First Win on Monarch Challenge

[pholkhero]

pawelo, when i find the time (i think i saw soem hiding underneath a rock ~ better go check that out), i'll take a crack at this.

I've been keen on trying a Pottery-first gambit for those civs who start w/both it's prereq's, and Willem may be just the ticket (though w/CRE and FIN, it'll get even better!)

 

[pawelo]

Dropping by to see how it went

As many of you have downloaded the initial save, can you give me your afterthoughts (for those who finished this game) ?

CBPE, I'm curious about how your game went ? Was it a score ?

Anyway, I hope you enjoyed it like I did!
Feel free to drop by and report your game in a few words - I always loved to compare different ways to play the same situation.

 

[CBPE]

I'm sorry, but in these days I'm just lurking a bit the forum but I have no time to play.

It's all in stand-by

 

[Trieste]

Hey sg buddy

I'm about 100 turns in (99, it's a nice even number)

First moves were a long time ago, but I believe they were:

Spoiler :

Mining(popped from that 1st hut)>AH >BW>wheel>pottery>writing

work boat>worker>warrior

worked clams, 2nd clams (switched this to fp when cottage was up), plains hills mine

and more recently:
(Don't let this worry you too much for DM VII )

Spoiler :

I got the academy pretty quickly (~t85) but whipping stuff delayed it a bit. After looking at CPBE's game, I'm going to re-hire the scientists. Expansion was pretty slow, but the economy is still strong, and currency up next will boost that more. Techs are in one of the screens below, I really regret taking horseback riding now. With the 20 turns that took, currency could be done. Everyone is on my land, but the French can still be blocked by a city between Utrecht and Vandal. Bulawayo was founded just a turn after The Hague . I'll fight the Zulu as soon as I get a few more swordsmen

(Out of the first 2 columns I'm only missing mysticism(still), meditation, masonry, and polytheism)

I might just reload and take Shaka out early.

Any suggestions?

 

[pawelo]

Hey Trieste!

Glad to see the thread get a second breathe
I see your game going pretty well.

Spoiler :

All this ugly jungle, once shredded to pieces, is a pure wonder in terms of cheese economy - be sure to claim it soon enough

Shaka seems still doable, especially given the fact he lacks copper and must go for chariots/archers only. Go ahead and smack him!

I'm amazed at how far you have sent the 2nd city. Is it only for blocking purposes?

Good luck!

Hope you'll keep me updated with how the game went

 

[Trieste]

Always nice to bring back a fun thread from the oblivion beyond page 1

Spoiler :

Utrecht was for copper, the Hague was for blocking - if it wasn't, 1 north would have traded some desert for grassland, but I built it when Shaka had a more powerful army and the hill defense bonus seemed especially nice.

 

[v8_mark]

Thanks for the bump, I missed this first time round. I've won a total of one game on Monarch, and after getting my behind kicked on a couple of occasions, wanted a confidence boost again

Spoiler :

Interesting game, I'm just over 100 turns in as well. I went a little differently to most others, in that my early game tech was:

Wheel -> Pottery -> AH -> (Mining - popped) -> BW

...mainly because I wanted to get workboats out in a hurry, and get cottages online as soon as possible. This seemed to work out - initial builds were, like most others, WB-WB-Worker-Worker-Warrior-Settler. It worked out because I popped Mining, basically - this coincided my first worker with the discovery of Bronze Working, meaning I could chop and whip to my heart's content with my high food tiles.

Next tech after BW was Sailing and Writing, which seemed a good idea, and so it proved. It meant I didn't need roads to hook up my cities, and I was able to trade with Shaka. Once open borders were signed, I was getting 2 commerce per city - highly useful with 3 coastal cities and 15 total commerce otherwise. I also managed to trade fur with him, upping my happy cap by one.

Then went Maths -> Calendar for all the resources, then Alphabet for trading. Not exactly a usual research pattern, I know.

Founded my second city on the isthmus to the west, which was immediately productive (thanks to the plains cows) and grew like a weed (thanks to the fish). This city was useful in that I threw up a lighthouse, library and ran a couple of specialists, netting myself an early academy in the capital.

Third city was founded on one of the dyes to the north - fourth was to the east, semi-blocking Shaka - fifth, sixth and seventh all in the jungle (annoyingly, I wasn't quite quick enough to get the pig-iron site to the north - Louis beat me to it!). So I now have an army of workers clearing the jungle, plopping cottages anywhere and everywhere that's on a river, and research is really starting to fly. Currently researching CoL in 100BC, next will be CS for some smelly cottage/Bureaucracy/Academy cheese! Happy caps are up at 10 as well, which I plan to use in a hurry.

Bit worried about my production, but I'm just managing to stay on the 0.8/0.9 power ratio cusp with Shaka, which should be enough. I'm considering bribing him to take on Darius, which might keep him occupied for a while. Otherwise, I fear an attack may be imminent.

 

[pawelo]

Thanks for your reporting v8_mark! Seems like a great start

Spoiler :

I'm not sure that he'll attack you with this power rating. Still, as you have blocked him in his small isthmus, he may be forced to. Have you considered stacking a nice force in your border city to decimate his stack and counter attack ? This is the greatest psycho in the town

Regarding the jungle, it's a priority to get these trees down as there are monster commerce cities to run there, especially financial. Good start btw with all these cottages - did the same in mine and it payed off well.

Keep it going! Good luck!

 

[Orion071]

I think I'll try this game out. Monarch is a little scary though, since I'm only a Noble player...

Actually, I haven't even played the game since my last Noble walkthrough, so this would be a nice game to get me back on my feet. Not to mention that I'm a big fan of Willem.

I'll try it tonight and post a report this weekend.

 

[pawelo]

I think I'll try this game out. Monarch is a little scary though, since I'm only a Noble player...

Actually, I haven't even played the game since my last Noble walkthrough, so this would be a nice game to get me back on my feet. Not to mention that I'm a big fan of Willem.

I'll try it tonight and post a report this weekend.

You're not alone (big fan of Willem I mean );

I hope you'll aprreciate this one - it's been a great deal of fun for me to play it.
I will surely learn a lot from your report

 

[v8_mark]

Played to 1120AD. State of the world is:

Spoiler :

Northern Empire:

Southern Empire:

Border with Persia:

...as you can see, I've been at war with Persia, taking his northern city (Ecbatana) which had sugar and bananas. I didn't push from there because I was worried about a) my lack of troops, and b) my economy. However, Ecbatana should be a very useful production city in the not too distant future. I had planned it so that I would, with my cottage economy, be able to steal Philosophy from Darius as soon as he discovered it, then declare peace. Unfortunately, and annoyingly, the spy failed at 69%, so I'm going to have to research it the hard way. I declared peace anyway.

As you can see, cottage/Bureaucracy/academy cheese is in full effect. I have quite a lot of land, but I may well need it, with Maya (who I've just met) doing very nicely for itself over the water. Tech is coming along swimmingly, though I delayed the Liberalism race a bit for Engineering. I normally hit Liberalism on Prince with enough of a margin that I can afford to do that, but it may be silly on Monarch. I think Liberalism will be close - Education in 7, as you can see, I still need Philosophy (3-4) and Liberalism itself will be 6-7. 17 turns for Liberalism is, what, 1280AD? Close, I think. I'll take Astronomy if I get there.

Diplomatically, things are very interesting (and good, from my point of view) - Zulu eventually attacked Persia even without my provocation, and took their southern city, as you can see. However, it was expensive, as they dropped behind both myself and France in terms of power. I then bribed France to declare (only cost me Drama and Compass) and their stack of jumbos and cats is on its way now. Louis loves me (at +18 or something silly) and Shaka likes me too (he's at +9ish).

Game's gone well so far. Next move might be to finish Persia off, if I get the chance.

 

[pawelo]

v8_mark

Spoiler :

Really good game going on

Happy to see the CE working so perfectly as in this one, with all these chopped jungles and grass and rivers.

You have managed beutiful diplo (I never got Shaka to +9 - usually he is dead or too powerful before ).

I would go for Persia - I assume Darius has landed some nice wonders in Persepolis so it can be a nice and fast pay off. Also, wouldn't it be nice to Rifle some Zulus in not so far future ?

With Maya on the other side of the world, I would go for Lib asap (I assume you do) as it won't last. Hope it will work for you.

Waiting to see how it turns out

 

[v8_mark]

Thanks pawelo. Played a few more turns last night:

Spoiler :

Eventually traded for Philosophy once I'd finished Education, and then was first to Liberalism (took Astronomy). Traded that for Banking, Guilds, then got Economics for the Great Merchant.

Then annoyingly popped a Prophet, so used that to bulb Divine Right (which I could see Louis was 4 turns away from), finished off that research and got myself Islam. With Judaism and Hinduism already in my lands, the plan will probably be to spread them early and go into Free Religion soon.

Things not so good diplomatically - Louis vassalized Darius. I didn't think he'd manage to take a city with that small stack, but he did, which is a bummer.

Rifles for Shaka sounds like a good idea to be honest, or even infantry - need to find some way of upping my production in the meantime. My first instinct is to wait until Chemistry, go US/Caste/FM/FR, and use lots of workshops in my high food cities. At 4 hammers/tile, they're nothing to be sneezed at. Assembly Line will give me factories, hopefully before everyone else, and I'll be laughing.

Still a very interesting game; this is normally the point at which the wheels start falling off at Monarch.

 

[pawelo]

v8_mark

Spoiler :

Looks like it's a little bit more cheesy than the last time. Too bad Louis vassalized Darius - they will be hard to deal with if you go military. The only one left is Shaka.

Or you may tech peacefully into space - this option is pretty open too.
With three religions on hand, you can also try the Culture win - temples/caths spam, broadway, R&R and Hollywood along the way and here you are with Uber-culture.

 

[v8_mark]

Spoiler :

Game is over - space win, 1927AD! Quickest space win ever, quite comfortably, and it wasn't over until my superior production and 2 golden ages (helped by Mining Inc) made the difference.

State of the world:

Demographics and stuff:

Some other misc screenies from the end:

Tale of the tape was basically that I declared on Shaka with infantry. Unfortunately I mistimed it slightly, in that he had Machine Guns just as I was invading, so I had to beat a couple of those, which were expensive. But I easily had the numbers, and vassalized Shaka having taken all of his mainland cities. I probably could (and should) have taken a few of his island cities, in retrospect. He did do me one big favour though - incorporated Mining Inc just before I got to his capital, which I spread amongst my main production cities. It made a big difference.

With everyone else peaceful, it was always going to be a race to Alpha Centauri from there, and so it proved - my production was always just about the best, but I started lagging behind in tech to the alliance across the water. They were best of friends, and exchanged tech indiscriminately, but wouldn't with me.

By the time it came to the spaceship, my research was flying anyway - and the production was what made the difference.

Save is here.

Big thanks to pawelo for posting this, and sorry I was a bit late. How did you do in your run through of this game, btw?

 

[pawelo]

@v8_mark

Spoiler :

Great job man! Very nice space victory.
Btw, I achieved it a year earlier

Here it is how it went.
I settled the same spot that you did for Amsterdam.
I went up to two cities while researching BW/IW followed by the pottery. Once the iron was discovered (near my second city), I chopped a party of swords and went after Shaka. It was harder than usual - Shaka is a powerful early gamer - still swords vs chariots/archers, I was victorious. Shaka left the game before 1000BC. Several settlements later (and many many turns later) I attacked my friend Louis (around 800AD) with Maces (über-swords from the Shaka war)/Cats, taking his mainland cities in 2-times war. He has landed a huge share of wonders in Paris, plus religions. I couldn't let him be
I vassalized him around 1400AD, then I made a stop to tech up to Rifles. With Rifles/Cavalry I went after the best part of Persia, getting main cities quite fast. I don't recall if I vassalized Darius or not...
Afterwards, it was downhill. Tech to space with my magnificent cottage power ( never had such a great CE ), got Sid Sushi to get my cities even bigger.
Here are some screenies of my last turn.

The continent:



Amsterdam:



Score (my best one on Monarch ):



I'm happy to see you enjoyed it! I did enjoy it greatly

To every1 who tried it and enjoyed, thanks a lot for giving it a shot!
Hope you'll be here for the First Win on Emperor challange (not yet.

 

[v8_mark]

Spoiler :

Haha, great stuff. Funny that you beat me by one year.

One of my main weaknesses is that I'm too much of a builder; more land earlier would have given me a much better platform, long term. Although I may not have been able to hit Liberalism first. Still, it's a win