GOTM 130 - Spoiler

[Ali Ardavan]

I guess I didn't take the right tech path going for Monarchy rather than Republic, ...

I too went for Monarchy and did so without thinking. At higher levels Monarchy is advantageous because it is very hard to celebrate without infrastructure. But this was Warlord which meant 5 content citizens! Given my particular hut outcomes in this game (not a single supported unit so far) I could have really benefited from Republic. Oh well.

I gambled on my choice of city site. I got a decent spot on a lake with 2 whales, grass covered rivered whale which is now silk, and wheat. I have 5 river tiles, 1 Mountain, 1 tundra, and 1 hill. I knew I would not have ocean access (black clicking) and took a gamble based on the size of continent 2 which paid off. All but French are here.

I had trouble staying out of Moderate as well. I have never been Supreme, only a small amount of time in Mighty and most of the time flipping back and forth between Moderate and Strong.

I fought with Greeks too. They lost about half a dozen units on my vet Legion fortified on a hill top near one of their cities. I tried really hard to get them to pay tribute and they did not. Eventually one of my vans stepped next to one of their elephants. I immediately spent my money below 50g, contacted them, gifted them some tech, and reached peace. I hope to maintain that peace.

I have only one ally: Chinese. Greeks and French are too hostile and demanding for alliance. Babylonians and Romans keep turning me down.

This is the first time we have had so many OCC players. I am looking forward to more logs. Lack of a clear city site near the starting position, among other things, has created a great diversity of games. I am hoping there will still be more players joining us: Peaster, Magic, grigor, Mackerel, Jokemaster, Prof. Garfield, mercurious, ...

Last, but not least, congrats to URUWASHI for finishing an OCCC game. It is a rare accomplishment.

 

[URUWASHI]

I had a HUGE computer crash...installed a new printer..and for some reason all my files dissapeared ..I managed to back all my files up after 3 days. Sorry I missed the deadline.
Live and Learn !!

 

[Ali Ardavan]

URUWASHI, what deadline are you talking about? The deadline for this game is still a week away.

 

[Ali Ardavan]

Date Production started Tech started Other notables
-1980 Harbor Babylonian -> 50g
-1960 Chinese -> 100g
-1920 Caravan None Legion from hut
Math, Writing -> Greek (6) -> peace
(to save my van from Greek elephant)
-1900 Caravan T1L2S7
-1880 Delhi celebrates. T2L2S6
-1860 Philosophy First trade route: Hides to Rome for 144
-1840 Caravan Chinese -> 50g, Roman -> 0g
-1800 Caravan
-1780 Philosophy from hut.
-1760 Caravan -> Republic Delhi is size 7
-1740 Astronomy Roman -> 25g
-1720 Aqueduct Copper to Shanghai for 160. Revolution
-1700 French declare war over tribute demand
Republic established. T0L2S8
-1680 Delhi celebrates
-1660 Caravan Delhi is size 8
-1640 Caravan Delhi is size 9. Silk to Greeks for 396
-1620 Copernicus Engineering Delhi is size 10.
Bridge -> Chinese -> Banking, 0g
Banking -> Greek -> maps
-1600 Delhi is size 11. Chinese -> 25g
-1580 Delhi is size 12. T1L1S8
Astronomy -> Greek -> University
Wine to Rome for 300
-1560 Economics Hides to Tsingtao for 296
-1540 Caravan
-1520 University
-1500 Medicine
-1480 Chinese -> 25g
-1440 Caravan Sanitation T3L1S6
-1420 Caravan
-1400 Caravan Chinese -> 50g
-1380 Caravan Chemistry Chinese -> 50g
-1360 Caravan
-1340 Shakespeare Supported settler disbanded. T2L1S7
-1320 Theory of Gravity Temple sold. T3L0S7
-1300 Sewer 50g+all techs but Chem -> Greeks
(improve their attitude and save my van)
-1280 Chinese -> 50g. T2L2S6
-1260 Invention Delhi celebrates. T1L2S7
-1240 Trieme Delhi is size 13.
-1220 Caravan Delhi is size 14. Trireme pushes back
2 tiles of darkness and is disbanded.
-1200 Caravan Democracy Delhi is size 15. Beads to Athens for 252
-1180 Caravan Delhi is size 16. Chinese -> 50g
-1160 Caravan Gunpowder Delhi is size 17. T2L2S6
-1140 Caravan Delhi is size 18. Chinese -> 50g
-1120 Caravan Delhi is size 19. Chinese -> 50g
-1100 Caravan Explosives Delhi is size 20.
-1080 Delhi is size 21. Chinese -> 0g
-1050 Delhi is size 22
-1040 Engineer Metallurgy Supported horseman disbanded
-1020 Delhi is size 23 and out of food. T4L0S6
Salt to Shanghai for 158. 100g from hut
-1000 Caravan Conscription T2L0S8

Status at -1000
City Size: 22 Government: Republic Gold: 541 Techs: 36 Trade routes: 3
Structures: Library, Marketplace, Temple, Harbor, Aqueduct, Sewer, University
Wonders: Colossus, Marco, Copernicus, Shakespeare
Units: 1 None settler, 1 Engineer, 2 None Legions, 1 None horsemen, 4 food and 4 commodity vans
Goals: Newton, Refrigeration, Railroad
Roman: 2 cities, 25 techs;
Babylonian: 3 cities, 16 techs
French: 5 cities, 24 techs; Great Library; nominal war with me
Chinese: 6 cities, 33 techs
Greek: 8 cities, 32 techs; Hanging Gardens

 

[Ali Ardavan]

Date Production started Tech started Other notables
-0960 Caravan Navigation Chinese -> 25g
-0920 Caravan Physics Revolution. Babylonian -> 100g
-0900 Babylonian -> 100g. Chinese -> 25g
Democracy established.
-0880 Newton
-0860 Atomic Theory Copper to Shanghai for 164
-0840 Refused to pay 100g to Greeks causing war
-0820 Bank Magnetism 2 barbarian Knights from hut.
-0800 Vet legion miraculously survives 2 knights!
Chinese -> 50g
-0780 Electricity Chinese -> 50g. T4L0S6
-0760 Greeks kill my Caravan. Chinese -> 50g
-0740 Stock Exchange Refrigeration
-0720 Chinese -> 50g
-0700 Steam Engine
-0660 Supermarket Railroad Chinese -> 50g
-0640 Electricity -> Chinese -> Feudalism
-0620 Chivalry
-0580 Caravan Leadership Wine to Shanghai for 137
-0560 Greek elephant killed in attack on my legion
-0540 Industrialization T3L0S7
-0520 Caravan
-0500 Tactics Gold to Tsingtao for 226. T0L0S10

Status at -500
City Size: 22 Government: Democracy Gold: 2743 Techs: 49 Trade routes: 3
Structures: Library, Marketplace, Harbor, Aqueduct, Sewer, University, Bank, Stock Exchange, Supermarket
Wonders: Colossus, Marco, Copernicus, Shakespeare, Newton
Units: 1 None settler, 1 Engineer, 2 None Legions, 1 None horsemen, 1 food van
Goals: Modern infrastructure, max population
Roman: 3 cities, 28 techs;
Babylonian: 4 cities, 20 techs; War with French
French: 5 cities, 34 techs; Great Library; War with Babylonians and nominal war with me
Chinese: 6 cities, 47 techs; Pyramids; Allied with me
Greek: 8 cities, 33 techs; Hanging Gardens, King Richard's; War with me

-0480 Engineer Corporation T3L0S7
-0440 Freight Steel Chinese -> 25g
-0400 Freight Communism Leadership -> Chinese -> Communism, 25g
T2L0S8. Barbarian knight from hut
-0380 -> Espionage Heroic legion survives yet another knight.
-0360 Spy Machine Tools T0L2S8
-0340 Delhi celebrates. Chinese -> 50g
-0320 Freight Refining Delhi is size 22. Senate -> French cease fire
-0300 Delhi is size 23
-0280 Freight Electronics Delhi is size 24
-0260 Delhi is size 25. Chinese -> 50g
-0240 Freight Combustion Delhi is size 26. T2L0S8
-0200 structure Automobile Chinese -> 50g
-0160 -> Superhighways Mass Production First pollution appears. Greek catapult killed
-0140 structure
-0120 -> Mass Transit Mobile Warfare T3L0S7
-0100 unit
-0080 -> Armor Recycling
-0060 Factory Greek crusader killed.
-0040 Nuclear Fission Greeks kill a freight. Chinese -> 50g
-0020 Hydro Plant
+0001 Mini Greek crusader killed.

Status at +0001
City Size: 26 Government: Democracy Gold: 2753 Techs: 63 Trade routes: 3
Structures: Library, Marketplace, Harbor, Aqueduct, Sewer, University, Bank, Stock Exchange, Supermarket, Superhighways, Factory, Mass Transit
Wonders: Colossus, Marco, Copernicus, Shakespeare, Newton
Units: 1 None settler, 2 Engineers, 2 None Legions, 1 None horsemen, 1 Spy, 3 food and 3 commodity vans
Goals: Computers, max population
Roman: no embassy;
Babylonian: no embassy;
French: no embassy; Great Library;
Chinese: no embassy; Pyramids; Allied with me
Greek: no embassy; Hanging Gardens, King Richard's, Sun Tzu, Leo; War with me

+0040 Freight Greeks build Darwin. 2 Greek units killed
Refrigeration -> Chinese -> Flight, 50g
+0060 Computers 2 Greek units killed. T2L0S8
+0080 structure 2 Greek units killed attacking my hero Legion
+0100 -> Research lab Nuclear Power
+0120 Chinese -> 50g. Roman embassy established
+0140 Offshore Platform Radio T3L0S7. Undemanded Cloth to Rome for 87
+0160 Greek embassy established. Greek unit killed
+0180 Advanced Flight
+0200 Freight Chinese -> 50g. 2 Greek units killed.
+0220 Recycling Center Rocketry
+0260 Robotics
+0280 structure Engineer disbanded. 2 Greek units killed
+0300 -> Manufacturing Space Flight Wine to Shanghai for 217
+0320 Greek unit killed.
Chinese embassy established.
+0340 Apollo Plastics Greek unit killed. Coal to Rome for 225.
+0380 Environmentalism Greek unit killed. T2L0S8
+0420 Polytheism Computers -> Chinese -> Polytheism
Chinese cancel alliance over Space Flight
T0L2S8
+0440 SS Structural -> Laser Delhi celebrates
+0460 SS Structural Superconductor Delhi is size 27
+0480 SS Structural Delhi is size 28
+0500 SS Structural Monotheism Delhi is size 29.
Superconductor -> Chinese -> Monotheism
+xxxx SS Structural -> Fusion Power Delhi is size 30
+xxxx SS Structural Future Tech 1 Delhi is size 31. Engineer disbanded
+xxxx SS Structural Delhi is size 32 and maxed out. T2L0S8
Chinese develop Mobile Warfare! Sewer sold
+xxxx SS Structural Theology Aqueduct sold
+xxxx SS Structural
+xxxx SS Structural Stealth T3L0S7
+xxxx SS Structural
+xxxx SS Structural
+xxxx SS Structural Future Tech 2 T8L0S2
+xxxx SS Structural
+xxxx SS Structural
+xxxx SS Component
+xxxx SS Component
+xxxx SS Component Chinese build SETI
+xxxx SS Component
+xxxx SS Component
+xxxx SS Component Fundamentalism Hero legion survives Greek crusader
+xxxx SS Module T10L0S0
+xxxx SS Module Horseman disbanded
+xxxx SS Module Spy, tank, settler, and legion disbanded.
Stock Exchange sold.
Power dropped to Moderate from Strong
Hero legion is the only unit left
+xxxx Stock Exchange 15s3c1m space ship launched.
+xxxx Stealth Fighter
+xxxx Eiffel
+xxxx Power back to Strong. T1L0S9
+xxxx Oracle Future Tech 3 T0L0S10
+xxxx Future Tech 4
+xxxx Combined Arms
+xxxx Lighthouse
+xxxx … T0L10S0
+xxxx Space ship arrives

 

[URUWASHI]

I guess I can still have time to post GOTM 130 , after my computer crash I lost 129....but I will post 130 in the next day or two.

 

[URUWASHI]

Since I am the only one that seem played OCC and conquering here is the rest of my LOG , I made this LOG using the last saves on my game, since my text file was lost.

After 1 AD :

20 AD - LYONS Destroyed

STATS at 20 AD =
2 Civilizations left - French and Babylonians -
Babilonyans = 1 City ( ? )
French = 4 or More cities ? - Will Wipe: LYONS , MARSEILLES , TOURS and PARIS to avoid respawning of civs ...

Babylon size 6 Paris Size 5 ..will obliterate defenses and pillage roads and irrigation until cities Reach size 1...then Conquer the City.

20 AD : UNITS : 1 settler ( NONE ) 1 Archer ( None ) 2 Legions ( 1 NONE ) 2 Horseman (2 NONE ) 8 Elephants ( 3 NONE ) , 4 Triremes( 1 NONE ) , 1 Caravel ( None ).

40 - ENGINEERING @ INVENTION
80 - Marseilles DESTROYED

140 - Chartres DESTROYED - PARIS DESTROYED - ( PYRAMIDS DESTROYED )
160 - Chartres FOUND - One French City Left
180 - Units Desmanteled - Chartres Destroyed
340 - TOURS Destroyed - FRENCH DESTROYED
440 - Attacking Last City - Babylon - City Size = 3 - Pillage of Irrigation do the trick .

Game Over :
TOTAL UNITS LOST in the game 3 ELEPHANTS and 1 LEGION

 

[Magic_gorter]

@Uruwashi. I haven't received your game yet. Do not know if you tried to submit it already. Submitting should be at civ2gotm@gmail.com

 

[Major Advantage]

If anybody is interested, here is the rest of my game. It took me 200 years (=10 turns) more to build Apollo than Ali.

20 Electr. -> Nucl. Fiss
60 Nucl. Fiss -> Machine Tools
100 Machine -> Mini (Think about Darwin (12 vans in store), but decide against it)
140 Mini -> Computer
180 Computer -> Flight, rush science lab, trigger final celebration
200 Science Lab built
220 Flight -> Radio
280 Radio -> Adv. flight, another greek catapult intercepted, stop celebration @26
320 Factory built
340 Adv. Flight -> Nucl. Power
380 greek Crusader killed
400 Nucl. Power -> Rocketry, raise science for another 2 t/a
420 Nucular Plant built
440 Rocket -> Space
500 Space Flight -> Laser
540 Apollo built
560 1st SS-structure
580 2nd, Laser -> Poly; hail chinese, trade poly for tactics; little calculation: 22 ss-parts to build, 3 techs to get => 7 t/a should be enough. Still go for 6
600 3rd, researching plastics
700 8th structure, plastics -> Supercond., hail chinese, get pottery for explosives
740 10th structure, but change of plans: Why hurrying? It's probably 2 late 2 finish early, AI no threat at all, probably short of gold/vans for 1 ss-part per turn, so build some more wonders for score

And Ali's log suggests my first assumption was right. So I built Sun Tzu, Eiffel Tower, HG, LH, UN, Michelangelo, GW, KRC and SoL before my standard spaceship arrived at Alpha Centauri.

 

[Ali Ardavan]

If anybody is interested, here is the rest of my game. It took me 200 years (=10 turns) more to build Apollo than Ali.

Actually you only finished Apollo 5 turns later. Mine got done in 440. I will change my log format next time and record when things get done not when they get started.

I had enough cash and spare units on hand to get all but the last module done in one turn. For the last one, I had to disband all but one unit (including my none settler) and sell my stock exchange to barely make it. I made 3 wonders after launch. With 9 extra wonders at the end, you will likely get the blue star. I am certain URUWASHI gets the green with his +440 finish.

 

[Major Advantage]

Oops, you're right, I neglected your log mentions the starting-date, not the completing-date.

I'm not sure about blue, spes saepe fallit!

I was about to replay the game, starting around Apollo, with aiming to "early-" launch a bigger (and slower) ship, so I'd have more post-launch time to build wonders, but then started #131 instead.

 

[Magic_gorter]

Just finished my game. Hadn't time to play civ for a couple of months. But the game went pretty well. Started at 77,13 1 special and lot of river but I think this was not the best choice looking at other logs. Went for early republic (2660 bc) and had Marco and Collosus before 2000 bc....

Apollo build in 1130 ad....

I will post my log soon...

 

[haleewud]

Here is the next part of my log. When I left off, I was at 2000BC and I was supreme. I am not including my RBs. I was doing quite a bit.

1980BC - Wool van
1940BC - Food van
1920BC - should have developed Masonry, check - I am now mighty tech cost for supreme was 171, for mighty it is 247.
1900BC - Food van
1880BC - Build Colossus, Masonry -> Math (20 techs, cost rises to 420) Hides to Rome for 220g
1840BC - Food van
1800BC - Food van, Math -> Astronomy (441)
1780BC - Romans develop Mysticism, Greeks Wheel. with all 1st level terraforming complete, settler joins Delhi (size 8).
1760BC - Encounter Chinese (Supreme), Peace, Trade Trade for Seafaring (cost 462), Food van
1740BC - Withdraw from Thermopylae, 50 tribute to Greeks (I had 155), Gift Philosophy to Greeks, Hut - Legion (NON).
1720BC - Food van
1700BC - Greek Capital to Athens
1680BC - Hut 100g (had to reload 3 times due to Advanced Tribe).
1660BC - Beijing builds Great Library. Romans get Monarchy and Trade from Chinese, Peace. Food van.
1640BC - French Capital to Lyons. Astro -> Contruction (529). Hides to Antium for 192g.
1620BC - Food van. 6 vans to Delhi.
1600BC - Babylonians start LH. Copernicus' Observatory built. Hut - Nomad, disband horse.
1580BC - Food van.
1560BC - Romans develop Masonry. Construction -> University (552). Wine to Beijing 368.
1540BC - Food van.
1520BC - Happiest - Chinese 1, Greeks 2, Romans 4, Indians 5. Univ -> Theory of Gravity (575). 1500BC - Food van. Wool to Sparta for 142g.
1460BC - Food van.
1440BC - ToG -> Chemistry (598).
1420BC - Food van. Trade with Greeks Philosophy for Wheel. Give Const, Poly, Univ, Seaf and Med to Greeks.
1380BC - Food van. 6 vans to Delhi
1360BC - Build Shakespeare's Theatre
1340BC - Chemistry -> Bridge Building. Rush Build (138g).
1320BC - Aqueduct built, WLTCD.
1300BC - 400,000 population (size 9)
1280BC - 500,000 population (size 10). Hut - Crusader (NON).
1260BC - Harbor built, 600,000 population (size 11).
1240BC - Bridge Building -> Engineering (609). 700,000 population (size 12).
1220BC - Coal van. WLTCD ends.
1180BC - Food van. Hut - Monarchy (not so good - tech cost 630).
1160BC - Engineering -> Sanitation (713). Give Engineering to Greeks (651).
1120BC - Food van.
1080BC - WLTCD. Sanitation -> Economics (672). Power drops to STRONG.
1060BC - Sewer system built. 900,000 (size 13).
1040BC - 1 million (size 14). Power back up to Mighty (736).
1020BC - Romans develop Philosophy. Size 15. Give Math, BB to Greeks (672).
1000BC - Babylon builds LH. Food van. Eco - Invention (759). Size 16. Give Chem to Greeks (693).

City Size: 16 Government: Republic Gold: 131 Techs: 33 Trade routes: 3
Structures: Library, Aqueduct, Sewer, Harbor
Wonders: Colossus, Shakes, Copes
Units: 1 settlers, 2 Legion, 1 Chariot, 1 Crusader (all are NON). 1 Diplomat, 1 commodity van, 3 Food vans.
Goals: More deliveries, Democracy, MPE.
Roman: Republic, Uncooperative, Allied, no embassy
Babylonian: no contact
French: no contact
Chinese: Monarchy, Enthusiastic, Peace, no embassy
Greek: Republic, Receptive, Peace, no embassy

 

[haleewud]

Next Part

980BC - Size 17
960BC - Size 18 (no surplus food left)
940BC - Food van. 4 vans to Delhi
920BC - Most Advanced Indians 1, Chinese 2, Greeks 3, Romans 4. MPE built. Invention-> Democracy (714)
Contact Chinese, give Sanitation get maps.
Contact French, Peace, Give Trade and Sanitation, get maps
Contact Babylonians Peace, Give Sanitation and Literacy get maps
900BC - WLTCD ends
860BC - Gems van
840BC - Romans Iron Working, Chinese Navigation
820BC - Democracy -> Navigation (805). Democracy established. Trade with Chinese Democracy for Navigation (828).
800BC - Antium builds Pyramids. Gold van. Start Physics
760BC - French develop Univ. Chinese contact want Invention for Pottery, no. Physics -> Steam Engine (851).
740BC - French capture Babylon (get Seafaring). Babylonians destroyed. Chinese get HBR and Math from GL. University built.
700BC - Food van. Steam Engine -> Atomic Theory (912) (not quite ready for Railroad).
680BC - Coal to Shanghai for 136g
660BC - Romans Math. Copper van.
640BC - Beijing builds KRC. Atomic Theory -> Gunpowder (936).
620BC - Food van
600BC - Greeks Sanitation
580BC - Food van. Gunpowder -> Explosives (960). Gems to Rome for 297g.
560BC - Withdraw from Xinjian. Diplomat expelled by Chinese.
540BC - Food van. Explosives -> Railroad (984)
520BC - Romans ask for help against French, no. They offer 400 gold, I accept (romans have 106 left).
500BC - Food van.
480BC - Romans Univ. Food van. RR -> Industrialization (1092). Give Nav to Greeks (1008).
460BC - Food van.
440BC - French Astro. Food van.
420BC - Build Engineer (size 17). Ind-> Metallurgy (1118). Chinese Pottery for RR, no. Give RR to Chinese, Romans and Greeks (1032).
400BC - Isaac Newton's College.
380BC - Metal->The Corporation (1144).
360BC - Chines Invention. Build Factory.
320BC - Food van. Bribe French Settler for 284g
300BC - Athens builds Great Wall (obsolete). Greeks Pottery. Corp->Conscription. Kill French Catapult. Power is now Strong (1035).
280BC - Wool van.
260BC - Romans Medicine. Romans get Astro from French for RR. Peace. Frecnh get IW from Romans for Sanitation. Conscription -> Magnetism (1058).
240BC - Food van
220BC - Power is now Moderate, tech cost jumps to 1702.
200BC - Food van
180BC - French get Construction from Romans for Code of Laws. Magnetism -> Refining (1739).
160BC - Chinese, French Peace. Food van.
120BC - Food van.
100BC - Refining -> Electricity (1872).
80BC - French govt overthrown. Food van. Gold to Nanking for 332g
60BC - French Republic
40BC - Food van. Electricity -> Combustion (1911). Copper to Beijing for 219g.
20BC - Romans Nav. French Banking. Power level to Mighty (1323). Give Inv, Wheel and Physics to Romans, get maps.
1AD - Greeks get Invention from Romans for Bridge Building, peace. Hides van. Now Strong (1176).

City Size: 17 Government: Democracy Gold: 787 Techs: 49 Trade routes: 3
Structures: Library, Aqueduct, University, Factory, Sewer, Harbor
Wonders: Colossus, MPE, Shakes, Copes, Newton
Units: 2 settlers, 2 Legion, 1 Chariot, 1 Crusader (all are NON). 1 Engineer, 1 Diplomat, 2 commodity freight, 1 Food van, 6 Food freight.
Roman: Republic, 4 cities, 31 techs, 421g; Pyramids; Allied with Indians
Babylonian: destroyed
French: Republic, 6 cities, 23 techs, 420g; LH; War with Indians
Chinese: Republic, 6 cities, 35 techs, 508g; GL and KRC; Peace with all
Greek: Republic, 5 cities, 30 techs, 1174g; GW; Peace with all

 

[URUWASHI]

Sunday March 4 th - JUST GOT MY COMPUTER BACK !! After a massive Crash... Can I PLEASE send my Game 130 or is it too late ??

 

[Magic_gorter]

Please send them to civ2gotm@gmail.com
It's not to late.

 

[Major Advantage]

I have a question concerning Marco Polo:
I decided not to spend my ressources on it because
a) I wouldn't need to know the location of oversea-trading-destinations since I wouldn't be doing oversea-trade anyway and would find my continental destinations by physical contact and
b) we are at warlord-level, so the AI is stupid, therefore you can hardly count on them as research assistants.

So, with hindsight, was Marco paying off?

 

[Ali Ardavan]

So, with hindsight, was Marco paying off?

Here is my data from my log. I built Marco in -2360. By then I had already met Romans and Greeks but not the other rivals. It immediately brought me 2x100g and 2 techs from Chinese and Babylonians. By -2000 it brought another 3x25g and 2 more techs; all from Chiense and Babylonians except one tech from the French.

My conclusion: yes it was well worth it.

Here is my reasoning:

1. I had no idea how many offshore rivals we have. It turned out to be only one, but it could have been more.

2. While I would have eventually met Chiense and Babylonians, it would not have happened as soon as it did with Marco and that translates into opportunity cost. That 200g was woth a lot more to me then than a dozen turns later.

3. Without Marco tech trading is risky. With Marco there is no risk as you know exactly what the other guy has to offer. I have often had to agree to a tech trade when meeting a rival early in the game, just to see what else they have and the outcome is occasionally disappointing.

4. With Marco you can see what your rivals are researching and use that to guide their discovery towards soemthng useful. This can yield a few techs by industrialization (after that the AI is usually hopelessly slow compared to a good human player).

Having said that, there have been times when I skipped Marco in OCC games. It is rarely a good idea and in my opinion this occasion was no exception.

 

[URUWASHI]

Managed to retrieve my files from game 130 - After Upgrading to Windows 7 , the computer created a folder called " Windows. old " , but ...I could not find my OLD Files.

Then , I went to my Control Panel and changed Folder view , ( Unhid files ) and after searching found my 130 folder....so I was able to send my game saves.

BUT I have a BIGGER problem now....I can NOT upload Civ II to Windows 7 ....it does not recognize de CD, and also I have a WING.DLL WING. INI files that can not be found !!

Is it any patches to allow it to work under windows 7 ?? Compatibility ( as Windows Vista or XP ) it does not work.. I am getting frustrated...LOVE to play the game .

Any ideas anyone ?

 

[Major Advantage]

@URU: Have you taken a look at the tech-support-foum? There is a lot of stuff about getting the game going on windows 7.

Here is my data from my log. I built Marco in -2360. By then I had already met Romans and Greeks but not the other rivals. It immediately brought me 2x100g and 2 techs from Chinese and Babylonians. By -2000 it brought another 3x25g and 2 more techs; all from Chiense and Babylonians except one tech from the French. [...]

Did you get the gold as alliance-gift or as tribute?

I know about the advantages of embassies, so I established them with the stronger opponents nearby (China and Greece) by using exploring diplomats and I still could get some gold and techs from them.
I think a nice side effect of less tech-trading/guiding in my game was the a lot of cheap wonders were still available in the endgame.