Emperor Cookbook IV: Suryavarman II

[ChromiumL]

Hmm, this is tough. I didn't realize how personalized people get with how they pursue a space victory! In the past, I assumed there was no other possibility other than getting factories early, but several of the saves didn't even have assembly line.

That said, I find it hard to evaluate saves that go along different paths than I am used to...

1st - ChrisShaffer - Good tech rate, building lots of factories, out of war with Monte, and Sids Sushi never hurts either

2nd - IPEX - I don't think Ipex got enough credit for their save. Even though tech rate isn't the best, builds are pretty good in cities. I am assuming the tech towards radio is to eventually try to get the UN in order to 'hopefully' help prevent an easy Gilga victory.

3rd - RJM - Good tech rate, but I am sad to see the lack of assembly lines and factories

That brings the totals to:

7 points - Chromium
6 points - Plattfuss
6 points - ChrisShaffer
5 points - RJM
4 points - Gumbolt
2 points - IPEX

That makes my save the winner! Woo!

That said, I sorta feel that perhaps the various strategies (factories first vs. rocketry/Apollo first) are so different that they need a chance to play themselves out so that we can see which works best. I am a bit split as to where to go from here. We could continue with the winning save and just play the rest out, but I sorta want to see how different people's strategies work. At the same time, it would be painful to continue having to stop and vote when most of space race victory is clicking away.

Here is what I think is the best compromise. I will 'recommend' we play from the winning save, but if you want to play from a different save (including your own), feel free. Doing this will hopefully give us a chance to see how different strategies work. Rather than having a vote at 1820, lets just 'check in' whenever we get to 1820 and then somewhere in the mid 1900s (if there is no victory yet). At the check in, just briefly describe tech path and building focuses and any interesting relations stuff -- then we will see who gets victory first, and how they got there.

We do need to set some time limits, and I believe that one full week 'should' probably be enough to finish up. If you believe that isn't enough time, let me know and we can extend it. Otherwise we will wrap things up next Saturday and decide on what we want to do in the next game .

 

[ChrisShaffer]

Hmm, if I had abstained from the vote my save would have won

out of war with Monte

I was never in war with Monte - I diverted him by bribing Cyrus to attack him.

 

[Gumbolt]

Hmm, if I had abstained from the vote my save would have won



I was never in war with Monte - I diverted him by bribing Cyrus to attack him.

Yes but its not much of a win if your strategy was to abstain so your save stood a chance. Perhaps we should make it a rule for a save to count you have to have voted.

 

[Gumbolt]

Up to 1822. Overall I think last round should of been to 1800ad so we could of had AP built and really judged the saves to see which method was quicker.

Spoiler :

Its been a real clicker or a round.

HRG and monty have been at war and Cyrus lost a city to Monty.

Monty lost a city to HRG and Gilga dow HRG taking a city or 2 before he capitulated.

I teched towards Indus then rocketry and currently awaiting satellites having teched robotics.

Sulie has built the Apollo program.

Hindu has now spread to 2 of my cities but most abstain on AP vote. lets hope the same is true for the UN.

Really not much to report. I have built hospitals in most cities and built Alum corp in Conf cap.

Health issues are a minor issue. Could use supermarkets really.

In terms of techs most have Communismand Facism. Ragnar has Fission. Beyond that the rest need biology, computer and radio.

I will complete to finish later. Assuming i can get my spaceship up in time.

 

[Gumbolt]

Okay to conclusion 1945. An update around 1900 seemed to have little value as I was clicking towards victory.

I suspect others will do this a bit quicker.

Spoiler :

Basically teched towards fussion once i had space elevator and all other techs for spaceship parts bar engine.

Beat Gilga to fussion by a few turns. For some reason Gilga left fussion tech till he had researched everything else.
I added the GE to capital for extra production. By the end of game he had completed 2 engine but didnt launch his spaceship. (Might of missed this)

He had vasselled sulie hrg monty and DOW on me 5 turns before space race win. His army was 4x mine but he didnt managed to take any cities. He was close to a domination/conquest win.

2 other vassel states appeared under Gilga reign. Hammy and English.


The AP and ragnar I survived. Bismark and monty were alternative votes and i always voted for them. (I knew they wouldnt win)

Cyrus built the UN and i survived 1-2 diplomatic victory vote. I aways voted cyrus.

Anyway got a space race victory 1945.

For my part no more big and small maps on next game. Ackkk!!!!

 

[RJM]

I decided to play my own save through to a victory in 1918.

Spoiler :

Monte launched another fairly pointless attack. I lost a couple of artillery pieces to the first 2 waves, and they destroyed one of my towns, but I picked up another great general. I was probably about to lose one of the weakly defended islands to his 3rd wave, when he paid 110 for peace. My tech path was towards robotics and satellites (for the space elevator), then on to fusion (for the great engineer to finish the elevator), then composites, ecology and genetics for the final space ship components. It was fairly straightforward, although I did briefly wonder whether Gil could build quickly enough to beat me, but he never actually got ahead. Here are the saves from 1850, the turn I launched and the turn before I landed.

RJM

 

[Gumbolt]

I decided to play my own save through to a victory in 1918.

Spoiler :

Monte launched another fairly pointless attack. I lost a couple of artillery pieces to the first 2 waves, and they destroyed one of my towns, but I picked up another great general. I was probably about to lose one of the weakly defended islands to his 3rd wave, when he paid 110 for peace. My tech path was towards robotics and satellites (for the space elevator), then on to fusion (for the great engineer to finish the elevator), then composites, ecology and genetics for the final space ship components. It was fairly straightforward, although I did briefly wonder whether Gil could build quickly enough to beat me, but he never actually got ahead. Here are the saves from 1850, the turn I launched and the turn before I landed.

RJM

Few more thoughts added.

Spoiler :

Ooooh 1918. Looks like a good job. it will be interesting to see those playing Croms save can pull it off before then. In all fairness I probably could of skipped a few of the techs and let the Ai tech them for me and trade later.

I am still not sure if Aluminium before Apollo project is the best strategy. Could of done with mining corp that my save could of had.

I noticed you built 2 engines on your save?? Why?? It saves 2 turns? Looked pretty close with Gilga.

 

[RJM]

Few more thoughts added.

Spoiler :

Ooooh 1918. Looks like a good job. it will be interesting to see those playing Croms save can pull it off before then. In all fairness I probably could of skipped a few of the techs and let the Ai tech them for me and trade later.

I am still not sure if Aluminium before Apollo project is the best strategy. Could of done with mining corp that my save could of had.

I noticed you built 2 engines on your save?? Why?? It saves 2 turns? Looked pretty close with Gilga.

Spoiler :

I happened to complete the 2nd engine before the final 2 components - including the last thruster. Because I beelined fusion, there was not much to build On discovery of fusion, I started 2 engines, the second in the capital which was optimised for research rather than production. After researching all the space techs, I rearranged things to maximise production which finished the 2nd engine with several turns to spare.

I don't think aluminum corp helped very much on either the apollo project or the first component, but it may have shaved a few turns.

I wondered about mining corp with the GE from fusion, but decided against it. This may have been a mistake.

BTW, which save did you use?

RJM

 

[Gumbolt]

Spoiler :

I happened to complete the 2nd engine before the final 2 components - including the last thruster. I don't think aluminum corp helped very much on either the apollo project or the first component, but it may have shaved a few turns.

I wondered about mining corp with the GE from fusion, but decided against it. This may have been a mistake.

BTW, which save did you use?

RJM

Spoiler :

I used Chroms save as he won the round. I did build a lot of military that never got used. Although I did fear that Gilga was going to get a Dom win. Him and HRG had a huge stack by Sulie capital before they took it. I was like Woah!!!!

My save from the 1700ad had a GE ready for mining inc. That would of been interesting. 200 years to spread it.

 

[Gumbolt]

Chrom!!

I think we need to set up a new game before i go offline in 10 days for 4-5 days.

I am thinking Hammy, Indians, Justin or Spanish. Someone spiritual would be interesting. Anyone else got thoughts on this?

Theres nothing to stop people posting their final saves. I would think the earliest Spaceship race would win the round. Unless someone did something special.

 

[ChromiumL]

Well, I do want to finish this up--I will probably have my round done by Wednesday.

But, in the mean time, we can get discussing what we want to do next. I like the idea of playing someone spiritual--I am still getting the hang of how to take advantage of being able to change civics without revolt.

I think either Saladin or Justinian would be fun. I would like to be sure to pick one that starts with mysticism (I love early religions!). Maybe a fractal map, or should we just go with Pangaea?

 

[helemaalnicks]

Chrom!!

I think we need to set up a new game before i go offline in 10 days for 4-5 days.

I am thinking Hammy, Indians, Justin or Spanish.

I vote against hammy (current game) and izzy (last game). Rest are fine for me.

 

[Gumbolt]

With justin on a fractal if you start with myst you could end up with 5-6 religions if you start on your own. GLH games can be long slogs to space race victories. We have already done that once.

Pangea would be better as it allows more options in terms of game play.

 

[IPEX-731BA5DD06]

Emperor's CookBook IV Round 6​

I Decided to play from my own save, as I have a different Victory condition in mind, along with my plans for further victory. I've noted that I omitted Coal plants, and will 1st rectify that.

Spoiler :

I continue on, I launch my plan of attacking Ragnar, and taking the Apostolic palace and gaining victory that way. I've taken 2 cities, and now have a blocking stake in palace elections, but don't know where it is.

1830 AD Ragnar Vassalized to Suleiman, and I eliminate him that very turn as well. I've finally conquered the Apostolic palace, now to spam Hinduism, and win. I yes I adopt Hinduism as well.

I adopt Hereditary rule and Vassalage to gain favourate civics bonuses, and adopt Hinduism. I hope no one gets mass media, or builds U.N. FIRST.

Of course I built the Christo Redentor Wonder. Duh uh.

1850 AD I make peace with Suleiman, for the price of a city I captured off him, ho hum, I want to win. Just awaiting the vote for victory.

1853 AD I build the Internet, and gain Artillery and Rocketry from it, I have Apollo if I wish, but still awaiting a vote.

1859 AD I'm finally elected to the Apostolic Palace, Spreading Hinduism to my cities, spread it to all spun off Vassals, I now await victory.

1885 AD Two idiots now have Mass Media, and as such I can't get a vote up, I never had all the votes on my own, but with Cyrus I'd have won, but I never got a vote, and all civ's had Hinduism, but Ragnar brought it up twice, when he was only candidate?? I don't understand?? and I was elected to head palace twice over..???? Space it is..not optimum but oh well

1886 AD I declare war on Monty, at Gi's request, or a vassal at least, take his capital, and gain Mining corp into the bargain. I've also got a Great Merchant who I'm moving to Nidaros, which is my top gold city captured from Ragnar, and is receiving wall street.

Eventually lost to a Gilgamesh, Vassalization Diplomatic victory.

2nd try

1873 AD I finally get the Religious Victory vote, and I win, I had to spin off a vassal in Gandhi, who was a candidate, but Ragnar, was able to bring forward a religious victory vote and he was only candidate?? unless I missed a vassal, but in same time frame, I got victory. Maybe I just clicked past it,?? I don't understand.

Spoiler :

 

[RJM]

Emperor's CookBook IV Round 6​

I Decided to play from my own save, as I have a different Victory condition in mind, along with my plans for further victory. I've noted that I omitted Coal plants, and will 1st rectify that.

Spoiler :

2nd try

1873 AD I finally get the Religious Victory vote, and I win, I had to spin off a vassal in Gandhi, who was a candidate, but Ragnar, was able to bring forward a religious victory vote and he was only candidate?? unless I missed a vassal, but in same time frame, I got victory. Maybe I just clicked past it,?? I don't understand.

Well done! I wondered about that approach myself, but I wasn't sure it could be pulled off.

RJM

 

[Gumbolt]

Emperor's CookBook IV Round 6​

I Decided to play from my own save, as I have a different Victory condition in mind, along with my plans for further victory. I've noted that I omitted Coal plants, and will 1st rectify that.

Spoiler :

I continue on, I launch my plan of attacking Ragnar, and taking the Apostolic palace and gaining victory that way. I've taken 2 cities, and now have a blocking stake in palace elections, but don't know where it is.

1830 AD Ragnar Vassalized to Suleiman, and I eliminate him that very turn as well. I've finally conquered the Apostolic palace, now to spam Hinduism, and win. I yes I adopt Hinduism as well.

I adopt Hereditary rule and Vassalage to gain favourate civics bonuses, and adopt Hinduism. I hope no one gets mass media, or builds U.N. FIRST.

Of course I built the Christo Redentor Wonder. Duh uh.

1850 AD I make peace with Suleiman, for the price of a city I captured off him, ho hum, I want to win. Just awaiting the vote for victory.

1853 AD I build the Internet, and gain Artillery and Rocketry from it, I have Apollo if I wish, but still awaiting a vote.

1859 AD I'm finally elected to the Apostolic Palace, Spreading Hinduism to my cities, spread it to all spun off Vassals, I now await victory.

1885 AD Two idiots now have Mass Media, and as such I can't get a vote up, I never had all the votes on my own, but with Cyrus I'd have won, but I never got a vote, and all civ's had Hinduism, but Ragnar brought it up twice, when he was only candidate?? I don't understand?? and I was elected to head palace twice over..???? Space it is..not optimum but oh well

1886 AD I declare war on Monty, at Gi's request, or a vassal at least, take his capital, and gain Mining corp into the bargain. I've also got a Great Merchant who I'm moving to Nidaros, which is my top gold city captured from Ragnar, and is receiving wall street.

Eventually lost to a Gilgamesh, Vassalization Diplomatic victory.

2nd try

1873 AD I finally get the Religious Victory vote, and I win, I had to spin off a vassal in Gandhi, who was a candidate, but Ragnar, was able to bring forward a religious victory vote and he was only candidate?? unless I missed a vassal, but in same time frame, I got victory. Maybe I just clicked past it,?? I don't understand.

Spoiler :

Good job on both attempts really. I had looked at that as an idea for ealier rounds but you just never knew where the Ap was to stop the win.

I wonder if any other victory conditions would of been possible? A save would be interesting to see.

Be interesting to see what Chrom does.

 

[IPEX-731BA5DD06]

I'll attach the save I ran from, its 1866 I think, I just spun off Gandhi from a Island I took off Ragnar, next thing I know, I get 3 options, 1 is diplomatic, the other 2, some rubbish...

With the loss, I only had to tech Fission, build the engines and launch, but Gil had vassalized everyone bar Cyrus and myself..so

thing is Dumb A Suleiman, took on Ragnar as a vassal, when both Charlie boy and myself were at war with him, then Gil, Re-took Sookieman as a vassal, cleaned up Charlie boy and grabbed Monty, game over
View attachment 207406
I think I named it incorrectly

 

[RJM]

Spoiler :

I had another go, this time using Chrom's save. After a false start, I played through to a space ship win in 1918. I got into a futile war with Ragnar and Monte which I should have paid to end at the first opportunity, but didn't. Gil got within 56 votes of a diplomatic victory in 1916.

RJM

 

[Gumbolt]

Spoiler :

Hmmm I think if I had traded 1-2 techs i would of got it done faster.

I wasnt sure of the Ai tech order come late game.

Its interesting that your first and second attempt finished virtually around the same date.

I need to take a peep at the save to see what you did differently.

 

[RJM]

Spoiler :

Hmmm I think if I had traded 1-2 techs i would of got it done faster.

I wasnt sure of the Ai tech order come late game.

Its interesting that your first and second attempt finished virtually around the same date.

I need to take a peep at the save to see what you did differently.

Spoiler :

Let me try to remember some of the differences. I didn't use a great scientist to found Aluminum Co or Ethanol. I think I changed the tech order slightly so that I could build laboratories. I made a big error in building the docking station, but I picked it up reasonably quickly and it probably only cost me 3 or 4 turns. Those are the only differences I can think of. I think the similarity in the landing date is a coincidence. I suspect (guess) if I had ended the war as soon as they would talk, I might have saved 10 turns.

RJM