[R&F] Era speed in Rise and Fall

evanaurora

Warlord
Joined
Jul 14, 2016
Messages
164
Just started my first game in Rise and Fall and am a... little ticked off?

This is on me, 100%. Somehow I missed that era progression is NOT tied to the average tech of the players, but is a set thing regardless of average player tech.

My preferred way to play civ 6 vanilla was tripling the science/culture costs of techs/civics on standard speed; this gives lots of time to explore, build, conquer in each era without making production tedious like it is on marathon speed.

But.... when era speed is something separate.... this doesn't work??!

My question is do I have to play marathon? Is there a way to reduce production costs in marathon, making it a little more enjoyable? More pressingly... is there a way to modify era progression in standard speed.... because I really enjoyed playing the way I did before R&F.
 

EditorRex

Master of Allusion
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Actually, if I understand what you're talking about correctly, the number of turns remaining in your current era is given as a range that gradually reduces down to a firm number. But I don't think that it's actually fixed to a unknown number at the beginning; something you or the AI are doing is affecting the length of the era. It may be how many Civs have discovered next era techs or something like that. Regardless of Marathon or whatever speed setting, we need to understand this mechanic better. Presumably it will scale up or down with the game speed you set.

On your question about adjusting production costs, the answer is that there is not a way in the sense that you mean. However, if you are clever in maximizing your shields through resource management, city placement, card buffs, steward buffs,etc., you can find that the game moves forward on marathon without too much annoyance. And of course, marathon may nerf a lot of things, but it doesn't nerf troop movement.

On the progression question, do you mean progression from one era to the next, which I addressed above, or progression through techs and civics?
 

ButSam

King
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Dec 27, 2001
Messages
662
I asked this question too, here: https://forums.civfanatics.com/threads/trigger-for-new-age.628211/

No responses as of right now. That said, the deep dive into the Era mechanic by Firaxis stated that it does roughly correspond to tech/civic progress, but was not specific with regards to how. They did say there was a minimum and maximum time for balance reasons, so you don't end up with an extremely short or long Dark/Golden age, and just have everyone in a Dark/Golden Age in the next age because they go too slow/fast.

I do know it is not based on the *first* civ...but beyond that I have not been able to crack it yet.

I suspect (and hope based on the deep dive comment) that the tech progress and civic progress will either shrink or grow the # of turns within the range they give, but I do not know that is true. Perhaps Duel map tests might shed light?
 

Lily_Lancer

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It has a mininum of 40 turns.

But normally an era won't last that long for player to tech, except for the ancient one.

So after ancient you can confidently assume every era to be 40 turns.
 

evanaurora

Warlord
Joined
Jul 14, 2016
Messages
164
I asked this question too, here: https://forums.civfanatics.com/threads/trigger-for-new-age.628211/

No responses as of right now. That said, the deep dive into the Era mechanic by Firaxis stated that it does roughly correspond to tech/civic progress, but was not specific with regards to how. They did say there was a minimum and maximum time for balance reasons, so you don't end up with an extremely short or long Dark/Golden age, and just have everyone in a Dark/Golden Age in the next age because they go too slow/fast.

I do know it is not based on the *first* civ...but beyond that I have not been able to crack it yet.

I suspect (and hope based on the deep dive comment) that the tech progress and civic progress will either shrink or grow the # of turns within the range they give, but I do not know that is true. Perhaps Duel map tests might shed light?

Like I said, I tried a game with my usual x3 tech/civic cost mod in place... and at 60 turns, when I'm emphatically sure no civ had made it to the classical era (that is, I'd be very surprised-- I'd just started irrigation or something, and I was playing on King) the ancient era was over.

So I guess that that's the maximum?? Which is intensely irritating. I hope a mod comes along soon that extends it, or ties it to tech progress or something, because I like a longer, more immersive game.
 

WillowBrook

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It has a mininum of 40 turns.

But normally an era won't last that long for player to tech, except for the ancient one.

So after ancient you can confidently assume every era to be 40 turns.
Not in the game I'm playing right now. King level, will soon finish a ~55 turn classical era.

As for the OP question, I would think those hard min and max numbers could be modded, but someone has to find the right thing to change....
 
Joined
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Messages
346
It looks like the parameters are, appropriately enough, in the file "Expansion1_Eras.xml".

Code:
<Eras_XP1>
     <Row GameEraMaximumTurns="60" GameEraMinimumTurns="40" EraType="ERA_ANCIENT"/>
     <Row GameEraMaximumTurns="60" GameEraMinimumTurns="40" EraType="ERA_CLASSICAL"/>
     <Row GameEraMaximumTurns="60" GameEraMinimumTurns="40" EraType="ERA_MEDIEVAL"/>    
     <Row GameEraMaximumTurns="60" GameEraMinimumTurns="40" EraType="ERA_RENAISSANCE"/>
     <Row GameEraMaximumTurns="60" GameEraMinimumTurns="40" EraType="ERA_INDUSTRIAL"/>
     <Row GameEraMaximumTurns="60" GameEraMinimumTurns="40" EraType="ERA_MODERN"/>
     <Row GameEraMaximumTurns="60" GameEraMinimumTurns="40" EraType="ERA_ATOMIC"/>
</Eras_XP1>

I'd imagine upping those numbers would fix the problem the OP is having.
 

KAL_MAD

Chieftain
Joined
Feb 7, 2017
Messages
55
It looks like the parameters are, appropriately enough, in the file "Expansion1_Eras.xml".

Code:
<Eras_XP1>
     <Row GameEraMaximumTurns="60" GameEraMinimumTurns="40" EraType="ERA_ANCIENT"/>
     <Row GameEraMaximumTurns="60" GameEraMinimumTurns="40" EraType="ERA_CLASSICAL"/>
     <Row GameEraMaximumTurns="60" GameEraMinimumTurns="40" EraType="ERA_MEDIEVAL"/>   
     <Row GameEraMaximumTurns="60" GameEraMinimumTurns="40" EraType="ERA_RENAISSANCE"/>
     <Row GameEraMaximumTurns="60" GameEraMinimumTurns="40" EraType="ERA_INDUSTRIAL"/>
     <Row GameEraMaximumTurns="60" GameEraMinimumTurns="40" EraType="ERA_MODERN"/>
     <Row GameEraMaximumTurns="60" GameEraMinimumTurns="40" EraType="ERA_ATOMIC"/>
</Eras_XP1>

I'd imagine upping those numbers would fix the problem the OP is having.

I'm currently playing a game with a mod that makes tech/civics take x4 the usual time to research, and I got the "10 turns left to new era" message in turn 21 in the ancient era
 

ButSam

King
Joined
Dec 27, 2001
Messages
662
evan, I think that is a consequence of hitting the max that was established to ensure eras don't last too long (so if you get a golden age, for example, you aren't in a disproportionately long one).

There is certainly a min and max time, artificially forcing progression in eras. This time *does* appear to scale with game speed (at least from normal to epic; normal has 20-turn windows, epic has 30-turn windows). It probably does NOT currently automatically scale for tech modifier...perhaps it should, though!

Using a mod, unpredictable things can happen, and especially right after an expansion. Seems to me the modder should make that change. (Or did you just increase the modifier yourself? If so, inrease the era turn window also by the same amount--problem solved!)

I would say this--the fact that you had 300% tech/civic modifier so you knew nobody could trigger the new era AND hit the max time for an era occurred though seems to be another data point suggesting that there IS an actual in-game computation of where the players are at to determine when to start the 10-turn countdown, and that it is not just purely random. It isn't conclusive, but it does suggest that. Of course, the min and max windows override the calculation...that is why they are min and max! I have also noticed that when I am ahead in tech, eras tend to come slower than I think they should (I trigger them "first in the world" and the countdown still hasn't started....opening up the tech or civics windows shows everyone else I know is "before" me on the era slider). So, I have a couple of data points now suggesting it is at least not purely random within that window, but may be correlated to civic/tech progress, as was vaguely suggested in the deep dive.

I do know that the *first* civ to hit an era in either tech or civic tree does NOT trigger the 10-turn countdown, that much is certain...but I also have data points suggesting that WITHIN THE WINDOW, there is an influence from all players in some unknown manner (but apparently related to civic/tech progress)...perhaps average progress, or once a majority of civs research a tech/civic in the era, or some other fashion. If you hit 10 turns before the max with no trigger, though, then the countdown begins regardless of game conditions! (If the trigger is more than 10 turns before min, too, then I presume the game just waits until 10 turns before min.)

If you are really curious about this, try 50% (or less) for research/civic cost and see if you get the earliest time for the era to occur.
 
Last edited:

Ezumiyr

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Apr 9, 2013
Messages
120
I tried a game with my usual x3 tech/civic cost mod in place

I'm currently playing a game with a mod that makes tech/civics take x4 the usual time to research, and I got the "10 turns left to new era" message in turn 21 in the ancient era

The problem is that you're using mods. I don't know how the number of turns in each era is calculated, but it might be the amount of culture/science generated, for example.
 

redfox85

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Nov 12, 2016
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Toronto
I just had a game on Prince where the industrial era was 46 turns, and the atomic era was 14 turns on Normal speed. Setup a nice(permanent) heroic age in the info era.
 

agonistes

wants his subs under ice!
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Like I said, I tried a game with my usual x3 tech/civic cost mod in place... and at 60 turns, when I'm emphatically sure no civ had made it to the classical era (that is, I'd be very surprised-- I'd just started irrigation or something, and I was playing on King) the ancient era was over.

So I guess that that's the maximum?? Which is intensely irritating. I hope a mod comes along soon that extends it, or ties it to tech progress or something, because I like a longer, more immersive game.

You can change the max in global parameters - will affect current games too! I found it wonkie when I entered the classical and everyone had only researched 1 tech.
 

Thibaulthc

Prince
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Sep 29, 2009
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346
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Brussels
I read that the world's era IS affected by the civs' techs and civics. If i remember correctly it was something like "the countdown begins when half the civ have researched a new era tech / civic"
But as shown upper in the post, there IS a hard min and max number of turns for each era (40 and 60, but I guess it scales with speed and other thibns ?)

Would be better if there was (min and) max value for the golden /dark /heroic ages but not for the eras
 
Last edited:

plus

Warlord
Joined
Feb 20, 2016
Messages
146
m
It looks like the parameters are, appropriately enough, in the file "Expansion1_Eras.xml".

Code:
<Eras_XP1>
     <Row GameEraMaximumTurns="60" GameEraMinimumTurns="40" EraType="ERA_ANCIENT"/>
     <Row GameEraMaximumTurns="60" GameEraMinimumTurns="40" EraType="ERA_CLASSICAL"/>
     <Row GameEraMaximumTurns="60" GameEraMinimumTurns="40" EraType="ERA_MEDIEVAL"/>  
     <Row GameEraMaximumTurns="60" GameEraMinimumTurns="40" EraType="ERA_RENAISSANCE"/>
     <Row GameEraMaximumTurns="60" GameEraMinimumTurns="40" EraType="ERA_INDUSTRIAL"/>
     <Row GameEraMaximumTurns="60" GameEraMinimumTurns="40" EraType="ERA_MODERN"/>
     <Row GameEraMaximumTurns="60" GameEraMinimumTurns="40" EraType="ERA_ATOMIC"/>
</Eras_XP1>

I'd imagine upping those numbers would fix the problem the OP is having.
man i looked for these the past 2 days...youre great! guys it has no connection to civs/tech speed.i play at 40 turns per tech/civic,just these era timer is faser...now it will be made longer..thanx!
 

plus

Warlord
Joined
Feb 20, 2016
Messages
146
The problem is that you're using mods. I don't know how the number of turns in each era is calculated, but it might be the amount of culture/science generated, for example.
agree.cancel the mod.u can edit speeds for both tech/civic by yourself and it wont be affected by anything else.
 

plus

Warlord
Joined
Feb 20, 2016
Messages
146
m

man i looked for these the past 2 days...youre great! guys it has no connection to civs/tech speed.i play at 40 turns per tech/civic,just these era timer is faser...now it will be made longer..thanx!
p.s
any idea from where i can remove this banner of era change in 10 9 8 etc turns?i basically got this game to a state that it shows no popups at all and now this era timer
 
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I'm guessing at least 2 civs need techs in the next era to start the timer.

Currently in my game I'm about to get an information era tech and we just barely hit the modern age on the official era (only a Prince level game). One civilization isn't enough to trigger it.

edit: Oh, just checked, I am already in the information age because I have telecommuncations (I wanted to boost social media)
 
Last edited:

EditorRex

Master of Allusion
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Oct 25, 2006
Messages
359
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NC
Just reading through the answers here, some people's game play experience seems to be quite different from mine and I'm wondering if that's level dependent. Can anyone confirm that it's 40 turns deity (50 for ancient), but that lower levels have a range? Also, it may depend on the time setting you use. I'm playing standard speed and have tried both Prince and King games on R&F. I usually played Vanilla on Immortal or Emperor, at least back when I was playing it much.
 

JJOne

Prince
Joined
Jan 29, 2011
Messages
402
Sorry for waking up this old thread. I'm a somewhat new civ 6 player and played only a few games until now. Standard speed was OK, but It appears to me that the new eras come much too quick on marathon. In the last game I got classical when I only had two cities and was researching archery. The neighbours had a few more techs, but none of them seemed to be in classical.
Could another marathon player confirm or contradict this?
If I change "Game Era Maximum Turns" to a huge amount - like 600 instead of 60, would that solve this problem?
 
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