Goal Of Zionism

[superisis]

it is saying that a nation doesnt deserve to be a, well, nation! its like saying the Irish don't deserve Ireland, the Magyars don't deserve Hungary, the Koreans dont deserve Korea, etc. etc

the palestinians don't deserve a whoa, ehh... wait a sec.

I just got back from Europe and in the three hours I spent in Paris alone, I spottted five swastikas.

Bet you ten bucks that for every swastika you saw, there were 5 hammers and sickles. Sure, nationalism, rascism and nazism is on the rise (and we do what we can to fight it) but it is still small. The rightwing extremists are fewer than the left wing extremists. (meaning it is more dangerous for you to be a nazi than a jew in these places ) Every nazi rally in Sweden is followed by an anti-nazi rally about 3-4 times larger.

I mentioned operations Moses, Joshua, and Solomon, where Israel saw Jews in Ethiopia dieing and immediately took up the cause in saving the Jews. At first, in fact, Israel only wanted to improve living conditions for Jews in Ethiopia, rather than moving them. If, as you claim, Israel is cruel and antagonistic towards diaspora Jews, then why does practically every jew in the world support Israel?

I have read that ethiopian jews in Israel are treated even worse that Arabs living in Israel.

For example, they organize as religious cults, most predominantly along the Christian Identity model, which asserts that: (1) white people are the original Lost Tribes of Israel; (2) Jews are descendants of Satan; and (3) African Americans and other people of color are pre-Adamic, or beasts created by God before He created Adam, the first white man. Christian Identity followers feel they can attack and murder Jews and people of color without contradicting their religious convictions because they have been told by their leaders that people of color and Jews have no souls.

What's scarier are those "mainstream" politicians that truely believe that Israel must exist. Not because it's the right thing for the jews, but because according to the bible Israel must exist before judgement day can happen. Thus they support Israel, but the fail to say that they believe that when judgement day occurs, jew get a chance to convert to Christianity or they'll be slaughtered OT style.

 

[frekk]

For example, 51 percent of the respondents who identified themselves as conservatives said they think African Americans are "aggressive and violent." For those who identified themselves as liberals, 45 percent felt that Blacks had those attributes. Furthermore, Blacks are "irresponsible" according to 21 percent of the conservatives and 17 percent of the liberals studied.

Which has absolutely zero to do with any sort of white supremacist neo-Nazi movement. Very very often, the exact same people with bad attitudes about the blacks - are also the base of support for Israel in America. This sentiment has much more to do with the Cops television show than it has to do with William Pierce or any of that sort.

Some 150,000 to 200,000 people subscribe to racist publications, attend their marches and rallies, and donate money. Approximately 100 hate-lines are in operation, with recorded messages that propagandize the caller with hate-motivated speeches and publicize upcoming meetings and rallies. Because of their increasingly sophisticated use of the media and electronic technology, there are 150 independent racist radio and television shows that air weekly and reach millions of sympathizers.

We are all aware exactly how broad the definitions for "racist" are when it comes to fearmongering about white supremacism, when groups like the ADL are doing the counting. ADL has classified groups like Greenpeace, the United Farm Workers Union, Artists Against Apartheid, ACT UP, Action for Animals, the Asian Law Caucus of San Francisco and the American Indian Movement as "anti-Semitic organizations". Given that, it's surprising they didn't tally tens of millions of Nazis in America, but I suppose nobody would believe that. 200k is a good number to pull out of a hat.

Even if that number were anywhere close to being accurate, its still incredibly minor in a nation of 300 million people. I mean, lets face it, a *single* publication with a circulation of only 200k is probably a local newspaper; an entire *class* of publications with a circulation of 200k, nationally and internationally, is, well, nothing at all.

The Creativity Movement has several thousand members in the U.S.

In 1971, Shenton died and Charles K. Johnson became the new president of the Flat Earth Society. Under his leadership, over the next three decades, the group grew in size from a few members to about 3,000.

Bit from http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Flat_Earth_Society

Now, take all the above and compare to Hamas and the Al-Aqsa Martyrs Brigade and all the rest of them in Israel, and tell me again, that it is safer to be Jewish in Israel than in America ...

 

[Warman17]

There was a huge spike of racism in the 1920's in the US. It died. The new "wave" of racism with 50-200,000 people in the US is no where being equivalent to 25 million people being in the KKK in the 1920s

 

[strategycat]

The Jewish Religion: It's Influence Today, by Elizabeth Dilling, is a free online book available here:
http://www.come-and-hear.com/index-2.html
Find out what the Jewish "holy" book, the Talmud, really says about non-Jews.

The Controversy of Zion, by Douglas Reed, is another excellent free online book and can be read here:
http://ollboks.dk.telia.net/~u143201588/index.html

The Incredible Shrinking Holocaust (scroll down to the bottom of the page for a revealing graphic):
http://www.thebirdman.org/Index/Jews/Jews-HoloRev.html
The rest of that website is very good too:
http://www.thebirdman.org/

Jewish Revisionist Tours Auschwitz & Uncovers The Truth:
http://www.rense.com/general62/uncov.htm

If American's Knew; what every American needs to know about Israel/Palestine:
http://www.ifamericansknew.org/about_us/index.html

Jewish Tribal Review; A compilation of links to online articles largely from mainstream media sources about Jewish and Zionist influence in popular culture, Jewish ethnocentrism, Jewish power, Jewish wealth, American Judeocentrism and Jewish political lobbying:
http://www.jewishtribalreview.org/

The hidden Jewish food tax - you're paying it!:
http://www.ukar.org/tax.html
The rest of the website is also excellent:
http://www.ukar.org/index.html

Washington Report on Middle East Affairs:
http://www.wrmea.com/index.htm

Did Einstein plagiarize E=mc^2?:
http://einstein52.tripod.com/alberteinsteinprophetorplagiarist/
and:
http://www.msu.edu/~mccaske1/writing/eresp.htm
and:
http://www.italian-american.com/depretreview.htm

Finally, here is what some famous people have had to say about the Jews. This is by no means a complete list, not even close:

Peter Stuyvesant, Dutch Governor of New York

"The Jews who have arrived would nearly all like to remain here, but learning that they were very repugnant to the inferior magistrates, as also to the people having the most affection for you; the Deaconry also fearing that owing to their present indigence they might become a charge in the coming winter, we have, for the benefit of this weak newly developing place and land in general, deemed it useful to require them in a friendly way to depart; praying also most seriously in this connection, for ourselves also for the general community of your worships, that the deceitful race - such hateful enemies and blasphemers of the name of Christ - not be allowed further to infect and trouble this new colony."


George Washington, American President

"They work more effectively against us, than the enemy's armies. They are a hundred times more dangerous to our liberties and the great cause we are engaged in... It is much to be lamented that each state, long ago, has not hunted them down as pest to society and the greatest enemies we have to the happiness of America."


Thomas Jefferson, American President

"Dispersed as the Jews are, they still form one nation, foreign to the land they live in."

"Those who labor in the earth are the Chosen People of God, if ever he had a chosen people."


Albert Einstein, Jewish-American "Scientist" (Plagiarist?)

"Anti-Semitism is nothing but the antagonistic attitude produced in the non-Jew by the Jewish group. The Jewish group has thrived on oppression and on the antagonism it has forever met in the world...the root cause is their use of enemies they create in order to keep solidarity..." (quoted in Collier's Magazine, November 26, 1938)


Mark Twain, American Writer

"In the U.S. cotton states, after the war... the Jew came down in force, set up shop on the plantation, supplied all the Negroes' wants on credit, and at the end of the season was the proprietor of the Negro's share of the present crop and part of the next one. Before long, the whites detested the Jew.
The Jew is being legislated out of Russia. The reason is not concealed. The movement was instituted because the Christian peasant stood no chance against his commercial abilities. The Jew was always ready to lend on a crop. When settlement day came, he owned the crop; the next year he owned the farm - like Joseph.
In the England of John's time everybody got into debt to the Jew. He gathered all lucrative enterprises into his hands. He was the King of Commerce. He had to be banished from the realm. For like reasons, Spain had to banish him 400 years ago, and Austria a couple of centuries later.
In all ages Christian Europe has been obliged to curtail his activities. If he entered upon a trade, the Christian had to retire from it. If he set up as a doctor, he took the business. If he exploited agriculture, the other farmers had to get at something else. The law had to step in to save the Christian from the poor-house. Still, almost bereft of employments, he found ways to make money. Even to get rich. This history has a most sordid and practical commercial look. Religious prejudices may account for one part of it, bit not for the other nine.
Protestants have persecuted Catholics - but they did not take their livelihoods away from them. Catholics have persecuted Protestants - bit they never closed agriculture and the handicrafts against them. I feel convinced that the Crucifixion has not much to do with the world's attitude toward the Jew; that the reasons for it are much older than that event ...
I am convinced that the persecution of the Jew is not in any large degree due to religious prejudice. No, the Jew is a money-getter. He made it the end and aim of his life. He was at it in Rome. He has been at it ever since. His success has made the whole human race his enemy.
You will say that the Jew is everywhere numerically feeble. When I read in the Cyclopedia Britannica that the Jewish population in the United States was 250,000 I wrote the editor and explained to him that I was personally acquainted with more Jews than that, and that his figures were without doubt a misprint for 25,000,000. People told me that they had reasons to suspect that for business reasons, many Jews did not report themselves as Jews. It looks plausible. I am strongly of the opinion that we have an immense Jewish population in America. I am assured by men competent to speak that the Jews are exceedingly active in politics."


Theodore Dreiser, American Writer

"Liberalism, in the case of the Jew, means internationalism. If you listen to Jews discuss Jews, you will find they are one-minded, very sharp in practice. The Jews lack the fine integrity which at last is endorsed, and to a certain degree followed, by lawyers of other nationalities.
The Jew has been in Germany for a thousand years, and he is still a Jew. He has been in America for all of 200 years, and he has not faded into a pure American by any means - and he will not."


H. G. Wells, British Writer

"The Jews looked for a special savior, a messiah, who was to redeem mankind by the agreeable process of restoring the fabulous glories of David and Solomon, and bringing the whole world at last under the firm but benevolent Jewish heel."

"Zionism is an expression of Jewish refusal to assimilate. If the Jews have suffered, it is because they have regarded themselves as a chosen people."

"A careful study of anti-Semitism prejudice and accusations might be of great value to many Jews, who do not adequately realize the irritations they inflict."


Voltaire, French Philosopher

"Why are the Jews hated? It is the inevitable result of their laws; they either have to conquer everybody or be hated by the whole human race..."

"The Jewish nation dares to display an irreconcilable hatred toward all nations, and revolts against all masters; always superstitious, always greedy for the well-being enjoyed by others, always barbarous - cringing in misfortune and insolent in prosperity."

"You seem to me to be the maddest of the lot. The Kaffirs, the Hottentots, and the Negroes of Guinea are much more reasonable and more honest people than your ancestors, the Jews. You have surpassed all nations in impertinent fables in bad conduct and in barbarism. You deserve to be punished, for this is your destiny."

"You will only find in the Jews an ignorant and barbarous people, who for a long time have joined the most sordid avarice to the most detestable superstition and to the most invincible hatred of all peoples which tolerate and enrich them."

"I know that there are some Jews in the English colonies. These marranos go wherever there is money to be made... But whether these circumcised who sell old clothes claim that they are of the tribe of Naphtali or Issachar is not of the slightest importance. They are, simply, the biggest scoundrels who have ever dirtied the face of the earth."

"They are, all of them, born with raging fanaticism in their hearts, just as the Bretons and the Germans are born with blond hair. I would not be in the least bit surprised if these people would not some day become deadly to the human race."


Martin Luther, German Religious Reformer

"But the Jews are so hardened that they listen to nothing; though overcome by testimonies they yield not an inch. It is a pernicious race, oppressing all men by their usury and rapine. If they give a prince or magistrate a thousand florins, they extort twenty thousand from the subjects in payment. We must ever keep on guard against them."

"Besides, you also have many Jews living in the country, who do much harm... You should know the Jews blaspheme and violate the name of our Savior day for day... for that reason you, Milords and men of authority, should not tolerate but expel them. They are our public enemies and incessantly blaspheme our Lord Jesus Christ, they call our Blessed Virgin Mary a harlot and her Holy Son a bastard and to us they give the epithet of changelings and abortions.
Therefore deal with them harshly as they do nothing but excruciatingly blaspheme our Lord Jesus Christ, trying to rob us of our lives, our health, our honor and belongings."


Franz Liszt, Hungarian Composer

"The day will come when all nations amidst which the Jews are dwelling will have to raise the question of their wholesale expulsion, a question which will be one of life or death, good health or chronic disease, peaceful existence or perpetual social fever."


Cicero, Roman Statesman

"Softly! Softly! I want none but the judges to hear me. The Jews have already gotten me into a fine mess, as they have many other gentleman. I have no desire to furnish further grist for their mills."

"The Jews belong to a dark and repulsive force. One knows how numerous this clique is, how they stick together and what power they exercise through their unions. They are a nation of rascals and deceivers."


John Quincy Adams, American President

"Jews are all wretched creatures, for I think I never saw in my life such a set of miserable looking people. And they would steal your eyes out of your head if they could."


Helmuth von Moltke, Prussian General

"The Jews form a state and, obeying their own laws, they evade those of their host country.
The Jews always consider an oath regarding a Christian not binding. During the Campaign of 1812 the Jews were spies, they were paid by both sides, they betrayed both sides."


Ulysses S. Grant, American General (later President)

"I have long since believed that in spite of all the vigilance that can be infused into Post Commanders, the special regulations of the Treasury Department have been violated, and that mostly by Jews and other unprincipled traders. So well satisfied have I been of this that I instructed the commanding officers at Columbus to refuse all permits to Jews to come South, and I have frequently had them expelled from the department, but they come in with their carpet-sacks in spite of all that can be done to prevent it. The Jews seem to be a privileged class that can travel anywhere. They will land at any woodyard on the river and make their way through the country. If not permitted to buy cotton themselves, they will act as agents for someone else, who will be at military post with a Treasury permit to receive cotton and pay for it in Treasury notes which the Jew will buy up at an agreed rate, paying gold.
1. The Jews, as a class, violating every regulation of trade established by the Treasury Department, and also Department orders, are hereby expelled from the Department.
2. Within twenty-four hours from the receipt of this order by Post Commanders, they will see that all of this class of people are furnished with passes and required to leave, and anyone returning after such notification, will be arrested and held in confinement until an opportunity occurs of sending them out as prisoners, unless furnished with permits from these headquarters.
3. No permits will be given these people to visit headquarters for the purpose of making personal application for trade permits.
By order of Major Gen. Grant Jno. A. Rawlings, Assistant Adjutant General


William T. Sherman, American General

"I found so many Jews and speculators here trading in cotton, and secessionists had become so open in refusing anything but gold, that I have felt myself bound to stop it. The gold can have but one use - the purchase of arms and ammunition... Of course, I have respected all permits by yourself or the Secretary of the Treasury, but in these new cases, I have stopped it."


Napoleon Bonaparte, French Statesman and General

"The Jews provided troops for my campaign in Poland, but they ought to reimburse me: I soon found that they are no good for anything but selling old clothes..."

"Legislation must be put in effect everywhere, that the general well-being is in danger. The government cannot look with indifference on the way a despicable nation takes possession of all the provinces of France. The Jews are the master robbers of the modern age; they are the carrion birds of humanity..."

"They must be treated with political justice, not with civil justice. They are surely not real citizens."

"The Jews have practiced usury since the time of Moses, and oppressed the other peoples. Meanwhile, the Christians were only rarely usurers, falling into disgrace when they did so. We ought to ban the Jews from commerce because they abuse it... The evils of the Jews do not stem from individuals but from the fundamental nature of this people."

To his brother, Jerome Bonaparte, King of Westphalia, "Nothing more contemptible could be done than the reception of the Jews by you. I decided to improve the Jews, but I do not want more of them in my kingdom. Indeed, I have done all to prove my scorn of the most vile nation in the world."


Charles DeGaulle, French Statesman

"The Jews remain what they have been at all times: an elite people, self-confident and domineering."


Goldwin Smith, Jewish-British Historian

"The Jew alone regards his race as superior to humanity, and looks forward not to its ultimate union with other races, but to its triumph over them all and to its final ascendancy under the leadership of a tribal Messiah."


Harry S. Truman, American President

"The Jews, I find, are very, very selfish. They care not how many Estonians, Latvians, Finns, Poles, Yugoslavs or Greeks get murdered or mistreated as Displaced Persons as long as the Jews get special treatment. Yet when they have power, physical, financial or political neither Hitler nor Stalin has anything on them for cruelty or mistreatment to the underdog."


Henry Wallace, American Politician

"Truman was 'exasperated' over Jewish pressure that he support Zionist rule over Palestine. . . . Pres. Truman expressed himself as being very much 'put out' with the Jews. He said that 'Jesus Christ couldn't please them when he was on earth, so how could anyone expect that I would have any luck?' Pres. Truman said he had no use for them and didn't care what happened to them."


Richard Nixon, American President

"There may be some truth in that if the Arabs have some complaints about my policy towards Israel, they have to realize that the Jews in the U.S. control the entire information and propaganda machine, the large newspapers, the motion pictures, radio and television, and the big companies. And there is a force that we have to take into consideration."


George S. Brown, American General

At Duke University in 1974, when asked: "How can we stop Israel from obtaining from the Congress more foreign aid than any other nation in the world?"
He answered: "When they get tough-minded enough to set down the Jewish influence in this country and break that lobby. It is so strong, you wouldn't believe it. Now, we have the Israelis coming to us for equipment. We say we can't probably get the Congress to support a program like this. And they say, 'Don't worry about the Congress. We will take care of the Congress.'
This is somebody from another country. But they can do it. They own -- you know -- the banks in this country, the newspapers. Just look at where the Jewish money is."


Mohammed

"Whoever is a friend of a Jew, belong to them, becomes one of them, God cannot tolerate this mean people. The Jews have wandered from divine religion. You must not relent in your work which must show up Jewish deceit."


Jesus Christ

"Ye are of your father the devil, and the lust of your father ye will do. He was a murderer from the beginning, and abode not in the truth, because there is not truth in him. When he speaketh a lie, he speaketh of his own, for he is a liar and the father of it." - then answered the Jews

 

[Warman17]

A lot of people are anti-semetic, anti-semetism was wide spread pre-WW2. Nearly everyone has been anti-semetic throughout history.

Your point sir? Are you trying to say anti-semitism is justified because all these 'great' people found it to be acceptable to them?

 

[Thorgalaeg]

Why did you write ´great´ between qoutation marks? Arent these well known nazi antisemites (like Einstein for instance) great anymore?

OTOH i find that "Anti-semitic" (used incorrectly since semitics are the arabs too, so as antisemitic is who hates the arabs as who hates the jews) has become a very useful talisman word to combat any sort of criticism toward the jews. I mean, what is YOUR point? We could strongly disagree with some quotes above but maybe it would be more interesting to discuss it, instead of limiting ourselves to the very famous "anti-semitic" epithet.

 

[Warman17]

Wow I’ve been writing for an hour to dispute you but then my f’ing computer crashed. Lets try and do this again shall we.

Okay...Great is a subjective word that differs from person to person. I put great in quotation marks because what one may think is great, another may not. Peter Stuyvesant was just a governor like Pataki, nothing great there. I’ve never heard of Theodore Dreiser, Franz Liszt, Goldwin Smith, Henry Wallace, or George S. Brown. They just must be too great for my comprehension then is that right?

Next anti-Semitic has fully become synonymous with Jews. Just as if one went up to a man on the street and asked what a Caucasian is, they’d respond “white,” pertaining to Europeans. However Indians(from India) are just as much Caucasian as their lighter skinned brothers in Europe.



Firstly let me start out by saying that quote by George Washington is nothing but a lie. It was created by Egypt's General Hassan Sweilem who tries and justify anti-Semitism in articles in the weekly October. He goes on to say the holocaust is nothing ut a lie, quotes George Washington as saying exactly as you put down and also quotes

"American President Benjamin Franklin said in his speech to the 1789 Constitutional Convention in Philadelphia: 'A great danger threatens the United States -- the Jewish danger, When the Jews settle down, we will discover that they are weakening the determination of the people, shaking up the ethics of trade and establishing a government. When they meet resistance, they will suffocate the nation economically."

Franklin was never president, nor did he ever say this. Hassan Sweilem orcostrated many lies, and it appears you fell for one.


Next lets move onto Einstein. It seems rather odd for him to say what you said as well as

"In so far as a particular community is attacked as such," he said, "it is bound to defend itself as such, so that its individual members may be able to maintain their material and spiritual interests... In present circumstances the rebuilding of Palestine is the only object that has a sufficiently strong appeal to stimulate the Jews to effective corporate action."

“In this case, as in many mental disorders, the cure lies in a clear knowledge of one's condition and its causes. We must be conscious of our alien race and draw the logical conclusions from it. It is no use trying to convince the others of our spiritual and intellectual equality by arguments addressed to the reason, when the attitude of these others does not originate in their intellects at all.”

“It is clear also that "serving God" was equated with "serving the living". The best of the Jewish people, especially the Prophets and Jesus, contended tirelessly for this. Judaism is thus no transcendental religion; it is concerned with life as we live it and as we can, to a certain extent, grasp it, and nothing else. It seems to me, therefore, doubtful whether it can be called a religion in the accepted sense of the word, particularly as no "faith" but the sanctification of life in a supra-personal sense is demanded of the Jew. But the Jewish tradition also contains something else, something which finds splendid expression in many of the Psalms, namely, a sort of intoxicated joy and amazement at the beauty and grandeur of this world, of which man can form just a faint notion. This joy is the feeling from which true scientific research draws its spiritual sustenance, but which also seems to find expression in the song of birds. To tack this feeling to the idea of God seems mere childish absurdity.“

Mark Twain is known for trying to help the Jews by turning people away from negative stereotypes. Those such as Jews eating babies, killing Christians, being swindlers, liars, cheapskates etc. In it’s stead he put in ‘positive’ stereotypes such as intelligence and money-management. These new stereotypes have hurt Jews all the same.


H.G. Wells in his book ‘The Shape of things to Come’ written in 1933 he describes that in chapter 44 -

“And yet between 1940 and 2059, in little more than a century, this antiquated obdurate culture disappeared. It and its Zionist state, its kosher food, the Law and all the rest of its paraphernalia, were completely merged in the human community. The Jews were not suppressed; there was no extermination; there were world-wide pogroms during the political and social breakdown of the Famished Fifties, but under the Tyranny there was never any specific persecution at all;"

how wrong he was. He also describes in chapter 22 that a Polish Jew will be the cause of world war two, or what he calls “The Last War Cyclone” by disrespecting a Nazi. Once again he is incorrect. H.G. Wells beliefs on Jewry seem to be based on nothing more than conjecture.


If Napoleon Bonaparte though of the Jews in such an ill manner why did he
a) create the Sanhedrin?
b) abolish laws that kept ghettos in place across Europe?
c) make Judaism one of the official religions of France?
d) want to create a Jewish state in Palestine ?

He is quoted of saying in 1816

“My primary desire was to liberate the Jews and make them full citizens. I wanted to confer upon them aIl the legal rights of equality, liberty and fraternity as was enjoyed by the Catholics and Protestants. It is my wish that the Jews be treated like brothers as if we were aIl part of Judaism. As an added benefit, I thought that this would bring to France many riches because the Jews are numerous and they would come in large numbers to our country where they would enjoy more privileges than in any other nation. Without the events of 1814, most of the Jews of Europe would have come to France where equality, fraternity and liberty awaited them and where they can serve the country like everyone else.”

Mohammad was known to have taught tolerance towards the Jews. The Koran speaks of Jews as one of the protected peoples under Allah. Along with that he created the Charter of Medina which guaranteed rights to Jews.

Jesus was known to teach love, understanding, and tolerance not hatred. Isn’t it a little contradictory for him to say something against the Jews, of which he was one.

Moving on from your some of your people lets go to some of mine.

Abraham Lincoln was quoted on saying the following phrases towards Know Nothing legislators after they spoke against Jews, Catholics, and Blacks.

“stupid, classic anti-Semite.”

“Rather than live under the hypocrisy of American bigotry, I would prefer to live under open tyranny in a country such as Czarist Russia!”

He was also quoted as responding to then General Grant as such after grant barred Jewish merchants from selling goods to Union soldiers.

“To condemn a class (of people) is to condemn the good with the bad. I do not like to hear an entire class or nationality condemned on account of a few sinners.”

George Orwell, the author who wrote 1984, wrote an entire essay about Anti-Semitism in Britain in February 1945. It can be found here http://www.netcharles.com/orwell/essays/antisemitism.htm

Here’s a quote form it

“And naturally the anti-Semite thinks of himself as a reasonable being. Whenever I have touched on this subject in a newspaper article, I have always had a considerable “come-back”, and invariably some of the letters are from well-balanced, middling people—doctors, for example—with no apparent economic grievance. These people always say (as Hitler says in Mein Kampf) that they started out with no anti-Jewish prejudice but were driven into their present position by mere observation of the facts. Yet one of the marks of anti-Semitism is an ability to believe stories that could not possibly be true. One could see a good example of this in the strange accident that occurred in London in 1942, when a crowd, frightened by a bomb-burst nearby, fled into the mouth of an Underground station, with the result that something over a hundred people were crushed to death. The very same day it was repeated all over London that “the Jews were responsible”. Clearly, if people will believe this kind of thing, one will not get much further by arguing with them. The only useful approach is to discover why they can swallow absurdities on one particular subject while remaining sane on others.”

Here’s one by Anne Frank

“Is discord going to show itself while we are still fighting, is the Jew once again worth less than another? Oh, it is sad, very sad, that once more, for the umpteenth time, the old truth is confirmed: "What one Christian does is his own responsibility, what one Jew does is thrown back at all Jews. “

Here’s one by founding father and second president, John Adams

“The Hebrews have done more to civilize men than any other nation. If I were an atheist, and believed blind eternal fate, I should still believe that fate had ordained the Jews to be the most essential instrument for civilizing the nations.”

I’ll leave with a quote by John Paul II stating the church’s distaste with anti-Semitism no matter when, by whom or in what shape or form.

“Once again, through myself, the Church, in the words of the well-known declaration Nostra Aetate, "deplores the hatred, persecutions and displays of anti-Semitism directed against the Jews at any time and by anyone." I repeat, "By anyone."

 

[Che Guava]

@strategycat

Care to add some context to these quotes? Do you agree/disagree with them? Are you just trying to make sure that everyone in this forum has access to enough anti-semetic literature?! I don't know exactly what your intentions are, but if you leave a message like that without any preamble, some people (including me) tend to assume the worst...

 

[Warman17]

@strategycat

Care to add some context to these quotes? Do you agree/disagree with them? Are you just trying to make sure that everyone in this forum has access to enough anti-semetic literature?! I don't know exactly what your intentions are, but if you leave a message like that without any preamble, some people (including me) tend to assume the worst...

along with me

 

[Greek Stud]

All those quotes, and all you have to do is take the word 'Jew' and put 'capitalist' and you find what it was, that the Jews were good at.

Unfortunately, even with all the anti-semitism the case against the Zionist cause could not be any weaker. It's true, I am a Greek on here speaking for the Jews. Where all of you have conveniently stepped over is the case of Palestinians being promised the Kingdom of Jordan.

Isrealite, you are comparing the Palestinians to the Philistines, but this comparison is incorrect. The Philistines in their first settlements came by boat. Research proves that the first Philistia were colonators from Mycenae. The area labelled as the Levant also had Semitic tribes like: the Pheonicians in the north, the 12 tribes of Canaan, and the Jewish tribes (Asher, Zebulun, Naphtali, Dan (North), Issachar, Manasseh, Ephraim, Gad, Rueben, Benjamin, Dan (South), Juda, Simeon).

Another group of colonators became the same cave-dwellers that the first Philistines were. Competition between the Philistines and Jewish peoples is well documented. Both peoples were experts at farming-villaging. They had their boundaries, but the Philistines did not live long and dispersed or disappeared in the same sense that the Phoenicians did.

Palestines of today are claiming Arab descendency to the Kingdom of Palestine under the Umayyid Dynasty, Abbassid Dynasty, and Ottoman Empire. Arab is the word meaning from Africa, and has nothing to do with Semitic people at all. But there is no point to claim dependency on race when we look at the legalities.

The truth is, Jerusalem and the swamplands around it were not as productive until the Jews made modern Israel. Even in the Byzantine Era, Queen (Saint) Helen described Caeserea to be an impossible project. Her work on transforming Caeserea, Palestine into Jerusalem the Holy City was nothing less than a death trap. The reconstruction of the city began in Saint Helen's vision as she found the Cross of Christ and built the Church of the Holy Sepultre atop it, and Jihad brought Mohammad to Jerusalem to claim the completed city as his Holy City. The Arabs of Mohammad that entered Jerusalem are where the Palestinians of today are claiming their heritage from. That is why it is dangerous to not see the Israeli-Palestinian issue as not being religious. All Arab countries attacked Israel because of their religious cause, and we need to keep to international law.

The agreement after WW2, which was the fundamental time to shaping borderlines of nations, promised the Palestinians the land east of the Jordan river and the Jews the land to the west of the Jordan river. In response, the Arabs attacked Israel to take all of the British territory for one Palestinian State. The existing Palestine changed its name to Trans-Jordan, and the line of Arab Kings and Queens of the Kingdom of Palestine fell into the Royal Blood of Trans-Jordan, now known as Jordan. In other words, the agreement was broken by the Palestinians when they grabbed an alliance to rid the agreement of west and east Jordan states. For whatever reason, they have been given credance to independence because they lived within Israel. The intiated a War and lost, and now would be awarded independence. Does not make sense?

The consessions that Isreal gave is beyond anything that any other nation should ever have to do. The Sinai Peninsula awarded to Arab Egypt (Copts are real Egyptians, not Arabs), and South Lebannon occupation was withdrawn. The Golan Heights are being withheld until Arab Syria acknowledges the existance of Israel and Gaza with the West Bank were occupied in the sense that Palestinians and Arabs owned property there.

Frankly, the vision of Zionism is also a legal right to the land they won, for today. While before the west/east river negotiation gave birth to Zionism in the sense that Jews had the money to buy the land and develop it. The did develop the land as many Cypriots tell the Greek community of how they viewed the Levant pre-Israel and post-Israel. There is no question of the Jewish accomplishment, just as Lebannon before the 1980s was also an Arab accomplishment. The Greek investment in Beirut was immense and pulled out to Cyprus because of the Syrian/Hezbollah involvement with the war/intifada against Israel.

The government of Cyprus was cooperative in the War of 1965 or the 6 day War, partially because our reliance on Britain and America and partially because our understanding of who the Palestinians are. They cannot claim being the Philistines as they were descents of the Mycenaen culture, and the Arab conquests that stole Alexandria, Egypt from the Greeks and Ierusalium from the Greeks and Babylon from the Greeks, that is what the Arab World is a representation of. In most cases, Greeks and Arabs today take sides with each other because of the case with Turkey. Syria and Iraq suffered from draught when a US build dam on the Euphrates was used by the Turks to quench the Arab Syrians and Iraqis over International laws over river rights. And naturally as Greek issues and Arab issues became the same case together against Turkey, Israel sought potential in an alliance with Turkey, even though Turkey supported the USSR in arming the Arab Syrians during the 6 Day War.

So choosing sides is all a matter of opinion, economics, ideas and goals; but there is no doubt in my mind that the laws through treaties on the creation of Israel, gives no legal rights to this new Palestinian homeland. You all critisize Jews for calling it their homeland but the Arabs can call it their homeland. Why can't I decalre it my homeland, as the Greek influence of the existence of Jerusalem today is no doubt in question. The simple reason is that it was decided by Treaty that this was to be Israel while Palestine was east of the Jordan river. Zionism brought them this opportunity to claim this case in the first place, and it is a continuing idea that could easily be supported by the rule of law.

 

[Thorgalaeg]

@warman17, dont if you know that i am not the one that posted the quotes.

However i know many of them are true or at least as true as the ones posted by you. Another matter is if we agree or disagree with them (or if they are out of context or not). But what intrigues me is that when some criticism towards the jews is exposed automatically the word anti-semitism appears as if it were the ultimate argument. However the same thing doesnt occur when we speak about islam, christianity or any oher religion, ideology or whatever.

Anyway about the Einstein´s sentence quoted by strategycat i have heard it before and surely its veracious. I Didnt know that about the one from Washington. Very interesting.

About Mohamed the Q´uran says that after leaving Mecca the first place where he inhabited was Taif, village where there was a big Jewish community. Mohammad was expelled by the Jews of Tahif who throwed stones against him. Years later when Mohammad takes power he get its little revenge and one of his first measures is to push all Jewish tribes out of Medina. In fact you can note an obvious general dislike towards the jews in the Qúran.

The Jesus one is intentionally out of context. He is not speaking against the jews as a whole, he speaks against the forgers and liars in general, the problem is that in this particular case the forgers and liars he was speaking to were jews.

 

[Warman17]

Well anti-Semitism as quoted by American Heritage Dictionary is

"1. Hostility toward or prejudice against Jews or Judaism.
2. Discrimination against Jews."

it's obvious that most talks against jews, Judaism, or Jewry are Anti-Semitic in nature. Obviously a Jew on trial for murder crying anti-Semitism is false, but it makes the word no less powerful.

The reason why the word "anti-Semite" is so powerful is simply put, because of the holocaust. Being called an anti-Semite became synonymous with being called a Nazi after WW2 though the two are never always one-in-the-same. Being called an anti-Semite rings up pictures of the holocaust regardless of the context.

The reason why showing prejudice against Christianity or Islam is simply because, compared to Judaism they are each almost 1000 times larger population wise. Jews are by far a very, very small minority in the world. Even in the US where the second largest number of Jews live(next to Israel), they only make up 2% of the population.

If we were to compare, being called an anti-Semite now is similar to being called an atheist in centuries prior to the 20th. It is something that goes against societal standards.

 

[Siggy19]

To return to the basis of this discussion;

Zionism is not a religion, it IS a form of Jewish Nationalism and _AMONG JEWS_ there is an effort to evangelize it.

Some people who are not Jews nonetheless support the creation and/or continued existence of Israel, but these are not Zionists.

With regard to the claims that Palestine before Zionism was all worthless and that the Zionists stole land from the Palestinians, there is truth in both, but they are mostly false. The following few paragraphs hopefully explain this in more depth.

Originally (from 1890 to 1914 or so), Jews settled in the area of Palestine/Israel by buying land, often previously deemed worthless (the swamp and the desert), for fair market value (or above). After the first world war, there were attempts to restrict Jewish immigration by the British who had control of the area (despite the Balfour declaration) and there was a radical increase in conflict between the Jewish and Palestinian populations.

After the second world war the British wanted out of the middle and so the United Nations voted 33 to 13 with 10 abstensions to partition the area into two states, Israel and Palestine. Although Israel was allotted more land (about 55%), much of this was desert and so the partition was probably reasonably fair (insofar as the partition was fair).

As Israel declared its independence, various Arab armies attacked (although it was really more of an escalation of existing fighting). The Israelis won due to a combination of having nothing to lose and expensive imports of weapons. While Israel gained some land, mostly the effect of the war was for Gaza and the West Bank to be subsumed into Egypt and Jordan respectively, which meant that the Palestinian state was never established.

At this time, some Palestinian land was appropriated by Israel and most of the Jews who had lived for thousands of years in Iran, Iraq, Yemen, Saudi Arabia, Libya, Egypt and Algeria were summarily expelled with little more than the clothes on their backs.

Overall, there was iniquity on both sides and the ideal solution would be for them to both get over it and make friends. Can you imagine how powerful the Middle East would be if the Jews were working alongside the Arabs so that the Oil wealth was being invested in education and improved infrastructure rather than being used by the relatively few to line their pockets ? Rather than being deserts, Saudi Arabia and the Sahara would be the farm capitals of the world with their endless sun, if they had the technology and desire to desalinate enough water to irrigate.

Instead, the Israelis live in a modern Shtetl and the vast majority of Arabs are so poor that they are willing to work for their worst enemies.

Zionism was and is a valid desire for Jews to have a land that would be theirs after 2,000 years of wandering. The fact that it dispossessed some Palestinians is a tragedy for everyone concerned and was never needed or wanted by anyone. The UN did anticipate that some Palestinians and Jews would need to move as a result of their partition plan, was it was never intended to be a mass migration in either direction. Heck, the UN wanted the two states to work together, which is why Jerusalem was declared to be an International City.

As for anti-semistism... the literal definition does include prejudice against Arabs, but that hardly ever happens and so the practical definition as prejudice against Jews is what everyone understands the term to mean. There is prejudice in some places against Muslims, but only a minority of Moslems are Arabs (for example most Iranians are very offended by being called 'Arab').

Just because some 'great' person said bad (or good) stuff about the Jews does not mean it was true. Everyone has prejudices and stereotypes (I'm a lot more comfortable walking towards a pretty white woman in a dark alley than walking towards a big black man with scars all over his face, although I do hope that I would never treat a person differently because of their race, religion, sexual identity or nationality - I admit to treating women differently to men on occasions, but hopefully without ever causing offence).

As for whether the Jews rule the World... if they did, wouldn't the place run better ?

 

[Israelite9191]

Good summation, although anti-Arab racism is actually very common, it is just a rather modern phenomenon that came into being after the coining of the term 'antisemitism'. Other than that, I have nothing major to say, although I haven't read the post very carefully.

 

[Israelite9191]

Acutally, I doubt that the Jews would be able to turn the Sahara and Saudi deserts into farmlands by now. Maybe in a couple decades , but not yet. Although it is true that if the Jews and Arabs were ableto work together, the Middle East would be a much better place.