Giga Colonization Preview Thread (My first Scen)

[Alsbron QB]

Thanks Arthedain

I will do that

 

[yoshi]

Let me ask this, When you play a scenario with under seven tribes and go to create unit in the events section of the editor it will give you the option to create units for that tribe although its not in the game. If you were not using the white tribe slot (I am talking about the Dutch) would it be possible to create them units in Holland without cities? When all the units of these Dutch rebels were destroyed then the civ would die.

To tell you the truth, I've never tried creating unit via events for civs that are not in the game. I just assume that the program would not understand the parmater value (e.g. owner=Dutch but Dutch do not exist) and the events would not work --you'd get the error prompt. (I think the Editor just adds the extra civs in by default.)

I'm pretty sure you'd have to do what I said earlier and add the Dutch (the white civ). Haven't really experimented with civs lacking cities much.The starting Settler counts as a 'city' if you will. Once the Settler is destroyed, that's it for that civ --note that once the Dutch have at least 1 city and lose it, even non-supported Settlers may be lost and the civ destroyed. You'll have to experiment. (If I remember, I'll run a quick test and see what can be done.)

To create a fun PBEM for five players some historical realism will have to be cast aside.

It's up to you but I personally think think of multiplayer/PBEM as an excuse not to have the scneario too simple in order to accomodate the AI's stupidity (i.e. human players can figure out how to use features that the AI is not programmed to use so you are free to add all the cool stuff you want) --not to mention that it speeds up play testing. It also means that you can incorporate 'house rules' that only the human player will respect.

Maybe I could work with barbarians and let them be the natives. Yoshi you will have to give me a tutorial here because I am totally unaware of how to get those cities were I want them.

Arthedain pretty much covered it using CivCity is easier than using the place-a-barbarian-next-to-each-city-and-wait-a-turn method.
As I said before, I've found that the AI civs will only tend to attack Barbarian cities if they are adjacent or they have air units within range (note that those results were using a game version predating MGE --the latter having more aggressive AI).
The other thing is that the Barbarian AI doesn't tend to garrison to many units (it will use defensive units as offensive units), so this will require you to give the Barbarian civ units specifically designed to the task (e.g. immobile defensive units).
Since the Barbarian civ lacks tech (the Barbarian civ is always at war with everyone so you will have to use events to simulate uprisings if you only want them to attack at specific times).
Where Barbarian tech is concerned, there a is a utility program somewhere that can alter Barbarian techs but I can't remember what it is --check CFC Civ2 downloads.
Note that Barbarian city type is 'Classical' by default, so keep that in mind if you're going to give another civ the same city type (i.e. white civ).

 

[Alsbron QB]

I am just now starting on the tech tree. It seems to be the HARDEST part. If anyone could give me a link to naval history of that time period it would help.

Also what was happening in culture and science in that time period because these two areas are just as important as military and naval advancement.

 

[DvR]

Oh come on, make the colour for the Dutch orange

Looking forward to play/test when you're done!

 

[Alsbron QB]

Thanks DvR,

Orange it will be!!!

 

[yoshi]

As you seem to be implying, yes, the advancement of naval technology was key to success. Don't know of any links but is there anything you wanted to know specifically (I have some physical sources I can refer to).

 

[Alsbron QB]

Mostly history of the Frigate and mayybe some other ships that were used in that time period.

 

[yoshi]

I'll see what I can find. Shouldn't be too hard.

Do want to know which ships were used during the colonial period? If so than may I suggest referring to Patient English's excellent 'Colonies IV' scenario. In fact, I would suggest using that as a main reference. A lot of work went into that scenario but I would have liked to see more use events (wink).


I just wanted to add that you can use batch files to upgrade units over time rather than using new unit slots. It's usually used for weather change (i.e. changing units, terrain etc. to fit the new season) but in an expanded timeline, it can also help to give you room for the many units that such an expansive scenario will probably need.

Edit the batch (.BAT) file to copy the new files and rename them to the names of the old files which it will overrite. The new files contain the upgraded unit info (that includes Units.gif, Rules.txt and usually Events.txt just for the new unit names).

Example:

Old files = Units.gif, Rules.txt, Events.txt

New files = Units1.gif, Rules1.txt, Events1.txt

Batch file = Upgrade1.bat


Text event tells the player to save the game load new batch file.

Player goes into the scenario's folder and double clicks on the batch file.

Batch file copies a version of each of the old files into the same folder that the old files are in and renames then the same as the old files (old files are overwritten).

Player switches back to the Civ2 game window and reloads the saved game.

The game loads with the new units (i.e. units have been upgraded).


So, if you wanted to upgrade a XVII c. Frigate to a XVIII c. Frigate you would just replace the unit using the technique outlined above without having to use a whole other slot.

This usually only is used for the same unit (i.e. a better version of the same unit). For instance, you wouldn't replace a tank with an airplane but rather a tank with a tank and usually a tank with the same tank only with slightly better stats implying the upgrade (e.g. T-34/76 to T-34-86).

In order to make it easy on the player it is usually better ot make all the changes in bulks (i.e. upgrade everything at the same time --if you're using weather change, take advantage and upgrade the units too). This may not follow history exactly but then again this is a game.

 

[yoshi]

OR you could use Mercator's CivSwap. A program that essentially runs other programs (loads batch files in this case). That means that the player doesn't have to do all that work--not so for the designer though...but you can always get someone who is familiar with file swapping to to this for you.CivSwap can be found here.

 

[Alsbron QB]

GOOD TO BE BACK

My internet was down forever but now I am back and would like to update everyone on how the scenario is coming.

I said earlier that I used another tech tree and since then I have made my own for the scenario. It is my first tech tree so it may not be the absolute best you have ever seen but it gets the job done.

I am working on the units now and after that I will place everything like cities, roads ect. and then begin work on the events.txt file and maybe work on some extra stuff to make the scenario better.

Once again it is good to be back and I would like to apologize for not updating. I am hoping to have the first playtesting starting maybe in less than a month and I will release the scenario when I feel it is ready. Before I release it however I would like to organize a test PBEM that I will not play in. If you would like to help me out in this then please PM me because I dont want to get the thread OT with PBEM talk.

Best Regards

 

[yoshi]

I was too lazy to go through the physical material I have so I'll post some links that I found instead:


http://www.historyguide.org/earlymod/lecture2c.html

http://www.abc.net.au/navigators/ships/historyeuro.htm

List of Ship Types:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sailing_ship

History/Index:
http://www.geocities.com/Area51/Shire/6423/Ships/index2.html

British Sailing Ships:
http://www.cronab.demon.co.uk/INTRO.HTM

Steamships:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Steamship

Steamships Chronology:
http://www.saburchill.com/history/events/024.html

Colonial European History:
http://europeanhistory.about.com/cs/colonimperialism/

 

[yoshi]

Here's another link for colonial maps:

http://scarlett.libs.uga.edu/darchive/hargrett/maps/colamer.html

 

[Alsbron QB]

THANKS YOSHI

You have done so much for this scenario and I am greatly aware of that.

Would you be interested in perhaps playtesting it when it is ready?

 

[yoshi]

My pleasure.

FYI: I will be away for June/July. Hopefully I will have a little time when I get back.

 

[Alsbron QB]

ESTIMATED TIME TILL FINISH IS 2 WEEKS

All right I have redone the tribes so there are the Russians and Other Europeans aswell as the five colonial powers. The Other Europeans will NOT be playable.

The following news may be a let down to some but I wanted to say it anyway. I have removed the tech tree from my scenario so there is no research in the scenario. I dont feel like this takes away from the scenario that much because I have made the scenario to be fun to play. I hope it will be judged on its gameplay because even without research it will still be enjoyable.

I will ask again that anyone that is interested in a play-test please PM me because I need all the help I can get to make sure the scenario is fun to anyone besides myself.

THANKS

Alsbron Quarterback

 

[yoshi]

About techs:
I assume you're just giving the techs via the GiveTechnology event action. I've thought of doing that in the past, where you automate the change in tech rather than leave it up to the civs in order to keep the pace of the game in sync with history.
The main reasons why people use researchable techs (i.e. tech tree) is just to give the human player something more to do and to add a random factor to how a civ develops. The other reason for using research is that it can trigger events via the RecievedTechnology event trigger.

I don't blame you for not opting to include a tech tree--it's quite possibly the hardest (or at least most tedious) thing to do next to getting the AI to do what you want it to do. Time is better spent making the scenario more interesting in other ways as you you are doing if tech isn't absolutely necessary IMO.

It also makes sense since most tech during the colonial era (and most other eras for that matter) was usually not conciously pursued by Europen states. What you could do though, is use GiveTechnology action with RandomTurn as the trigger so that you get civs gaining tech according to chance--this does not require a tech tree as long as the techs are non-sequential (i.e. one is not a prerequisite--historically speaking--of the another).


Release in 2 weeks:
I'll be gone by the time you get this thing finished so I won't be able to test it--will be too busy before I leave. But if you want to ask me any last minute questions now would be the time to do it. If not, I'm glad to have been of help and happy civing!

 

[Arthedain]

This scenario sounds interesting, and I would've helped you if I weren't so busy with my own scenario..

Though I haven't post anything about it here.. Maybe I should..?

 

[Alsbron QB]

Arthedain,

Please let us know about your scenario.

I have not been working on the scenario in a while(yes I do have a life other than playing games and talking on forums)so I will try to get back to it as soon as i can

 

[Orestes Lokhart]

Hey Alsbron this is adam we can talk in the civ II general discussin thread By the way how is your scenario going pm me when you read this

moderater please don't delete this

 

[Alsbron QB]

I have not had a chance to work on the scenario in a long time but i hope I can get back started soon.

DvR is the only tester I have so far.

Is anyone even interested in this scenario?