GOTM 144 Iroquois Deity - Final Spoiler - Game Over

Più Freddo

From space, earth is blue
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This is the thread where you tell us how you did - win, lose or retire.

Only read or post in this thread when your game is ended and successfully submitted.
 
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One day before the deadline and nobody here yet?!

Well, finally I was able to finish a game without last-minute stress... :goodjob:

Domination in 480AD. Could have been a turn faster, if I had planned better ahead, but I thought that the Persian tiles would suffice to reach the dom limit and I wouldn't have to attack the Indians (who already had Muskets). But they didn't suffice: 22 tiles missing after I settled all the empty spots. :mad: So I had to send a couple of Cavs down south to India and then attack the next turn to take the missing tiles.
 
same with me, 14 tiles missing when i thought it should suffice... ;)
and then i could add nearly 100 tiles the very next turn! grr

i nearly missed the date, had to switch everything off and play the last like 20 turns with no MM whatsoever.
t_x
 
continuing from 1st Spoiler...
750 LoD on Yanks, big slaughtering starts as lots of their troops are in my lands.
710 connect 3rd lux
550 revolt a 2nd time, this time for Republic
30 after endless struggles and 3 lost MW armies*, i can finally conquer the American capital with Pyras and HG
*just meaning: loads of MWs... i hardly ever build real armies in Ptw
_
90ad cannot destroy America due to a misclick  see German borders.
110 Of course now every turn an American town flips :grrr:
Meet Germany. They are backwards but big.
130 FINALLY kill off the Americans. That must have been my worst Deity warfare in a long time…
Rush FP in Washington (probably saved the MGL for too long )
Berlin builds Wealth?!?!
280 Aztecs destroyed
350 Vikings destroyed
410 Persia destroyed
470 China destroyed in the last turn

E victories
III MGL in 925bc
IIIII IIII MGL in 690bc
IIIII IIIII IIIII III MGL in 360ad
IIIII IIIII IIII

and with such a different style of game...

Spoiler :
i finished...

Spoiler :
on the very same turn Lanzelot did! :eek:


t_x
 
Well, looks like in this game, like in chess, there is more than just one "correct strategy"... :D

Regarding the flips: I had a fair share of these, too... (One time even taking a Cav Army with it... :mad:) In retrospect I'm not sure whether in this case it would have been better to use the raze&replace strategie... :D I would have needed a couple dozen more settlers, but would have saved a dozen Cavs or so. In the end it probably evens out, though?! (Or I finally need to learn to resist the temptation to park units in captured towns for healing, even if I own Sun Tzu's...)

Did you stay with MWs? Or went for Knights or even Cavs?
 
i stopped research after some AA tech. only built MWs and never took CHIV even when i could get it. there is no unit comparably efficient to MWs. i am quite sure that this decision was the right one. however, my warfare was partly lacking concentration and partly unlucky, which cost me huge time.

the losses however were enormous, with a few SOURs in the game, and only in the last few turns i made it to 100+ MWs. America was very strong and could not really be weakened by war against someone else, due to their geographic location. they reserved some prime core land which simply was missed in the earlier game. i kept them occupied against the Aztecs, but that only avoided them to attack me, but in the end i had to kill all their units myself.
India was the runaway civ on the pangaea, eating Ragnar alive. Germany stayed "strong" compared to me until the end. surprisingly, all of the AIs were relatively weak in building culture, compared to a standard Deity game. at least i did not have to build too many roads...

t_x
 
An intense and challenging game, even frustrating now and then. Bear with me until the end and you'll have fun.

By 975 BC i was in the Medievals, researching Engineering at a very low rate. A few of my MW gained elite promotion by killing the barbarian horsemen out of a camp in the southern tip. Meanwhile, i went in full military production mode, except for a library in a very productive core city.

By 650 BC i was feeling ready to strike at the Americans. First move was a blitzkrieg on 3 fronts, followed by a steady advance, fueled by my Golden Age. Most of the American defenders were spearmen, and i found a few pikemen only when approaching their core. Even so, it was brutal: they had no less than 19 cities and their culture was 5-6 times mine, so i had to leave recapture teams behind. Oddly enough, no American city flipped back, but how can you know?

In 470 BC my research on Engineering was complete. By that time it was known by everybody except for Scandinavia, and i could trade it for Feudalism. Research was stopped.

In 330 BC a coordinated attack on the last 4 American cities put Abe into forced retirement. In the very same turn i finally met the Germans, thanks to a captured Great Lighthouse. With trae i gobbled all their money, then gifted them to parity and was lucky with their pick: Monotheism. I bought it, with full German maps as an added bonus, then knocked at the continental AS doors. To my surprise, my monopoly knowledge of Germany and its world maps was enough to net Invention, Theology and Monarchy (useless at that point).

I started research on Chivalry, only to buy it a few turns later from the Vikings. Meanwhile, i reassembled my forces and launched the Aztec campaign. Their border cities were easy to capture, but as i approached the Aztec core things started going downhill. They had had the time to get Gunpowder and produce some musketmen to defend their size 7+ cities and, as you may imagine, my losses went rapidly up. Moreover, i had to face their knights, skirmishing against my knights and regularly winning. Add to that the fact that, by that time, Aztecia had become a cultural monster and the chances of a flip were high. Having no idea where their source of saltpeter was (they could also be trading it) i had to presume that every flipped city could produce a musketman, and i had to leave behind recapture teams everywhere. This put added strain on my already stressed military.

To make things easier i had enlisted Persia. My goal was to have them capture a big Aztec city bordering Persian lands, while my troops would take over the rest. Even so, it was hard, and i wasn't even trying to fish for a leader because of the absolute lack of elite promotions. My original plan was to use two leader for the Forbidden Palace in the homeland and the capital jump, but by now i was building the FP brick by brick because the chances to get two leaders in a relatively short time were dimming turn by turn.

By 190 AD, Monty was playing OCC in Tlaxcala, which was under heavy attack by the Persians. It was basically over, but my original plan of a very fast domination victory had became a pipe dream. The last two attacks (hill, muskets) have been successful, but at a cost of devastating losses. To give an idea, at the beginning of the American campaign i was paying almost 100 gpt in upkeep. By now i was paying zero and with a good margin of growth, but only because i lost so many units that i couldn't even replace them. My actual military force was so shrunk that i couln't even think of capturing Scandinavia (let alone the other AS) without reinforcements. Actually, i doubt that i could even defend myself at that point, in case Persia or China had decided to sneak-attack me.

The irony was that, once again, no enemy city flipped back. All those recapture units could have been used on the battlefront to speed up the victory, but once again how can you know?

Anyway, that's the turn when i decided to change plan and pursue a scientific victory.

The prospect of a space victory seemed more palatable at that point. Persia was in the middle of its golden age, while China and India has already had it, thanks to wonders. All of them were researching fast, and even Germany was becoming an important player, because Navigation was already known and they could trade for luxuries. My situation wasn't bad either, because i could profit of the slightly backward state of Scandinavia to buy a tech and trade for another. That's how i got Gunpowder (China) and Education (Scandinavia).

I signed peace with OCC Monty, in return for Chemistry, and gifted the 2 Aztec cities on the west coast to Persia. The timing was perfect because, in the interturn, Persia finally took over the last Aztec cities and Monty was gone. In 210 AD, i used the previously extorted tech to buy Astronomy from Scandinavia.

In 260 AD i bought a half-researched Banking from China and Navigation from Scandinavia, then i lauched the Viking campaign. It went well at first, but then the RNG decided to turn against me. First, here cometh the SOUR at the gates of Copenaghen, that i could overcome anyway thanks to raw numbers, but not without triggering their Golden Age thanks to a dud knight losing badly while attacking a berserk. Then, i moved my stack of knights on a hill 2 tiles away from Trondheim, thinking to be safe. Alas, it was the wrong hill because it was in the range of the Viking SoD, but again how could i know? One by one, a swarm of maces and berserks showed up and layed waste on my knights. Result: one third of my force killed and not a single unit escaping some injury. It was a BIG setback, that halted my attack for several turns. On the bright side, finally some of the surviving knights got elite promotions. Maybe the first leader of the game wasn't too far away.

By 370 AD i finally managed to capture Trondheim. Also the first leader finally came, and i used it to move the capital to Copenaghen, at the center of an already formed RCP-5 ring. My plight seemed over... except it wasn't. Next turn, outside Bergen, here cometh the SOUR again, and this time my attack failed, leaving inside a single redlined elite pukeman. Needless to say, the city had barracks and next turn it was 2 pukemen, one elite and one veteran, at full strength. They took out 2 more knights before succumbing. Geez. Ok, it wasn't supposed to be an easy game, but when enough will be enough?

The rest of the campaign went on without much hassle, and by 440 AD the Vikings were gone. However, the situation was far from simple, because of the ferocious tech pace. Both Persia and China had entered the Industrial Ages by the late 300's. Meanwhile, in 400 AD i had completed ToG and traded Magnetism with India and Metallurgy with Germany, therefore everyone was in the Industrial Ages (except for the dying Scandinavia). Now you can guess what the free picks were. Think bad. Now think worse. Here you are: both Persia and Germany got Nationalism :mad:

At this point of the IA, every AS is guaranteed to go for Nationalism unless it already knows it. And as it's always the case, the more AS do know it, the less it costs for the others to research it. My plan was to invade India ASAP and to take over all i could before they had a chance to produce riflemen, and then take it to the end anyway, but by now such a scenario seemed unlikely, for several reasons: first, the two SOURs had taken a heavy toll on my military, and once again i needed to bring reinforcements before going on; second, India was likely to get riflemen sooner than expected; third: my border with Persia was far from safe, and there were a pair of cities in range for a direct attack with knights, so i had to divert part of the production into muskets and knights that couldn't be used in the Indian front.

In case you may wonder, in my past games Persia has always tried to catch me pants down, often more than once in a single game, so i was taking for granted that they would sneak-attack at some point.

Now, brace yourselves: in the interturn immediately following the demise of Scandinavia, India signed a MPP with China :mad:

Yes, of all their possible choices, they picked China, the only AS with attackers at 3 movement points instead of two. Now, the moment i would step into Indian territory, China would autodeclare and all my border cities would be prone to a direct attack by raiders. And even if they would withstand them, the bulk of Chinese forces would follow suit, and i'd have to fight on two fronts at the same time, one of which would involve both produced and drafted riflemen in size 7+ cities. With my best attacker unit still being the knight, and my best defender units still being the musketman. Needless to say, my forces weren't nowhere near the necessary numbers to hold up against China and conquer India quickly.

Ok, by now it was evident that this game was cursed, and i had to suck it up and go on anyway.

What could i do? Nothing but stop the expansion, rebuild my military once again and consolidate. Wait, my goal was space so i had to use part of the resources to optimize my empire and increase my research potential, which i did. A dim of light came from research: i had completed Medicine, started on Steam Power and traded it half-way with Persia. This move also netted me Nationalism (from India) and Military Tradition (from Germany). Ahh, much better now: riflemen in the border cities, cavalry units for faster and stronger attacks, and railroads to bring in reinforcements at zero time.

By 630 AD, the MPP bewteen India and China had expired, and they decided to scrap it. In the same time, India signed another MPP, but with Germany instead. No problem with that, war started immediately and my forces took immediate gains in Indian territory. However, pretty soon i had to face the dreaded riflemen and started to take losses once again. An elite victory produced the second leader, which five turns later was used for Theory of Evolution. My picks were Atomic Theory and Electronics, that i used to trade for Rep Parts, Corporation and Sanitation. Infantry and artillery, at the end, exactly what i needed to keep my front safe. For now.

By 760 AD India was gone and all i had to do from now on was optimizing and consolidating... or not? A few turns later, the Persian sneak-attack finally came, but for that time i was strong enough to deter it and use it as a tool for elite fishing. Then, Persia signed in China. Mhh... Beijing had so many useful wonders... what if? :D And so, i made peace with Persia and started picking on China. Metroes defended by infantry units, with the best attacker being the cavalry, not exactly an even fight, but there's a catch: artillery. With repeated shelling i bombed the metroes down to size 6 or less, and then i stormed them with cavalry attacks. It took 4 turns of bombing for Beijing to fall, and no less that 30 cavalry attacks, but in 960 AD it was owned. Smith, Bach's and Sun Tzu were mine, and these 3 wonders combined were worth more than 100 gps in free maintainance.

By 1020 AD China was gone, and in order to not trigger an unwanted Domination i gifted part of it to Persia. In the very same turn i reached the Modern Ages, and this time the picks were favourable: Ecology for Persia and Rocketry for Germany. I went for Computers and Miniaturization, and with those two techs i could trade for the freebies plus Fission and Synthetic fibers. An ill-fated sneak-attack by Germany netted me the 3rd leader of the game, which i used to build the United Nations (only for denial purposes) while the Internet and Seti were built brick by brick, with the help of previous prebuilds. Other techs i researched were Nuclear Power, Laser and Robotics while everything else was provided by Persia. In 1315 AD i'm one turn away from Robotics. In the interturn, i trade for Satellites, switch the 2 remaining prebuilds and launch.

The end result is a Spaceship victory in 1320 AD, with 11012 Firaxis and 10917 Jasons. What to say? A lot of things went horribly wrong, but there was never a dull moment in this game. Deity is always worth playing.
 
thank you for that great write-up!
t_x
 
I hope you all had a great time playing this game. While making the Deity Pangaea, I had more than expected a bloodbath with alliances and AI wars being crucial to extend the time for MWs. It looks like templar_x was the only one who played it all using MWs. While play testing, the games lasted pretty long and once I crushed a civ, a feeling of quick relief followed, perhaps because this was only my third Deity Pangaea attempt. This game, I had hoped, would basically be cavs vs defence, Knights vs defense or MW vs defence or a combination of the 3 whatever victory one pursued. The Americans grew too much and I'll have to admit, I didn't consider the possibility of them getting a town from a Hut which perhaps made the game a bit tougher. I wanted this game to be a bit of a challenge to the still remaining veterans of the GOTM community (especially since the last few games (COTM and GOTM) were scaled down to Emperor, monarch and below and we had regent coming up) and I hope the outcome was just what I wanted- a game to actually make one sit back and plan for the tiniest of things. Finally, thanks to all those who played and to those who took the time to make notes and share their experiences here. I hope everyone enjoyed.
 
In terms of "attack value per shield" you may be right that MWs are the most effective unit, but I think the following factor may reduce the practical value a bit:
the losses however were enormous, with a few SOURs in the game, and only in the last few turns i made it to 100+ MWs.
--> War weariness and unit upkeep! For me, using MWs would have resulted in a much higher war weariness and also in higher unit upkeep and consequently in much less gold available for rushing settlers/units in distant areas. True, I had to invest a bit of gold in getting to MT, but I think it was less than what I saved by being able to run 0-10% lux for most of the game thanks to relatively "limited" war weariness. (Especially as I was able to trade 1-2 of the required techs from the AI and did a 40-turn run somewhere inbetween for another tech. So the investment was not that big.)


Oddly enough, no American city flipped back, but how can you know?

...

Add to that the fact that, by that time, Aztecia had become a cultural monster and the chances of a flip were high.

...

The irony was that, once again, no enemy city flipped back. All those recapture units could have been used on the battlefront to speed up the victory, but once again how can you know?

No wonder there were no culture flips in your game: they were all in templar's and my game... :(

What to say? A lot of things went horribly wrong, but there was never a dull moment in this game. Deity is always worth playing.

I can fully support that. Excellent game and a real challenge! :goodjob:
(And great writeup, tR1cKy!)
 
using MWs would have resulted in a much higher war weariness and also in higher unit upkeep

i don´t think so. at least normally. after the American campaign, the unit upkeep was negligible. at least after the Aztecs it was zero for the rest of the game. and WW usually is no Problem, if you prepare your wars well on Deity and finish them fast. you know that of course (but say otherwise :)). in this game, with my probably worst Deity warring in a long time, I indeed had some WW issues, especially against America. however, with a better preparation (and less bad luck) i am positive that my date of victory over the Yanks would have been similar to tricky´s. i don´t believe that i could have even reached MT in time before the game could have been won then, least that it would have had a positive impact in case i would have reached MT...
but really, a very enjoyable game, even if quite hurried in my case.
t_x
 
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