Get off my land

[daftgeordie]

Can someone explain this please. When another Civ's unit/s come into your territory and you don't want them there, why does the game sometimes give you the option to make them leave or declare war and other times it doesn't. They apologise and say that they'll leave straight away but don't. Is there something I can do to ensure that when I want them off my land they either have to or declare war? It's quite annoying when an enemy worker is blocking a road or something and just won't go away......and of course, I don't want to start the war (not yet anyway). Any advice would be welcome. Thanks.

 

[Shabbaman]

Demanding leave only works for military units, unfortunately.

 

[T-Money]

Ummm....I thought workers were considered military in this game? At least when my workers are in enemy territory they are considered military.

To answer your question, the enemy will leave if you are a lot stronger than they are. If they have reason to attack you, don't demand at all.

 

[Scuffer]

I'm sure I've been able to kick workers of my land before, but they don't always go immediately. Sometime takes a couple of turns (turning irrigation to a mine once, little swine), but you do get the declare war or leave option then.

 

[daftgeordie]

My Civ is a lot stronger militarily than the Persians who are the reason for this thread. Everyone else just has the choice between leaving and war and in fact two of the other Civs who called my bluff don't exist any more. When I speak to the Persians, I never have the option to tell them to leave or declare war. I only get the 'your forces must be withdrawn' bit.......which they nonchalantly agree to but never leave. Why not?

 

[BasketCase]

I'm sure I've been able to kick workers of my land before, but they don't always go immediately. Sometime takes a couple of turns (turning irrigation to a mine once, little swine), but you do get the declare war or leave option then.

Heyyyyy....has anyone here ever tried making a ROP with another civ, sending workers into that civ, and turning all their irrigation into mines....? Good way to sabotage a big city.....

 

[Shabbaman]

That is because they're workers, right? Otherwise, I have no idea.

 

[Old&Slow]

My Civ is a lot stronger militarily than the Persians who are the reason for this thread. Everyone else just has the choice between leaving and war and in fact two of the other Civs who called my bluff don't exist any more. When I speak to the Persians, I never have the option to tell them to leave or declare war. I only get the 'your forces must be withdrawn' bit.......which they nonchalantly agree to but never leave. Why not?

I had the same thing about 8000 times in my last game.

I think if your very strong/strongest in the Game it does not give you the " leave or DOW" option unless there are general wars going on.

If someone has a better reason I`d like to hear it.

 

[wilbill]

I don't think your strength vs. the AI has anything to do with being able to kick his units out. Two factors that do contribute are how close the units are to your cities and whether the units are offensive or not.
I've read posts indicating that experiments show that the AI and human play by the same rules regarding the "leave or declare war" issue.

 

[cnt_dooku]

In my experience you can only expell (declare option) workers AND military units if:
1. They are in the inner citty environment. The land you immediately control when a city gets founded.
2. Outside that ring they can do whatever they please until they stroll into a square that gets worked by citizens when you place them there.

 

[Scuffer]

Heyyyyy....has anyone here ever tried making a ROP with another civ, sending workers into that civ, and turning all their irrigation into mines....? Good way to sabotage a big city.....

This is damned good idea. Going to have a go at it this afternoon.

 

[Tomoyo]

It's kind of exploitive though. I think it has to do with what kind of units they are (land, naval) and it's stats. Then, if it is in there for long enough, you get the boot option.

 

[Scuffer]

Perhaps, but the AI went and did it to me first. Can't remember if it caused starvation, but it would have cost a couple of turns of food prod and worker turns to put it right. On the other hand, the AI is so stupid normally, it was probably due to that rather than an attempt to sabotage. Thinking about it, whenever I have sent workers in to a neighbours to join up roads, they tell me to get out, so it probably wouldn't work anyway.

 

[daftgeordie]

I find it quite comforting to know that there are a lot of other people out there who don't know why this happens either. The Persians are right next door to me. I'm at war with two other Civs who border me too (no contest, even though they declared on me). Other neighbouring Civs who stray into my territory are only given the option to leave or fight....except the Persians! Their workers and settlers with military escort stroll about getting in the way and when I open up a dialogue with the leader the option to leave or fight never appears. Other than that they are not doing me any harm and are not a threat to me militarily (I've got musketmen and knights and he's got warriors and spearmen) but I'm not going to be patient for much longer. Does ANYONE know how it works?

 

[morchuflex]

From my experience, if they keep moving from one tile to another, you can't make the "withdraw or die" demand. For instance, I never could expel foreign ships roaming in my waters.
However, if they are fortified, you can expell them.

And you can't modify another civ's terrain improvments. It's considered an act of war (if you try to, you'll get the message "shall we really declare war on the ***", or stg like that). You can, still, add improvments (like irrigation) but they won't express any gratitude.

 

[SesnOfWthr]

The ai does play by the exact smae rules that you do in regards to kicking units out.

IIRC, the factors involved are combat strength, number of units, and proximity to cities. There is a thread somewhere where someone did an exhaustive analysis of all the factors involved. Of course, I can't locate it now.

I know that in PTW, you can go into another civ's territory under an RoP and change their terrain improvements, we did it in SGOTM2. Won't swear to it for Conquests though.

There is also an exploit known as Scout Resource denial. If you are EXP, you can plant a scout on top of a resource/luxury/whatever, and the civ won't be able to road to it, since your scout is there. The exploit is that the ai will never boot the scout as long as it is the only unit in their territory....

I have never been forced to leave when it was just workers as the offending units, but that doesn't mean it can't happen.

 

[danwhit]

I find it quite comforting to know that there are a lot of other people out there who don't know why this happens either. The Persians are right next door to me. I'm at war with two other Civs who border me too (no contest, even though they declared on me). Other neighbouring Civs who stray into my territory are only given the option to leave or fight....except the Persians! Their workers and settlers with military escort stroll about getting in the way and when I open up a dialogue with the leader the option to leave or fight never appears. Other than that they are not doing me any harm and are not a threat to me militarily (I've got musketmen and knights and he's got warriors and spearmen) but I'm not going to be patient for much longer. Does ANYONE know how it works?

If it isn't giving you the option, I guarantee you had a ROP with them and forgot about it. Even if the units are workers or scouts you will be given the option and can tell the civ to get out. They just won't be forced to until reaching a certain criteria.

 

[morchuflex]

If it isn't giving you the option, I guarantee you had a ROP with them and forgot about it.

This would sound reasonnable, but it's not true, because I have never signed a ROP in all my Civ3 career.

 

[sealman]

If it isn't giving you the option, I guarantee you had a ROP with them and forgot about it. Even if the units are workers or scouts you will be given the option and can tell the civ to get out. They just won't be forced to until reaching a certain criteria.

If he had a ROP treaty with Persia, he would not be able to even ask them to leave.

I think it is because they are workers. Wait until some military units come in and then see what happens.

 

[dgfred]

The ai does play by the exact smae rules that you do in regards to kicking units out.

IIRC, the factors involved are combat strength, number of units, and proximity to cities. There is a thread somewhere where someone did an exhaustive analysis of all the factors involved. Of course, I can't locate it now.

I know that in PTW, you can go into another civ's territory under an RoP and change their terrain improvements, we did it in SGOTM2. Won't swear to it for Conquests though.

There is also an exploit known as Scout Resource denial. If you are EXP, you can plant a scout on top of a resource/luxury/whatever, and the civ won't be able to road to it, since your scout is there. The exploit is that the ai will never boot the scout as long as it is the only unit in their territory....

I have never been forced to leave when it was just workers as the offending units, but that doesn't mean it can't happen.

They will not ask a lone settler to leave either , though I get queasy
leaving them alone .