Favorite Naval Civ

[Slobadog]

Mine is Vikings. The trading post makes any ship that has a speed disadvantage more useful. For example the Ship Of The Line become fully better than the frigate. Privateers and subs can raid and avoid enemy ships easier and in the early game sea travel is faster than using roads.

 

[The Sleepy Vike]

The Vikings due to their Trading Posts.

 

[slobberinbear]

Britney Spears.



Oh, I'm sorry, I thought this thread was about Favorite Navels.

 

[Guardian_PL]

@Slobberinbear
Sorry, didn't got it

I vote for Carthage, charismatic SODs of Privateers are nothing to laugh about, and when later they become Destroyers... Let's say that I don't need Battleships anymore
Financial boosts coastal, and Cothon works well with providing overseas income

 

[carl corey]

I'm yet to finish a game with the Vikings and haven't played Portugal yet. Out of the other options I don't see America as such a naval power; sure you'll want to attack with Navy Seals, but nothing gives the navy a direct bonus, and Seals are pretty late in the game. So America's out as a great naval power (I still like playing with them).

Carthage is a very good civ but although I'll want coastal cities I don't think Charismatic is enough to give a real boost to the navy. Privateers are cool, but on Monarch I haven't always got them before the AI has Frigates so they're a waste then. And I expect this to be even rarer on Emperor.

The Dutch on the other hands are insanely good. Financial is always a help, their Unique Unit is a monster, utterly dominating anything until Frigates arrive, and when the dikes kick in you'll be a production god. I played them in my first BtS game and I had so much fun I think they'll become one of my favorites.

So a provisional (unregistered) vote for the Dutch, pending games with the Vikings and Portugal.

 

[Winston Hughes]

Tough choice between the Dutch and the Vikings. I went for the latter.

That +1 movement is HUGE in the early game. And Berserkers are just fantastic for naval invasions and, even better, sneak attacks on lightly guarded cities. Attack, raze, escape - highly profitable, devastating to your enemy, and historically accurate to boot.

Combine the two, with financial as the cherry on top, and even the mighty Dutch don't quite match up.

Carthage is undoubtedly a civ that benefits from a strong navy, but they don't have any particular naval advantage over other Charismatic civs.

As for America and Portugal, I'm with carl corey in both cases.

 

[BriGuy20]

I like the Dutch since they let me colonize the New World on Terra sooner.

 

[mice]

Britney Spears.

Oh, I'm sorry, I thought this thread was about Favorite Navels.

Best Navel , Shakira

 

[Cer]

Naval warfare isn't that interesting, nor very civilization-dependent, in civ4 vanilla .

As for navel warfare, I couldn't say.

As for favorite navels, I have to say that navel oranges are pretty good.

 

[ShunNakamura]

I am of the opinion that really only 3 of those are true 'naval' civilizations.

The Dutch - Solid naval UU + solid UB that empowers all costal/river cities. Even on low land / high water maps they have a very solid production base. The leader of the Dutch is also solid. Definately a top tier civilization on high water maps.

The Vikings - Very nice Naval UB that greatly boosts your ships. In addition with a financial leader your research should easily be high enough that when combined with faster ships that you should get the circumnavigation bonus further speeding up your ships. The UU even boosts this further. It isn't much better than the Maceman on a landlocked map but having early units with free amphibious is nothing to sneeze at; particularly when you remember that it keeps this upon upgrading. No need for marines as the vikings[Mechanized Infantry all the way[well unless all your upgraded Beserkers die]].

Portugal - Free Colossus in all cities[sort of like a partial financial trait]. If you can manage to combine the Colossus and the Great Lighthouse with Portugal you'll have one heck of an economy. Of particular fun is playing them with a financial leader. However, considering ole' Joao being in charge they are a bit less fun. Still, they are very very solid. This is all without taking into account their UU. On maps without an ocean between civs this is a weak UU. However, if there are ocean Portugal will be the first capable of transporting a military or at least capable of settling much faster[two units compared to 1 special unit].


Final analysis. I would probably pick them depending on the map.
Maps with large seas but also large continents[think continents with 5 continents or something]:

Dutch or Vikings would be my pick. Dutch still get the production advantage and the Viking Berserker is still very useful[since ships travel faster than land units it is best if you can land straight from the ship]​

Maps with almost no land but limitless sea tiles:

Dutch. They can produce when no one else can. The leader is financial so they can easily double the commerce of water tiles[fin + 1 colossus + 1]. All Portugal has on them is faster growth thanks to the earlier transport UU.​

Maps with almost no land but limitless sea tiles and you have unrestricted leaders:

Portugal. Finacial leader + Colossus + the Great Lighthouse + the UB equates to a heck of a commerce lead. I particularly like Capac for this[makes it easier to get both the Great Lighthouse and the Colossus[particularly since on a water map you won't be the only one after them].​

Vikings just lose too much steam on maps with little land and much water[too little production]. And the Dutch are just insanely powerful when you take into account that they have very good synergy between traits, UBs, and UUs. None of them are overpowering alone[ok... maybe the dike is] but when you combine them all you get a very big monster. Just think about it on maps with very little land you can outproduce everyone else easily, you got a solid research base thanks to financial, and your UU reigns supreme for a fair bit of time[until frigates and ship of the lines].

Yeah, I think overall if I don't know the map before hand I would go for the Dutch. They just are hard to be disadvantaged in any map that is going to have a fair bit of water.

 

[carl corey]

I've played a bit with Portugal and even with their UB giving a sort-of Financial flavor it comes late enough to be compared with the Dutch UB, and the comparison isn't in its advantage. As for their UU, I find it would be best used on maps with lots of islands out of galley contact with each other, but those are rare. Most maps will have the islands close to one of the continents, or far enough for a fleet of caravels to be a bit too expensive to sustain. If you really consider intercontinental warfare you can't even start to compare it with the Dutch UU. It's usually worth waiting for Galleons, and the Dutch replacement is an absolute beast at that point in the game.

The Vikings are the only civ left to challenge the Dutch, but I'll have to play a few games with them to get the feel of things.

 

[dutchking]

DUTCH!!!!!! Duh... The killer unique unit wins me over. Carthage is also a decent choice, as well as portugal. Don't know why America is there...

 

[Winston Hughes]

having early units with free amphibious is nothing to sneeze at; particularly when you remember that it keeps this upon upgrading

I forgot about that. Another plus for our monastery-pillaging friends.

Similarly, the Nav1 bonus lasts throughout the game.

Between the two of these, the Vikings can launch an amphibious invasion at the drop of a (spiky) hat in any post-Berserker era.

And they're the only civ to get a naval bonus in the earlier part of the game (charismatic civs being a very minor exception).

The Dutch may be able to produce more ships later on, and their UU may rule the waves for a time.

But if you want a civ with a game-long naval advantage, no-one beats the disciples of Odin.

 

[popejubal]

A Naval civ is probably going to be very spread apart. Lots of cities that are not on your home continent. It's also a lot harder to dominate the world when the world is so spread out. That's why I like the Zulu with their Ikhanda and Holy Rome with the Ratshaus. Low city maintenance means more cities possible. More cities possible means bigger and better empire.


...at least if you're talking Archepelago.

 

[KMadCandy]

I like the Dutch since they let me colonize the New World on Terra sooner.

being portuguese gets you there even faster .

i voted dutch because i am in love with dikes. in my latest game all my cities are coastal, and i didn't give a single thought to rivers, since my last 4 games i'd been either Willem (where dikes can be built on the coast) or Joao (expansive so health isn't as big a concern). oops. i'm not either one of them this time. my city placement was the PITS! i need dikes not levees in my game waaaaaaah. he really is fun to play tho.

being Joao on a terra map is wicked fun, he'd be my second.

the vikings are really good, and i think my fastest conquest victory ever was as ragnar on an archi map. but i'm just not the conquesting type, so they're not my favorite most days. but i love privateers, maybe i should try some charismatic privateering...

 

[illram]

Dikes FTW.

 

[Shakauvm]

Currently playing a monarch marathon game, and vikings are just incredible. Sure, the dutch UU would be awesome to have right now, but aggressive + berserkers is just unstoppable. Financial gave me astronomy before anyone else, and early wars for 3 great generals + civics bonuses means that berserkers come out with 3 or 4 upgrades on top of their free amphibious and +10% city attack means that I just sail around a coast loaded up on berserkers and nothing else, and drop "berserker bombs" on any city with 3 or less defenders.

With city attack and anti-archery upgrades, they've been steamrolling through super city defense longbowmen like butter, losing maybe one berserker per city I've been capturing. Like Sun Tzu says, you can't be strong everywhere at once, and the berserkers cut out that critical round in which you drop your stack next to an enemy city, and the enemy rushes defensive units by road into the city to reinforce. I've never conquered an island nation as fast as I have with berserkers.

After you capture a city, you can either dump city defense longbowmen into it, or just raze it and move on to the next. There's no counter unit to berserkers at this time period -- berserkers get +50% vs macemen, and longbowmen just have too low a strength to hold out against the viking onslaught, even with full city culture defense. I only ignore cities with huge stacks of defenders in it.

During the time period around where macemen are the top unit, the vikings completely dominate coastal cities. Later on, you mass produce bersekers then upgrade them into riflemen or grenadiers, and you still carry on the proud tradition of being able to carry out unstoppable naval invasions directly from the sea.

The UB of the vikings + financial means that I can win circumnavigation, and run around the whole game with +2 movement on all ships. While dutch ships are undoubtedly superior during its timeframe, +2 to movement during the whole game is just too awesome, especially since you're playing for a conquest victory with the aggressive vikings.

 

[Crighton]

I'm surprised there hasn't been more commentary regarding carthage, the cothon alone is truly wonderful.

 

[Nelgirith]

Portugal if it's possible to spam coastal cities. Joao's traits are just excellent for city spamming and if coastal the feitorias are wonderful for economy.

I could have said Netherlands, but I just hate playing them. I hate Willem

 

[Lord_Megahertz]

The Dutch rule the seas and dominate island maps