Giga Colonization Preview Thread (My first Scen)

Alsbron QB

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Feb 22, 2004
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Hello,

I started this thread to tell the Civ2 fans out there that my first Scenario "Giga Colonization" is to be released in about 2 months are sooner. Since it is my first time releasing one I would like to see if some people would volunteer to test it for me. Maybe I started the thread to early or to late but I hope that I can get this scenario released about half good.

The Scenario is a colonization scenario that starts in December 1492. I have changed units, icons, terrain, and alot of other stuff so it looks to provide an original feeling to it. It is set on a GIGA world map so expect a long and large game.

Let me say that after making my first scenario i realize how hard it is and anyone that makes scenarios deserves alot of respect for being brave enough to release there work on the net.

I will try to post updates and if anyone has any thoughts or would like to test it please post.

THANKS

Alsbron QB
 
Even if the scenario isn't complete, post what you have anyway so that people can comment (i.e. units, map, txt files, etc.). Also post any problems.

Would be nice to comment on work (i.e. the guts) BEFORE completion --if only to make new designers' lives easier.

I would be happy to help you out with some Event ideas --I've noticed new designers don't make a lot of use of the macro (it can do wonders for your scenario, particularly one of this nature).

BTW, what Civ2 version are you using? (I'm assuming MGE with the latest patch.)
 
Thanks for offering your help Yoshi. I can hopefully get some stuff posted but I will be honest in saying I am nervous because this scenario is my first and I fear my work will not be liked.

Yoshi, maybe you can PM me and we could talk about the events.txt file. I have thought of events creating a canal for the capture of Suez or Panama but these cities are placed to the point that they are a canal in themselves.

Also I would like to somehow make Jerusalem an important location. This city is very important in history and I want to buff its importance to signify this.

Also, native cities and tribes are very hard for me to place because I am unaware of the geographics of these tribes. If anyone could provide any links It would help.

Thanks for the help everyone!!!
 
The reason why I don’t like using cities as canals has primarily to do with the AI’s inability to see cities as an Ocean square (which they effectively are for ships). If your scenario’s meant for MP mode then this doesn’t apply.

I guess you could just block Suez’s access to the Red Sea (change—using the Cheat menu—the adjacent Red Sea Ocean square to some other terrain like Desert) and have that tile change to Ocean if the British or French take Suez. (Note that this will not deal with the AI problem.)

Example:

@IF
CITYTAKEN
city=Suez
attacker=British
defender=Anybody
@THEN
Text
^The British have captured Suez. Work commences on a canal connecting the Red Sea.
Endtext
CHANGETERRAIN
terraintype=10
maprect
x1, y1, x1, y1, x1, y1, x1, y1 [Note that all 4 coordinates are the same.]
@ENDIF


Speaking of canal creation: a way of making it more interesting is just setting the target tile to a terrain type that can be terraformed (by the Engineer unit), or Irrigated/Mined to Ocean –the AI probably won’t do this but you never know.

Example:

@IF
CITYTAKEN
city=Suez
attacker=British
defender=Anybody
@THEN
Text
^The British have captured Suez. A canal connecting the Red Sea can now be built.
Endtext
CHANGETERRAIN
terraintype=7 [This terrain can be transformed to Ocean.]
maprect
x1, y1, x1, y1, x1, y1, x1, y1
@ENDIF


Rules.txt:

Swamp, 2,3, 1,0,0, no, 0,15, 6, no, 0,15, 0, Oce, ; Swa


Also I would like to somehow make Jerusalem an important location. This city is very important in history and I want to buff its importance to signify this.
In what way? Economically: more trade or gives gold via event. Religiously: wonder(s). Militarily: ‘Sun Tzu’ wonder or produces units every few turns via event. Tactically: place it on a hill (better defence). Free tech via events. Terrain change for the better/worse. Some other civ makes war….
As you can see, there quite few ways to do this (the ones I mentioned are just a few that immediately spring to mind) so you’re going to have to be more specific. :)

Also, native cities and tribes are very hard for me to place because I am unaware of the geographics of these tribes.
That’s a tough one because tribal locations aren’t always recorded on historical maps (because colonizers are too busy building their own cities to care :p ).

BTW, if you want those native tribesmen to keep posing a threat, two words (well, four actually ;) ): TURNINTERVAL and CREATEUNIT. And if you REALLY want to be nasty to the player, just have a new tribesman appear each time you destroy a tribesman! If you want them to stop 're-spawning,' just block their appearance square with an immobile foreign unit or change the terrain to Ocean (latter does not apply to air units). Simple but effective.
 
Sounds like a nice idea! Keep us posted.. :goodjob:
 
Perhaps I can use other scenarios as a guide to locating native tribes. Maybe TRON or Ascendance of Europe.
 
Sounds nice...

What civs are you going to include?
 
Sounds pretty interesting. I'm curious about your timeframe: for instance, the Suez-conquered-by-British event seems XIX century to me, but the scens start in XVI. What duration do you want for your scen? How are you going to simulate the change in technology in these ages?

Sounds interesting. Do you have already a map designed? :D
 
Perhaps I can use other scenarios as a guide to locating native tribes. Maybe TRON or Ascendance of Europe.
Haven't played many colonial scenarios so I can't really judge but some designers put quite a lot of research into their scenarios so yes, that would probably be a good place to start.

About the civs: Initially I was going to mention that you could get one more civ in by making the Barbarian civ 'Native,' but the AI doesn't tend to go after Barbarian cities with as much vigour as it does regular civ cities. So it really depends on what the set up is (i.e. MP or SP, event-driven AI unit placement that ensures AI attacks these cities, etc.).
 
I've been thinking and I don't seem able to find a good scenario about the early colonization of the Species Island and the India. I think that a scen despicting this could fill a gap in our civ's community :)
 
I have tinked with the tech tree very little but some changes have been made. I have renamed alot of techs and added a few.

Question:Starting in the scenario I have 5 Euro powers. The Spanish, French, and British. in the scenario should I use events to boost the three major powers or just leave all five equal. Maybe give Spain, France and Britain some gold on a random basis.
 
Well, at the start of the modern age (1492) Portugal and Spain, for differents reason, were better suited than other countries to make an American/Asian empire. However, the initative moved North as the years passed.

Maybe you should give gold to Spain and Portugual and the beginning, and to other nations as the years go by.

Another thing I'm wondering is how are you going to represent the Dutch people. By 1492 the heir to the throne of Spain was married to the heir of the duqate of Flandes, and the Netherlands didn't become formally independent of Spain until the XVII century.
 
Spanish, French, and British. in the scenario should I use events to boost the three major powers or just leave all five equal.

It depends on who the protagonist (human player) is. I’m assuming you’ve set it up to have the human is able to play either of the three.

Usually you want to make the task of maintaining the empire a little more costly for the human than for the AI, so I would first suggest that you create an events file for each of the three powers (i.e. Britishevents.txt, Frenchevents.txt and Spanishevents.txt –loaded using a batch file to make it more fluid). If you don’t want to make the scenario that complicated, then you’re going to have to be quite creative in order to prevent the human player from overwhelming the AI when playing a certain civ without making the AI too weak when it is controlling that civ.

One way of doing this is to use the Negotiation trigger. By Setting the ‘talkertype=’ and ‘listenertype=’ parameters to ‘computer’ or ‘human’ (the ‘humanorcomputer’value allowing either to communicate) you can prevent certain civs from communicating depending on who they are controlled by.

So if you want to prevent the British from talking to the French when controlled by the human you would do as follows:

@IF
Negotiation
talker=British
talkertype=human
listener=French
listenertype=humanorcomputer
@ENDIF

A more sophisticated application of this trigger is to actually use it in relation to an action. In you case, perhaps if two computer players talk (or rather try to talk), you could trigger certain actions. For example, you could have the French receive gold from the Spanish (however unlikely :rolleyes: ) and vice versa each time they try to talk. This would have the effect of making both richer only when both are controlled by the computer. (Note that the computer may attempt to talk to other civs often so keep the gold number low and don’t use text –so as not to make them too rich and not to annoy the player with continuous text messages.)

Example:

@IF
Negotiation
talker=Spanish
talkertype=computer
listener=French
listenertype=computer
@THEN
Changemoney
receiver=French
amount=2
@ENDIF

@IF
Negotiation
talker=French
talkertype=computer
listener=Spanish
listenertype=computer
@THEN
Changemoney
receiver=Spanish
amount=2
@ENDIF

Of course, you could just set the difficulty level higher and the AI will get production advantages anyway but my way allows you to give advantages to only certain computer-controlled civs rather than all of them.

I realise your question wasn’t really referring to whether the human player were to control either of the civs but rather if and is so how to make the Colonial Powers more powerful. I figured that was just too easy since you can do this in any number of ways by giving them gold as you said or free units and tech or just placing special high-production tiles near their home cities.

In direct response to you your question: I would keep them all similar to start and then gradually carve out their respective roles via events. So, I would give each certain advantages at different times—according to historical strengths—in order to gradually force push each to build a different type of empire. For example, create Settlers via events in areas that have been colonized by certain civs. So, have an immobile Native Tribe unit block the Settler’s coordinates. If the civ has not destroyed the Tribe before a certain turn, the Settler will not appear, thus colonization will take longer. (If you don’t want the Native civ to be at war with the colonial civs from the start, you may have to change this event to meet those requirements –you could always bribe the Native unit.)
At the same time, I would keep all CPs at a similar tech level (i.e. all European civs are at a similar level of technological development but not necessarily equal in infrastructure) –primarily in terms of domestic tech but also generic military techs.

Another thing I'm wondering is how are you going to represent the Dutch people. By 1492 the heir to the throne of Spain was married to the heir of the duqate of Flandes, and the Netherlands didn't become formally independent of Spain until the XVII century.

Unless Alsbron QB has already thought of a way, I would suggest keeping a Dutch Settler unit trapped in some remote region of the map so that the Dutch civ can survive without cities and then create Dutch Rebel units at the appropriate time to rid themselves of the Spanish.
Or, if you don’t want the two civs to declare war you can do the following:

a) design a powerful Barbarian air unit with the ‘Destroyed after attacking’ flag set and give it only one movement so that it will run out of fuel if there is nothing left to attack;
b) create multiple such units next to the Spanish-owned Dutch cities as well as one weak ground unit;
c) once the cities are cleared, the Barbarian ground units will take the cities;
d) this will trigger the creation of Dutch units adjacent to the now Barbarian-owned Dutch cities;
e) the Dutch units will destroy the weak Barbarian defenders and take the city without having to declare war on the Spanish;

(I was experimenting with something like that in a Cold War scenario a while ago to simulate proxy wars without the superpower having to declare war, but I think it could work for the purposes of this scenario as well.)

Well, at the start of the modern age (1492) Portugal and Spain, for differents reason, were better suited than other countries to make an American/Asian empire. However, the initative moved North as the years passed.
If all the CP civs are playable, I would be careful with this because although it follows history, it can also result in the human player exploiting the Spanish/Portuguese’s initial advantage to the point where the scenario would deviate from history too much. With that in mind, I personally would only give the civs a bit of an advantage initially.

BTW Alsbron, how are you going to entice the player to achieve dominion? What are the incentives? Expansion alone just won’t do it IMO; there should be additional challenges other than just unscripted combat, city building, scientific advancement and trade. This is where events really come into it. Frequent uprisings in the colonies, Barbarian piracy, trigger units (resources?)/techs, natural disasters (terrain changes, ships lost to ‘storm’ units), etc. are a good way to get the player thinking about how to keep his empire functional though the use of strategies other than those used in the vanilla game. It’s also a way of preventing players from getting bored.


P.S. Sorry for the long post. :D
 
Let me ask this, When you play a scenario with under seven tribes and go to create unit in the events section of the editor it will give you the option to create units for that tribe although its not in the game. If you were not using the white tribe slot (I am talking about the Dutch) would it be possible to create them units in Holland without cities? When all the units of these Dutch rebels were destroyed then the civ would die.

To create a fun PBEM for five players some historical realism will have to be cast aside. I hope it wont reck the scenario in the eyes of some people though. Colonial games are my favorite to play and I am happy plotting and planning about how to build my empire so that has always been enough for me.

After I posted the tribes to Yaraslov I had an alternative idea. This will cause me to have to start all over but to get the best gameplay I will.

Maybe I could work with barbarians and let them be the natives. Yoshi you will have to give me a tutorial here because I am totally unaware of how to get those cities were I want them.
 
A civ can survive as far as they have at least one settler non-supported by any city.

What is your new idea? :D
 
Originally posted by Alsbron QB
Maybe I could work with barbarians and let them be the natives. Yoshi you will have to give me a tutorial here because I am totally unaware of how to get those cities were I want them. [/B]

Do like this. Start the new scenario, and settle the capital for player 1. The settle all the barbarian cities without changing player. save the file.
Then download CivCity by Mercator and change the owner of those cities to Barbarians. There you go! ;)

url for civcity: http://www.civgaming.net/mercator/mapedit/downloads.htm
 
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