Fishing vs. Liberalism

[frob2900]

For a situation where one is playing a civ that doesnt start with fishing, and where the nautical techs are useless (e.g. Great Plains), there is a very quick way to liberalism.

Firstly, it pays to get Civil Service quickly. This can be accomplished in the 2.08 patch with a Great Merchant, as detailed in:

http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=140952

The only problem there is getting metal casting or avoiding bronze working to block it. Not having fishing will also block out sailing in the Great Merchant preferences:

Currency
Banking
Economics
Corporation
Metal Casting <- GET THIS SOMEHOW
Code of Laws
Mining
Constitution
Wheel
Pottery
Sailing <-- DONT HAVE TO BOTHER
Paper
Railroad
Industrialism
Monarchy
Civil Service

In any case, however one gets Civil Service, one will take the Philosophy slingshot with a GS and then the next steps are of course ->Paper->Education->Liberalism.

Metal casting will have to be done at this point, or else bronze working still left out (which is pretty crazy).

Now, and heres the nice part, for any civ without fishing, the great scientist preferences will look like:

(codes: D = ALREADY DONE, L = LATE, MB = MAKE SURE ITS BLOCKED, N = NAUTICAL, THUS BLOCKED WITHOUT FISHING)

Writing D
Mathematics D
Scientific Method L
Physics L
Education D
Printing Press MB
Fiber Optics L
Computers L
The Wheel D
Philosophy D
Chemistry L
Fission L
Fusion L
Optics N
Paper D
Astronomy N
Biology L
Electricity L
Flight L
Genetics L
Compass N
Satellites L
Sailing N
Alphabet D
Calendar N
Medicine L
Ecology L
Iron Working D
Metal Casting D
Engineering L
Steam Power L
Liberalism BINGO

So there it is.. Without having to plow through the nautical techs all the way to astronomy, Liberalism is served up with a great scientist.

If one wishes to add a wonder to the mix, the best (and easiest) is oracle->metal casting, thus allowing bronze working and allowing the Great Merchant to directly pop Civil Service once currency is done..

With this approach the only heavy researches on the way to liberalism are monarchy and currency! Exactly everything else is popped with 1 great merchant and 3-5 great scientists. If one manages the oracle->metal casting slingshot its also probably very possible to trade metal casting for currency and monarchy with the AIs, and so the path to liberalism would in this case be fully bulbable without any reseach bottlenecks at all..

 

[oyzar]

3-5 scientists takes quite a while to get...

 

[frob2900]

Well the point is really that liberalism is directly bulbable under those conditions.
In any case you want as many great scientists as you can get, they are paramount for efficient early teching.. If possible use Caste System/Pacifism for a while..

 

[DaveMcW]

What do you pick as your free tech?

 

[mutax2003]

Maybe get fishing from liberalism, so that he can finally catch those crabs off the coast. ^^

 

[HorsemasterK]

What do you pick as your free tech?

lol, this is always my problem when I prioritize Liberalism irrationally (which sometimes happens, and I get it at like 400AD.)

While it is important to win the Liberalism RACE (getting it before any of the AI's), that doesn't mean its crucial to get it as soon as technically possible (maybe for a cultural victory to run Free Speech, I dunno.)

Frankly, since Liberalism is a 'Free Tech' I try to pursue at least 1 'more expensive' tech to unlock something that I would actually want to sling (Astro, Chem, or Constitution usually, though I'm sure I deviate sometimes), rather than settling on like... Nationalism or something.

/moo

 

[frob2900]

What do you pick as your free tech?

Yeah, thats actually a problem if one goes directly for liberalism.. the only good tech to take then is nationalism, but theres nothing really draftable yet and the Taj Mahal might not pay off if ones empire isnt large enough...

However it is somewhat easy to go for gunpowder/engineering and then whip/draft a musketman+trebuchet army which is really not to be sneezed at, I've noticed (sizeable muskets/trebs/pikemen stacks will eat any pre-riflemen AI for breakfast). In fact, putting up the Taj Mahal so that the trebs/pikes build fast together with the drafted muskets (under theocracy preferably), one can zoom up the power rating like theres no tomorrow.. The Golden Age should also allow a large enough bank account to upgrade most offensive units to the latest tech, giving a further power boost..

Also, if one still leaves the nautical branch closed (which is bound to hurt since Calendar resources are going to be important at this point), its possible to run up another tech tree (toward e.g. chemistry) and still pop liberalism with a GS.

Nationalism is on the way toward democracy, and one could use a GM to get constitution after nationalism so that one is even closer.. (I really looked over this strategy when I was trying to figure out how to get quickly to democracy..)

Maybe get fishing from liberalism, so that he can finally catch those crabs off the coast. ^^

Lol Well obviously! I hate having to pour all those beakers into fishing, it really slows my research down for ages

 

[Dirk1302]

Yeah, thats actually a problem if one goes directly for liberalism.. the only good tech to take then is nationalism, but theres nothing really draftable yet and the Taj Mahal might not pay off if ones empire isnt large enough...

However it is somewhat easy to go for gunpowder/engineering and then whip/draft a musketman+trebuchet army which is really not to be sneezed at, I've noticed (sizeable muskets/trebs/pikemen stacks will eat any pre-riflemen AI for breakfast). In fact, putting up the Taj Mahal so that the trebs/pikes build fast together with the drafted muskets (under theocracy preferably), one can zoom up the power rating like theres no tomorrow.. The Golden Age should also allow a large enough bank account to upgrade most offensive units to the latest tech, giving a further power boost..

Also, if one still leaves the nautical branch closed (which is bound to hurt since Calendar resources are going to be important at this point), its possible to run up another tech tree (toward e.g. chemistry) and still pop liberalism with a GS.

Nationalism is on the way toward democracy, and one could use a GM to get constitution after nationalism so that one is even closer.. (I really looked over this strategy when I was trying to figure out how to get quickly to democracy..)



Lol Well obviously! I hate having to pour all those beakers into fishing, it really slows my research down for ages

Nationalism on the way to constitution would be more than ok for SE players .

 

[obsolete]

Nationalism is on the way toward democracy, and one could use a GM to get constitution after nationalism so that one is even closer.. (I really looked over this strategy when I was trying to figure out how to get quickly to democracy..)

I find democracy one of the lowest requirements on my list, due to UN exploits.

 

[frob2900]

I find democracy one of the lowest requirements on my list, due to UN exploits.

UN exploits? Do you mean getting the civics from the UN vote??? In that case I'd say thats rather late to get the civics, the game should be pretty much determined by the time UN is built..

Early emancipation is good if one has neglected cottages early in order to run a militaristic game and then needs fast cottage growth to fill the gap left by fewer specialists..

 

[futurehermit]

just take gunpowder and use 2 GSs on chemistry.