Future tech

[Abaxial]

I was trying to think of some appropriate technologies that could be introduced at the end of the tech tree besides upgrades to the GDR (which I think is really a BattleMech rather than a robot). One possibility that strikes me is Improved Satellites. Research this and it removes all fog of war. You don't just see the map, you see all units as well. After all, we have this today (remember the pictures of Russian tanks failing to get to Kyiv) unlike GDRs (or BattleMechs).

Any more suggestions?

 

[Boris Gudenuf]

Among the 'cutting edge' technologies being developed or experimented with now are:
Nano-Technology - to effectively 'grow' products instead of fabricating them.
Genetic Engineering - of both plants and animals as well as bacteria
Artificial Intelligence - including autonomous military and civilian machinery/weapons
Micro-Swarm Drones - microscopic or near-microscopic machines deployed as swarms to accomplish attacks or surveillance: think manufactured beehive that can be given orders.
Fusion Power - which may soon be Present Tech instead of Future Tech
Neuro-Implants - 'Cyborgizing' people with computer interfaces and other electronics implanted directly into them

'Way back in the 1970s a great deal of work was done on conceptualizing Satellite-Mounted Weapons, all of which development was brought to a halt by treaties 'de-militarizing space'. These included high-density metallic rods that could be dropped at super-hypersonic speeds (30 - 80,000 kilometers per hour) to smash targets as small as individual vehicles, satellite-to-ground guided/cruise/hypersonic missiles, Anti-Satellite weapons (notably, Project Burro, or the Anti-Satellite Satellite - read the initials). Also, as far back as the 1970s it was discovered that Satellite surveillance could not only reveal the entire map, but also man-made objects as small as individual (compact) automobiles, even through clouds and at night - and that technology has only gotten better every decade since.

 

[reddishrecue]

Among the 'cutting edge' technologies being developed or experimented with now are:
Nano-Technology - to effectively 'grow' products instead of fabricating them.
Genetic Engineering - of both plants and animals as well as bacteria
Artificial Intelligence - including autonomous military and civilian machinery/weapons
Micro-Swarm Drones - microscopic or near-microscopic machines deployed as swarms to accomplish attacks or surveillance: think manufactured beehive that can be given orders.
Fusion Power - which may soon be Present Tech instead of Future Tech
Neuro-Implants - 'Cyborgizing' people with computer interfaces and other electronics implanted directly into them

'Way back in the 1970s a great deal of work was done on conceptualizing Satellite-Mounted Weapons, all of which development was brought to a halt by treaties 'de-militarizing space'. These included high-density metallic rods that could be dropped at super-hypersonic speeds (30 - 80,000 kilometers per hour) to smash targets as small as individual vehicles, satellite-to-ground guided/cruise/hypersonic missiles, Anti-Satellite weapons (notably, Project Burro, or the Anti-Satellite Satellite - read the initials). Also, as far back as the 1970s it was discovered that Satellite surveillance could not only reveal the entire map, but also man-made objects as small as individual (compact) automobiles, even through clouds and at night - and that technology has only gotten better every decade since.

Fusion power is an interesting add.. also I think that electric engines replacing combustion oil engines can be interesting and soon hydrogen engine.

 

[Miserable Old Git]

Looking at techs earlier in the game, how about:

Pumping: A classical tech which allows the building of a new district, the Well, which is like an aqueduct but more expensive and may be two tiles from a fresh water source.
Briquetage: A mediaeval tech which allows a new improvement, the Saltern, on land adjacent to the coast, which increases city growth rate.
Architecture: A mediaeval tech which allows a new civilian, the Architect, who can use charges to speed the construction of districts.
Glassblowing: A renaissance tech which allows builders to create a new improvement on any terrain, the glassworks, which removes any food from the terrain and converts its intrinsic production to amenity.
Antisepsis. A modern tech which allows a new support unit, the Field Hospital, which increases unit healing by 5% per turn.

 

[Zaarin]

Glassblowing: A renaissance tech which allows builders to create a new improvement on any terrain, the glassworks, which removes any food from the terrain and converts its intrinsic production to amenity.

Glassworking goes back to the Neolithic as a byproduct of pottery and metalworking, and glassblowing was developed by the Phoenicians in the ancient period. By the cusp of the Ancient/Classical eras, the Phoenicians were producing clear glass, which was a closely guarded state secret of Tyre and Sidon until someone smuggled it out (as is wont to happen to carefully guarded state secrets).

 

[Miserable Old Git]

Zaarin, I'm sure you're historically correct. But Civ is a game, not perfect history.

People embarked on the open ocean 50,000 years ago - how else was Australia populated? - but in Civ they can't do this until the renaissance.

 

[Zaarin]

People embarked on the open ocean 50,000 years ago - how else was Australia populated? - but in Civ they can't do this until the renaissance.

Drifting in rafts is very different from sailing across deep oceans, which is not something that was happening routinely anywhere in the world until the 16th century. There may have been occasional trips from Polynesia to Pacific South America--but that's the subject for a unique ability (like Kupe's or Kamehameha's).

 

[Boris Gudenuf]

@Miserable Old Git and @Zaarin, you have both brought up an intriguing point: Glass is one Resource/manufactured good, component that as far as I can remember, has never been represented in the Civ franchise in any form.
What makes this more interesting is that, as said, glassmaking was a by-product of the kiln technology that made both Pottery and Metal smelting possible (first glass beads found date to 2500 BCE, contemporary with stoneware Pottery and Bronze-working, by no coincidence), but Glass also includes a wide variety of techniques and uses: glass as a luxury product for household goods, jewelry and decoration, colored glass as a component for Mosaic art (which may date back to Hittite times, but reached its peak under Byzantium), glass blowing, glass casting, and, developing from glassmaking techniques, modern ceramic composites: both the USA and USSR developed steel-glass composite armor for tanks in the early 1960s which led directly to the modern Chobham and other advanced ceramic/plastic/metal composites.

Oh, and RE Australia and 'open ocean': when people first embarked for Australia it was in the middle of the last Ice Age: sea levels were much lower than now, and it is entirely likely that the 'jump' from New Guinea to Australia was much smaller than now and may have been in sight of land all the way.

 

[Henri Christophe]

About future tech, I would like in Civ7 we are able to explore other planets. Don't over the game when first launch our capital to the moon.

 

[Boris Gudenuf]

About future tech, I would like in Civ7 we are able to explore other planets. Don't over the game when first launch our capital to the moon.

We are already exploring other 'planets', namely Mars, Venus, some preliminary exploration of the outer planets and their moons. And we have physically and personally explored a tiny bit of our own Moon.
Beyond exploring, it is quite predictable that we will extablish Human Presence on at least Luna and Mars. Venus may be quite a bit more difficult, the Asteroid Belt much easier - potentially. The in-game point of any of this could be simple Victory Condition, but more realistically would be to exploit some resource or manufacturing possibilities beyond our own planet - and many of the proposed manufacturing can be done in Earth Orbit or LaGrange positions more easily, like Zero-G manufacturing, growing of crystals, producing extremely pure metals and pharmaceuticals and other 'exotic' materials.

But short of a Singularity Event technological advance we are not getting outside of this solar system in the foreseeable future. While there are lots of planets out there circling other suns, unless we have at least near-lightspeed transportation, they are decades or centuries away. I would reserve that for Science Fiction gaming, and stick to 'Future Tech' that is foreseeable within the immediate future - say, by the middle of this century, or within 25 - 35 years.

For comparison, Test of Time, the old Civ-variant game, culminated with cities in orbit and under the ocean, both of which could be considered 'near future' possibilities even more likely than establishing more than a tiny colony on any other planetary body.

 

[Evie]

I think having interstellar travel as the end-point of the game (that is, the game ends when successful interstellar travel is achieved) is just the right balance for it. Because once that does happen, history suddenly expands to a much bigger playing field, and the game can no longer account for everything that might happen.

 

[Boris Gudenuf]

I think having interstellar travel as the end-point of the game (that is, the game ends when successful interstellar travel is achieved) is just the right balance for it. Because once that does happen, history suddenly expands to a much bigger playing field, and the game can no longer account for everything that might happen.

Given that we absolutely cannot predict technological advances and their applications, I can go with that. While there is no currently-applicable technology that will propel us to near-light speeds, there's also no predicting what can happen in the next twenty years (Fun Fact: two of the most advanced 'gee whiz' technologies of the early 1960s were lasers and radar, but no one predicted that they would be two of the most common household appliances of the next twenty years: CD players and microwave ovens. LIkewise, of all the thousands of stories written about the first trip to the moon, no one predicted that the first man to step on the moon would be televised!)
So, attach interstellar journey to Fusion or Nano-Technologies, or maybe even some bio-nano-tech allowing suspended animation generation ships, and take off. Civ VII would be in good company, since extraordinary exertion to go outside the solar system for the first time is almost a cliche in science fiction, and previous Civ games have consistently used the same mechanic for a Science Victory

 

[Henri Christophe]

Civilization 5 and 6 (at least) have the Mega Giagantic Death Robot who is a futuristic unit. I don't see any problem in the game try to extrapolate humans science in order to do future civics more interesting.
The idea of explore the Moon or Mars is very fascinating, and I guess the humankind will do it in this century, so the game should emulate it as well.

 

[Boris Gudenuf]

Civilization 5 and 6 (at least) have the Mega Giagantic Death Robot who is a futuristic unit. I don't see any problem in the game try to extrapolate humans science in order to do future civics more interesting.
The idea of explore the Moon or Mars is very fascinating, and I guess the humankind will do it in this century, so the game should emulate it as well.

To revise my earlier post slightly, I think that settling or establishing colonies on even the easiest Other Planets (moon, Mars, LaGrange sites, asteroids) should be Abstracted: perhaps as a massive Project that allows you to extract new resources from one such destination, but doesn't require you to actually 'play' on another surface/orbital platform, planet or moon. That keeps the game focused on Earth, which is complex enough for most of us, and can save the Interstellar Trip for an end game Victory Condition as the game franchise has done before.

And the Giant Death Robot is not a Futuristic as much as it is a Fantasy unit. All the trends in military technology of the last twenty years are leaning towards smaller, lighter, more mobile, stealthed applications. Making a Dreadnaught on land like the GDR will result in the same fate that befell the dreadnaughts of the Italian fleet in 1940, the US Pacific Fleet in 1941, and the HMS Prince of Wales and INS Yamato: sunk by enemy air power. The early lessons of the Ukraine 'special action' only reinforce this: there are just too many weapons that can take out anything they can find, so watch: for the next decade the major military advances will all be in the area of Not Being Found - stealth for drones, tanks, and infantry as well as ships and aircraft, and even more capabilities to take out enemy heavy weapons like artillery and tanks once identified. The reporters bark about Hypersonic Missiles, but the real Superweapon will be the stealthed Drone, that can search out enemy depots, HQs, tanks and artillery wile remaining immune to enemy weapons, and attack them without warning.

 

[BuchiTaton]

One of my childhood favorite games was Empire Earth (1) and one of the best parts of it was having so many ages (15) included 3 futuristic ones. In CIV6 pre-20th century eras are underrepresented while 20th century-onwards eras are overrepresented. So for me the implementation of more futuristic elements must come with signicative content and general eras balance.

Futuristic eras need their own challenges, units, mechanics, events and crisis. For example Human Transgenics and true Artificial Intelligence should be really polemic issues object of international agreements and social conflict, even the chance to get out of control with some disasters.

 

[Boris Gudenuf]

One of my childhood favorite games was Empire Earth (1) and one of the best parts of it was having so many ages (15) included 3 futuristic ones. In CIV6 pre-20th century eras are underrepresented while 20th century-onwards eras are overrepresented. So for me the implementation of more futuristic elements must come with signicative content and general eras balance.

Futuristic eras need their own challenges, units, mechanics, events and crisis. For example Human Transgenics and true Artificial Intelligence should be really polemic issues object of international agreements and social conflict, even the chance to get out of control with some disasters.

It should be a Standard Rule in the game's design that ALL technological change carries with it social and civic changes, problems, disasters, and requires that adopting the technology also requires meeting the challenges in other areas. Technology has Consequences outside of technology.

 

[Lonecat Nekophrodite]

Among the 'cutting edge' technologies being developed or experimented with now are:
Nano-Technology - to effectively 'grow' products instead of fabricating them.
Genetic Engineering - of both plants and animals as well as bacteria
Artificial Intelligence - including autonomous military and civilian machinery/weapons
Micro-Swarm Drones - microscopic or near-microscopic machines deployed as swarms to accomplish attacks or surveillance: think manufactured beehive that can be given orders.
Fusion Power - which may soon be Present Tech instead of Future Tech
Neuro-Implants - 'Cyborgizing' people with computer interfaces and other electronics implanted directly into them

'Way back in the 1970s a great deal of work was done on conceptualizing Satellite-Mounted Weapons, all of which development was brought to a halt by treaties 'de-militarizing space'. These included high-density metallic rods that could be dropped at super-hypersonic speeds (30 - 80,000 kilometers per hour) to smash targets as small as individual vehicles, satellite-to-ground guided/cruise/hypersonic missiles, Anti-Satellite weapons (notably, Project Burro, or the Anti-Satellite Satellite - read the initials). Also, as far back as the 1970s it was discovered that Satellite surveillance could not only reveal the entire map, but also man-made objects as small as individual (compact) automobiles, even through clouds and at night - and that technology has only gotten better every decade since.

1. And with this. Diplomacy should include tech deterrences as a challenge to Science Victory.
2. America ALMOST have a weapon dubbed 'Space Warships'. some even calld it 'Space Battleship'. (And it is not a reconstruction of superdreadnought wreck with an extraterrestal FTL Engine )

To revise my earlier post slightly, I think that settling or establishing colonies on even the easiest Other Planets (moon, Mars, LaGrange sites, asteroids) should be Abstracted: perhaps as a massive Project that allows you to extract new resources from one such destination, but doesn't require you to actually 'play' on another surface/orbital platform, planet or moon. That keeps the game focused on Earth, which is complex enough for most of us, and can save the Interstellar Trip for an end game Victory Condition as the game franchise has done before.

And the Giant Death Robot is not a Futuristic as much as it is a Fantasy unit. All the trends in military technology of the last twenty years are leaning towards smaller, lighter, more mobile, stealthed applications. Making a Dreadnaught on land like the GDR will result in the same fate that befell the dreadnaughts of the Italian fleet in 1940, the US Pacific Fleet in 1941, and the HMS Prince of Wales and INS Yamato: sunk by enemy air power. The early lessons of the Ukraine 'special action' only reinforce this: there are just too many weapons that can take out anything they can find, so watch: for the next decade the major military advances will all be in the area of Not Being Found - stealth for drones, tanks, and infantry as well as ships and aircraft, and even more capabilities to take out enemy heavy weapons like artillery and tanks once identified. The reporters bark about Hypersonic Missiles, but the real Superweapon will be the stealthed Drone, that can search out enemy depots, HQs, tanks and artillery wile remaining immune to enemy weapons, and attack them without warning.

And then again. GDR is heavily inspired by Mech Warrior, in which in the end, also inspired by Super Dimension Fortress Macross. I'm talking about 'American' style mech walkers like this one

And all of these Big Bots as standard military assets begun with Mobile Suit Gundam in 1979. the setting even cited that the 'Mobile Suit' is the Future weaponry that will made BOTH AFVs and Tactical Jets obsolete. In that settings, an antagonist faction named the Principality of Zeon (A nation of human space colonial seccessionists, there's no Aliens in Gundam franchise AT ALL!) was the first to use Mobile Suits to the great effect against every known weapons The Federation (Earth Big Government) have, including space warships of all kind....

And that caused headaches to the Federation. prompted them to reverse engineer thier 'Mobile Suits' which ultemately led to RX-77 'Gundam' to meet the threats, before that the Federation even tried man portable 'Anti-Mobilesuit Missiles'.
F'xis, as well as some Scifi camp, even bet on Bipedal Mechas (GDR and such) as Future Weapons, at some point even ignored Powered Exoskeletal Bodyarmor (Came from Heinlien's Starship Troopers Novel, this too has a big hit in Japan) as insignificant, while IRL premier military R&D did indeed invested in those, both the US Military (For Army and Marines), and Japanese Self Defense Forces (even applied 'Gundam' as a codename, and many associated weapon systems are named after weapons that appeared in the settings, for example 'Suit-controlled UAVs' are called 'Funnels'. Unless there's sufficient CIWS systems for landbased vehicles or small enough to fit there. GDR will have no place here.
To this end the 'Future Tech' adding up to previous generation weapon systems like MBTs should be 'Tech Upgrades' that would represents differences between two 'different generations of the same type of weapons' like 4th and 5th Generation MBTs and Jets. While Jets may have new successor units entirely. MBTs not so much. even Abrams were continious upgrades of what's entered service in 80s. and to this day not even a single 'proposed replacements' repalced Abrams. Same goes to Burkes and Ticoes at sea. I'm not sure if US Navy DDGX will even have a chance to replace the two beyond that any distinctions between 'Missile Destroyers' and 'Missile Cruisers' became irrelevants already.
To the modding perspective.
1. Modern Armor is 'Atomic Era' unit. and a final unit in 'Heavy Cavalry' lineage... if in case of a mod that has 'Light' and 'Heavy' (horse) cavalry converged in Industrial Era as (Line) Cavalry* it will be Second (and last) unit of Tank class
* Civ6 Cav IS indeed Line Cavalry and this unit has a very distict Napoleonic looks while it could... just like Fusiliers, have more flamboyant 'Enligtenment Era Gentlemen' instead.. same capability, different otufits.
in Civ6 Mod o logy, if Modern Armor represents the likes of M60 Patton and T-55 of 50s-60s, what shall be the name of later generations of MBT like Abrams and Challenger of the 80s-90s? since tanks of two different generations have a very different capabilities that in the First Gulf War. American Abrams did take out Iraqi Tanks without the latter has any chance to return fire.
2. And do you think there should be successor to MBT as assault UGVs?

MBDA and Milrem Robotics unveil world’s first anti-tank UGV

ukdefencejournal.org.uk

And did 'Guided Artillery Shells' joined Russo-Ukraine War of 2022 too? Are these what LAPRAP naval artillery systems developed for Zummwalt tried to do and failed miserably? (LAPRAP objective is to keep Big Guns relevant as artillery particularly in Naval warfare. to be as closely capable as Tomahawl Cruise Missiles but with cheaper shells, it failed).

 

[GeneralZift]

Why do I really want a button that takes you out of the normal game map into like a "space map" where you can view Satellites in orbit and do space combat in the final turns of the game. But like still over a grid, just kinda, zoomed out.

 

[Evie]

Glassworking goes back to the Neolithic as a byproduct of pottery and metalworking, and glassblowing was developed by the Phoenicians in the ancient period. By the cusp of the Ancient/Classical eras, the Phoenicians were producing clear glass, which was a closely guarded state secret of Tyre and Sidon until someone smuggled it out (as is wont to happen to carefully guarded state secrets).

While true, I think there's a case for some sort of glassworking-associated tech in the late classical-medieval-renaissance period - representing the architectural use of glass, from the rise of glass-tile mosaics in Rome and Persia in the early centuries of the first millenia, to the development of the first rough glass windows in Rome, to stained glass windows and relatively modern see-through glass windows.

I'd average the technology to an early medieval tech rather than Renaissance.

 

[Zaarin]

While true, I think there's a case for some sort of glassworking-associated tech in the late classical-medieval-renaissance period - representing the architectural use of glass, from the rise of glass-tile mosaics in Rome and Persia in the early centuries of the first millenia, to the development of the first rough glass windows in Rome, to stained glass windows and relatively modern see-through glass windows.

I'd average the technology to an early medieval tech rather than Renaissance.

That's fair. My first instinct is to fold it into Buttresses (i.e., Gothic architecture).