Food for thought: A priest's interesting take on the crucifix.

[Pontiuth Pilate]

Any religion that concerns itself with what the afterlife might be like is.

 

[floppa21]

Well, to make a long story short, I went to church on my own. The start of my spiritual journey which is by no means over. I had gone to church in the past with my mother and whatnot as a child, but nothing regular until I was about 13. Went on my own, joined a youth group church, studied the Bible and prayed. I quickly realized that speaking in tongues was BS. Some did it, I have no doubt, out of honest truthfulness and belief. Others did it to fit in. I did neither. I noticed that 'emotions' could affect/infect you when you were in a group a lot easier than when on your own. I prayed and prayed and wanted to believe. I asked God to help me believe and to see the truth. He never did. Maybe my problem was not having the blind faith that is oh so required by religion. I saw the corruption in that particular church with my own eyes. Pastor saying one thing at church, doing the opposite when I happen to see him at a restaurant or in public. I stopped going to that church and started reading on my own. I read the Bible, I studied religion as best I could on my own at the age of 15. Life has shaped my beliefs some of course. I'm 28 now.

I do not like organized religion. I find it a dangerous tool, but the people who just read this line and attribute it as their tool are wrong. You are being manipulated by it, but you are not running it. Not seeing this is what is dangerous. This kills me. Do you honestly think I'm insane for feeling this frustration? Well, I think people are blind for NOT seeing it.

You religous people will say 'What harm is it to try and believe, to accept Christ as your Savior?" Well I have tried. I tried like a motherf*cker. I respond to you, "What harm would it do to take a step back and try to see this from a different view?" Would it shake your faith so badly that it would be detrimental to your religousness? Well then maybe that's a reason to do it. I am not concerned for your soul. I am not trying to convert anyone. One cannot be converted to my beliefs. But being objective is almost always better than being subjective.

 

[Bozo Erectus]

floppa, you listen to and trust your inner voice, thats why you couldnt go along with the bs. Keep listening to it and eventually it'll bring you to a relationship with god that you feel comfortable with. Stay away from organised religions, theyre the Kmarts and Walmarts of spirituality. Find your own way. Thats what wise men have always had to do.

 

[floppa21]

Well thanks DP, does that mean I'm wise?

I think God is not a relation I will ever have now. I gave Him a shot eh? I'm quite selective of my friends, one might even say to the point of snobbish. Meh.

 

[Bozo Erectus]

One way to see how wise a man is is by the questions he asks. So by that definition I would say yes, you are. Let it go for now then, it'll always be there for you if you ever want it again.

 

[Archer 007]

Originally posted by floppa21
Again his sacrifice is thus worthless. BIG sacrifice that...

The cross is Death? So Christianity really IS a death cult like some people claim?

How was the sacrifice worthless?
The cross does not mean death, but the power over death. That death is just a new beginning.

 

[floppa21]

Jesus knew he would die and rise in three days. He knew he was the son of God. He went to hell and came back with the keys of Death ad nauseum. Whoo, big sacrifice. Who wouldn't have been crucifed to wash away the sins of the world, travel to HELL and acquire the keys of Death, and then return to HEAVEN to be God's right hand man? Probably learned some nice spells and leveled up a bit on the way.

 

[floppa21]

Doh - Double Post

 

[e_a_olson]

I've always thought Christ on the crucafix was tantamount to the golden calf...

 

[FearlessLeader2]

Originally posted by CurtSibling
Here is an interesting article, in which a priest raises a few valid points about our view of the most well-known symbol of christianity, the crucifix.

Full story...

Do you think the representation of christ dying on a cross is a proper symbol for this religion?

Opinions?

I'd say no, but not for any of the reasons mentioned in tha article. The best reason of all is the actual translation of the Greek word pylos.

I'm not even going to tell you what the word pylos means, go ahead and look it up, and then tell me if a crucifix is appropriate.

EDIT: Oops, almost forgot. I think there's a commandment or some such about graven images too...

 

[smalltalk]

Originally posted by HuckFinn
If Jesus had died today, would Christianity's symbol be Jesus strapped to an electric chair? That would be so totally cool...

Thank God, that Jesus did not live in Germany, 1943.
Worshipping Zyclon B and Gas Chambers wouldn't really be so cool.

The Crucifix is a left over from the days when the Church forgot its own message. It's a dark and negative symbol related to death. As far as I know it became official at the notorious council of Niceaa.

I would really want to see more fishes. This is a positive symbol. Ask a fish whether he would believe into water, and he would say: "Water? No! I don't see no water!"

originally posted by FearlessLeader2
Oops, almost forgot. I think there's a commandment or some such about graven images too...

Of course there is, but not every Christians adheres to what's in the OT.

BTW, care to enlighten us about pylos, please?

Pylos, the kingdom of Nestor, is in southwestern Peloponnesus.

 

[Speedo]

The cross isn't a graven image to me. I don't worship it.

Since Jesus says that to be His disciple you must "take up your cross and follow Him," I still think it's a good symbol for Christianity.

 

[floppa21]

How about an inverted cross? Does that count?

 

[Gothmog]

If we are voting, I vote for...

bobble head Jesus!!!

 

[floppa21]

HE gets my vote...

 

[Gothmog]

He is pretty cool, but can he be mounted on the dashboard of your car?

Maybe we should start a poll.

 

[Phydeaux]

Well, to make a long story short, I went to church on my own. The start of my spiritual journey which is by no means over. I had gone to church in the past with my mother and whatnot as a child, but nothing regular until I was about 13. Went on my own, joined a youth group church, studied the Bible and prayed. I quickly realized that speaking in tongues was BS. Some did it, I have no doubt, out of honest truthfulness and belief. Others did it to fit in. I did neither. I noticed that 'emotions' could affect/infect you when you were in a group a lot easier than when on your own. I prayed and prayed and wanted to believe. I asked God to help me believe and to see the truth. He never did. Maybe my problem was not having the blind faith that is oh so required by religion. I saw the corruption in that particular church with my own eyes. Pastor saying one thing at church, doing the opposite when I happen to see him at a restaurant or in public. I stopped going to that church and started reading on my own. I read the Bible, I studied religion as best I could on my own at the age of 15. Life has shaped my beliefs some of course. I'm 28 now.

I do not like organized religion. I find it a dangerous tool, but the people who just read this line and attribute it as their tool are wrong. You are being manipulated by it, but you are not running it. Not seeing this is what is dangerous. This kills me. Do you honestly think I'm insane for feeling this frustration? Well, I think people are blind for NOT seeing it.

You religous people will say 'What harm is it to try and believe, to accept Christ as your Savior?" Well I have tried. I tried like a motherf*cker. I respond to you, "What harm would it do to take a step back and try to see this from a different view?" Would it shake your faith so badly that it would be detrimental to your religousness? Well then maybe that's a reason to do it. I am not concerned for your soul. I am not trying to convert anyone. One cannot be converted to my beliefs. But being objective is almost always better than being subjective.

Well said. Many churchs get to much in to religion. @floppa21 what church did you go to? I find that catholics are realy religous. I have known many people who have had the same things happen to them. What they said is that they didn't hear from God, God was just a big cross on the wall to them. So they left God or at least the church. Then to make a long story short they found a church that didn't act so religous. I think thats what you should do.
You need to be with other people of the same beliefs.

 

[Phydeaux]

Jesus knew he would die and rise in three days. He knew he was the son of God. He went to hell and came back with the keys of Death ad nauseum. Whoo, big sacrifice. Who wouldn't have been crucifed to wash away the sins of the world, travel to HELL and acquire the keys of Death, and then return to HEAVEN to be God's right hand man? Probably learned some nice spells and leveled up a bit on the way.

The body of Jesus was so beat and torn up that he was hardly recognizable as a man .... Isa 52:14_ As many were astonied at thee; his visage was so marred more than any man, and his form more than the sons of men:__

The wrath of God was pour out upon him for all the sin of mankind.... Isa 53:4 ¶ Surely he hath borne our griefs, and carried our sorrows: yet we did esteem him stricken, smitten of God, and afflicted.___ Isa 53:5_ But he [was] wounded for our transgressions, [he was] bruised for our iniquities: the chastisement of our peace [was] upon him; and with his stripes we are healed.__ _Isa 53:7_ He was oppressed, and he was afflicted, yet he opened not his mouth: he is brought as a lamb to the slaughter, and as a sheep before her shearers is dumb, so he openeth not his mouth.__

_1Pe 3:18 ¶ For Christ also hath once suffered for sins, the just for the unjust, that he might bring us to God, being put to death in the flesh, but quickened by the Spirit:__

NO ONE would want to sufffer 3 days and 3 nights in the such torment as the lowest part of hades. _ Lu 16:24_ And he cried and said, Father Abraham, have mercy on me, and send Lazarus, that he may dip the tip of his finger in water, and cool my tongue; for I am tormented in this flame._

Humans are to selfish to want to save every one by death on a cross.

 

[Bose]

Originally posted by floppa21
HE gets my vote...

Buddy Christ!!!

 

[CurtSibling]

Originally posted by FearlessLeader2

I'd say no, but not for any of the reasons mentioned in tha article. The best reason of all is the actual translation of the Greek word pylos.

I'm not even going to tell you what the word pylos means, go ahead and look it up, and then tell me if a crucifix is appropriate.

You assume I do not know the meaning?

I think you mistake me for a less educated type, FL2.

From my Greek myth knowledge, the city of Pylos in Messenia was founded by Neleus.