far. Astronomay, Labortories, Galleons, Chemisty, Frigates, Steel for cannons if enough time, them hit the beaches, take defend and advance on other continent. Who now has longbows. SCARY

 

[kniteowl]

LOL Your Welcome

If they have longbows use Rifles, Warlord's Toku Rifiles arn't to laugh at with CG1 C1 and 1st Strike.

Longbows don't have a chance against your UU, since your fighting on even tech, Cats, Cannons and Trebs become more Vital for Collateral Damage and knocking sdown cultural defences.

Personally I wouldn't use the Early Maces Strategy using Non-philosophical Civs... THEY TAKE SO LONG TO POP GREAT PEOPLE, you can still use this strategey with a Non phil civ if you want.

With a Non Phil Civ I'd rather Beeline to Civil Service Via Poping a great Prophet and reasearch Metal Casting and Machinery under Bureaucracy and a whole lotta cottages in my capital.

I havn't tested to see which strategy is faster in getting early maces... (Maybe when I'm free in the future)

What's faster for a non philosophical Civ???

Great people Poping a Great Engineer and Great Prophet?

OR

Early Civil Service Via Great Pprophet and Researching Metal Casting and Machinery under Bureaucracy

Obviously Financial Civs are Better under the Civil Service Strategy because they get extra Commerce (unless your Lizzy of England)

 

[Desert-Fox]

What level did you play? Because on Prince or above that you don't get almost all religions with Tokugawa.

 

[patagonia]

What level did you play? Because on Prince or above that you don't get almost all religions with Tokugawa.

In that game, none of the other civs started with Mysticism which makes grabbing religions easier (but still a bit of a gamble).

I'd definitely go with kniteowl's approach of using a prophet for CS and researching the rest under bureaucracy unless philosophical. There's nothing more annoying than having to wait around for a great person to appear when you want one now!

 

[bassist2119]

What level did you play? Because on Prince or above that you don't get almost all religions with Tokugawa.

For that matter, Prince+ doesn't hut-pop settlers/cities.

 

[IPEX-731BA5DD06]

I actaully researched Machinary, took metal casting from Oracle and Great profit gave civil service. I wasn't waiting for Great Engineer, and I polluted the great people points any way, with forge, great Library.

How'd I get 6 religions, Hinduism, I researched, Poly BEFORE Meditation, I thought, why not as I got Agriculture, Hunting, Archery and Mining from huts, VERY LUCKY with a warrior 2.

Other civs must have went south, and I started in North, so more time for huts on own, as I said, I thought initially I was on an island alone.

The rest of 1st continent is written down.

Researched Chemistry took Astronomy from Liberialisation, Built Galleons and then Frigates when available, Popped a Great Artist at 10% odds not once but Twice....in capital....

Invasion force was with Grenadiers, upgraded from Samurai, with CR III, Coverage and combat 1&2 in couple of cases..4 catapults with acuracy, and Frigates to remove cultural protection in 1 turn.

War was short and sharp, helped by the fact the 2nd continent was thin and narrow, so most of cities were ON COAST!!! believe it or not....1 of each 3 civs main cities were inland, all others on or 1 from coast.

My continent is making Soldiers NON STOP all ready to embark for war. 11 Galleons make 3 trips, upgrade to Grenadiers who I need but keep most as is for garrison, as long bows, Crossbows, Pikes and Some Samurai.

Take 1st city, cultural bomb goes off, breathing room. Sail around coast bombard, land, bombard assult. Sail ship into captured town. embark all non garrison troops, sail to next city, repeat. Genghis Khan, not Kublai, dies in short order, longbows and maces don't make the grade. Last city on island off south eastern coast, make peace for world map *Duh, why would I want that , Oh there you are*

Fredrick is next, Hmm Berlin in in middle of Continent, good place to move palace too....as I build forbidden and Versailles at home. 3 pronged attack, 2 by sea, one by land, Paul revare I ain't *appologies for spelling, or wrong person*, split navy into 2, ALL NEW Grenadier now get combat 1,2 and Amphibious, out of box, with Theology and Vassalage, and Japanese inate aggression.

East and West naval forces are reinforced with new recruits, blast cultural defences from 60% down to 18% first hit, most of time I assult at that and lose maybe one/two per city if any at all. March overland with NON amphibious promoted troops, City raiders 3, with combat 1, and cover promotions mainly, garrison troops and assorted camp followers.

DATELINE BERLIN: The final assult, Barrage 4, Cultural Zero, City raider 3 Grenadiers attack, defenders die. City falls. 2nd Great Artist paints a MASTER PIECE titled "The liberation of Berlin", Population is Culturally enhanced by this masterpiece. A Palace to Celebrate the victory is called for.

Alexander, sitting below me, glaring menacing upwards. Bismark had Elephants, they only moved 1, with a few horse archers. Alexander has a HORSE resource and Knights, who say NI...NI NI NI NI.....arrrggghhh

Athens is Culturally in middle of Civilization. Again 2 by sea, 1 by land. Same receipe, but 98%...lose ...92% lose. ...95% lose.. ..

Weight of numbers won out, but...........90 *#%*@ + percent and lose 1 or 2 per city........

To sum up 2 turns PAST rifling.....I win a Conquest in 1604.....a Full 100 yr's BEFORE any other victory at DOMINATION. Looking at replay, its a slow climb to attacking position, then all over red rover within 100yr's. 3 Civ's, 1 continent, there could be only 1 winner.

Standard maps these were at also, to compare, NONE of the Civs had ANY gunpowder troops, though Genghis beat me to Economics, Because I spent 6 turn in Anarchy........ with a 6 turn civ change during first war, 7 during 2nd war, 3rd war, had just built Taj Mahal Hall, and in golden age at day's end

Very powerful stratergy this one, admitidly, I was lucky with huts, but I had no horses in Northern 1/2 of starting continent 1 only at all in South. 2 small islands off shore of the main continents, 1/15th of size, had not 1 but TWO horse resources EACH, go figure. No Elephants at all, Iron and Copper x2 each within 6 tile radius of first 2 cities. But you play them as you gets them. Killed all 3 civs on start with no longbows, killed longbows on 2nd with CR II OR III Samurai or Grenadiers. Never built one mounted unit.

AI seems to Value Riflemen HIGHER then Grenadiers.CR III & Combat 1, cover promoted Grenadiers by land, Amphibious *Combat I,II, Amphibious promotions *, by sea your virtually unstoppable, with galleons and frigates untill Destroyers come along, Agressive Civs get Combat I Auto, Vassalage and Theoracry, your looking at 8/10 newly minted, first battle promotion, Cover or Gunpowder as the case dictates

My tactic is to get Combustion first *Oil wells*, if I have Great library, then scentific method *Discover oil*, then physics. Great Scientist isn't a priority for me....nor the Great merchant *Economics* for that matter.

Playing Marathong speeds, I can usually tech at rates approaching 10-15 per tech, or at very least equal of better to Epic. A Great person assisted tech, might do 60-80% turns research....Nah,and 6 points to science, plus modifiers, Nah.

Great merchant with Extra food....I could allways use, Trade mission for $7500, deffinately. But by this stage, No open borders, all civs are furious , with -6, you made an arrogant demand, -4 you decared war on us, -10 you declared war on our friend. Friend, more like potential victim.

Great artist, to stop that new 15+ population city from starving...yes...let the culture flow over lands....YES.... Cultural defence against a counter attack...

Stratergy that doesn't rely on Great people at Marathon speeds, is better, normal, maybe more useful...

 

[Bjorn190]

Well, since he doesnt seem to want to say what level he played on, I guess we'll have to assume he playing on settler

Unless u wanna tell us what level it was?

 

[nub]

I'm with bjorn. This guy was obviously playing on settler.
I'd like to relate a game I played, in which I used this great strategy called warrior rush!
I built a warrior, and then 30 more, and then found huts that give me settlers! I didnt have to build a single one because all the huts gave me all the settlers I needed. They also gave me tech so I kept my culture slider at 100%!
I then attacked bismarck with 14 warriors, and man! I owned him so hard! I didnt have to build a worker because I captured bismarck's 2 workers. With his new city, and workers, I continued to build warriors, and then BAM!
Down goes monty against 424 warriors!
I built a barracks and BAM MORE WARRIORS
DOWN GOES CATHERINE
Its a great strategy: Warrior rush! Works so well on Settler. Maybe tomorrow I will take the training wheels off and play Chieftan!

 

[aelf]

, nub. I haven't read anything funnier here for a while. I guess I have a taste for the sardonic

To the OP, with all due respect, I think it helps if you cut the WHAMs and BAMs from your commentary and refrain from shouting throughout. You could also work on coherence. Overall, I felt that I was reading a very exaggerated Justice League comic book with the Joker as narrator It was quite entertaining, but didn't make your points very credible.

 

[drkodos]

Even more fun is the single tank gambit.

WB in a tank on turn one and see if it can single handedly conquest the world.






Do it!

 

[napoleonbee]

If you want early macemen, just play as Rome.

 

[cabert]

Even more fun is the single tank gambit.

WB in a tank on turn one and see if it can single handedly conquest the world.






Do it!

could be fun!
call him Conan

 

[Jonny211]

ROFL @ Nub and drkodos, funniest thing I've read all day!!

Think I'll try the warrior strategy out in my next Monarch game (still not beaten this level). Wish me luck ;-)

 

[Barney's_Soul]

I usually find Civil Service too expensive in the early game to go w/ early Maces, Maces simply arn't worth it because it is almost as easy to go with Guilds and rape w/ knights. In my last game I was ahead by 600+ points, and I got CIvil Service right after Rifleing.

 

[OceansEleven]

I've always gotten Metal Casting with my Oracle (most expensive tech at that time haha). Anyways, it's pretty hard to stay in the tech lead with Prince. I hardly ever use Great People for Tech's. Almost never...

In my current game, I'm Catherine. I love being her, Roosevelt, or Qin. Anyways, I am 700 points ahead of everyone, and just formed a permanent alliance for no reason at all. My beginning strategy, I followed through advice, which is war. Good advice. Early war. Amazing what I did and how I did it. I had just swordsman against archers and like 1 axemen. Stupid Hatshephut. I killed her in in 1 war, along with Mana Musa taking over 1 city. Afterwards, I built up some more to get Asoka who had a religion, and I needed some $$$, and his capital had the pyramids. Took over 3 of his cities, and he's still one of the best civs. Imagine how he'd compare if I didn't take him over, yikes. It's me n' catherine now, up against everyone. I'm Friendly with the next biggest civ, Mansa Musa. No threat there. I have no idea what to do. I guess I could take over Asoka, then who knows.

 

[wioneo]

There won't be early maces after the patch... The great horned one will turn in his grave...

 

[kniteowl]

There won't be early maces after the patch... The great horned one will turn in his grave...

LOl Actually I've Found a way to still get Maces Early but it invloves the Philosophy Slingshot. There's proabably a Good Chance you get them before the AI get's Lowbows. I'll post the strategy after the patch if and only if the Great prophet CS slightshot no longer works.

 

[XxtraLarGe]

LOl Actually I've Found a way to still get Maces Early but it invloves the Philosophy Slingshot. There's proabably a Good Chance you get them before the AI get's Lowbows. I'll post the strategy after the patch if and only if the Great prophet CS slightshot no longer works.

This would be great for playing as the Vikings!

 

[tonidanza]

Just to let everyone know. Im the one who started this strat in multiplayer games about 4months ago. Pretty funny taking the same army and steamrolling every other player. EVen taking on multiple players on at once.

I do a variation of the slingshot strat now, as the rush to mace is NOT the best strategy.... trust me.

Im currently taking advantage of a NEW strategy that NO ONE KNOWS HAHA. Im enjoying it to the fullest Just waiting for civ to nerf it !

Sappo/ToniDanza27