GOTM103 - First Spoiler

[civ_steve]

GOTM 103 - First spoiler, the Ancient Age

Reading Requirements:

1. Must be able to research a Middle Ages Technology.

Posting restrictions

1. Feel free to discuss distant contacts and trades, but be discreet about locations or directions of any AI.
2. No discussion of middle-ages (or later) including resource locations.
3. AS ALWAYS, do not post Spoiler information for ANY other 'X'OTM contest.

I'm curious to see how this goes. Small map, pangaea, with an aggressive early UU such as the Mounted Warrior ... if there's horses nearby , there could be lots of early victories! How'd your game go?

 

[templar_x]

the setting sure was up for an AA victory, so i guess most of us will have their full story here. that´s mine:

open class
conquest victory in 710bc

opening moves:
move scout and see 2nd wheat, so move worker to wheat and settler 1s. found in 3950bc.

build order:
warrior-granary-settler-worker-settler-worker-settlers

log:
3800 see 3rd lux and game
3700 see 4th lux
3600 meet Aztecs. no deal.
3300 pop a deserted hut, see 5th lux (the 4th one close-by)
3250 2nd hut gives useless maps
3050 3rd hut gives BW; Alpha in
3000 meet America, they already have 60g; meet Egypt. trade. granary in.
2750 first settler. 4-turner up at size 4-6. there is no really convincing site for the 2nd city, i decide for 3sw and thus rcp3 for the inner ring.
2630 meet Greece.
2590 found 2nd town. trade for TW and see horses nearby.
2430 found 3rd town 3nw. IW is already around. see barbs.
2230 Writing in – CoL next
2150 meet France, they´re backwards. 4th town 2w.
1990 5th town 3ne.
1950 buy an Aztec worker
1870 buy a French worker
1830 found 6th town 3se.
1750 CoL in, Philo next
1675 7th town by the horses, 3s1sw
1650 lose a turn on a settler due to carelessness
1625 buy another French worker, connect horses
1600 9th town 2n
1450 9th town 3e1se
1325 declare on Aztecs, kick off GA
1250 enter Rep. stop research.
1125 Aztecs destroyed
1100 get WH from Yanks

qsc 1000bc:
13 cities (1st)
42 pop (1st)
114 tiles (1st)
5 workers, 9 slaves, 5 warriors, 29 MWs
Maths+Poly missing
5 rax

850 Egypt destroyed
825 Yanks gone
750 Greeks gone
730 France destroyed

i had 5 elite victories, but no leader.

i believe this was my personal fastest conquest ever. but since Lanzelot announced a victory around qsc-time, i fear i can hardly expect to make it into the top half of the board
i could have built even more roads. but what i think i did well is the coordination of the demise of the opponent civs. the last two civs left the game within 2 turns.

templar_x

 

[Lanzelot]

I saw the new thread and said to myself, "wow for once I won't be the last to post his spoiler, but the first". But templar beat me...

Did I really predict a victory around QSC time? If so, then certainly not for me, but for you guys... I think it should have been pretty clear from my recent posts (as well as from looking at the Eptathlon table) that I would be going for the space ship this game! (Last missing VC.)

So far the game went quite well. Like templar_x I settled 1S, set up the 4-turner and settled 10 towns at RCP4. (Wanted a wider spaced core this time for better research in the industrial/modern age.)
Despite this being only Regent, the AIs contributed quite a few good tech deals. I didn't take notes (can look up the exact numbers in the CivAssist archive, if someone is interested), but the important dates were like:
ca 1300BC enter Republic
ca 1100BC enter MA

At the moment I'm halfway through the MA and I think it is even possible to enter the IA before 10AD?! I managed to get 4-turn research for the last 2-3 ancient age techs, and originally planned to trigger my GA with a Mounted Warrior right after entering the MA, so that I can continue 4-turn research during the GA. However, I didn't pay attention and accidentally triggered my GA by building the Colossus two turns before entering the MA. (This is already my third GOTM, where I didn't notice that one wonder already had all necessary traits for the GA...!) Well, no big deal. I collected some money and can use it for deficit research after the GA.

On the military side I kept peace with everyone except the Aztecs, which I wanted to conquer right when entering the MA. But as the GA had already started prematurely, I took their towns around 1200BC-1100BC. Their land is going to be the second core. There is a little problem, however: no leader yet... The original core is so good that I don't want to do a palace jump this time. I will declare war on the Americans and the French shortly, not for taking their towns, but for leader fishing. The barb camps gave me many elite Mounted Warriors already, so I hope for once I will have luck with a leader, when I need it most...

Also bad luck was that the Aztecs, despite having good lands, did not setup anything resembling a core... Stupid duffers...! I will need to build my own cities around Tenochtitlan.
The Greeks and the Egyptians are doing quite well and I will keep them around until the end of the game. Perhaps they will contribute at least 2-3 more techs in the long run (in addition to Greeks two free techs).

An interesting twist, which is probably due to the fact that I played farmer's gambit for quite a while (I think I even built the granary before any military unit?! But can't remember exactly.): the first two huts that I popped, gave me: a town and a worker! (Both on the opposite end of the Pangea, of course...)
I thought popping towns and settlers was disabled for the GOTM competition?!

Lanzelot

 

[templar_x]

sorry if i have miquoted you, Lanzelot. maybe it was Paul who talked about those finish dates...

templar_x

 

[Megalou]

Settled 1SW. This gives room for two towns on river at RCP 3.
Researching The Wheel, hoping to trade Alphabet.
Building 2 scouts, warrior, granary (2750), settler,...

In 3400 we have already spotted 6 different luxuries. And the starting position is certainly luxurious.

In 3050 we bought an American worker for Alphabet.
2850 - Bought worker from France.
2710 - Whipped temple in Niagra Falls (access to deer in 5 turns; no 2-food tile in radius before this)
2590 - Traded worker from Greece.
2430 - Connected silks.
2390 - Settled Grand River on incense. (RCP4 was chosen.)
2230 - Sold contact with America to France for 52 gold. Their nearest towns are 2 tiles from each other. The American starting scout must be on drugs. In fact, the Americans have no contacts with the other AI at all at this point.
2070 - Connected incense to Salamanca.
1950 - Bought an Aztec worker.
1450 - Connected horses.
1325 - We learn about the republic and become a republic the same year, via The Big Picture.
1275 - Upgraded 7 warriors.
1225 - Gave Phil, CoL, Republic to Aztecs. Declared w 10 swordsmen.
1225 - Golden Age was started. The golden age was soon to include one 15 shield city and 4 10 shield towns.
1000 - ROP with America, roading in Washington territory.
975 - Peace with Aztecs. 4 towns were gain (1 in peace treaty.)
950 - War on Egypt. Met Super Spearman who caused three veteran mounted warriors to retreat without getting a scratch himself.
875 - Thebes captured. It has good roads. Directing MWs towards France instead of Greece until roads around Egypt are completed.
550 - War on Greece. Hurried 20 temples, 2 settlers.
530 - A great leader appears as Egypt's last town is captured, and hurries the Oracle. The last French town is captured. Some more settlers are hurried (workers joined, other units disbanded for shields.) Because almost all towns have temples now, hurrying more settlers after this will not affect my chances to reach domination when the temples expand.
470 - A barb comes running on the America road and destroys one of my settlers! Where was the escort? Sleeping in his bed as I should have been doing? Another settler is able to settle right next to a barb.
450 - Expansion. Missed domination limit by 4 tiles!
430 - DomCon victory. I really had in mind to go for conquest but I just have a problem with razing towns. Once I started to wait for some size 1 towns to grow, there was no way back.

QSC: 13 towns, 37 pop, 152 tiles, 13 workers, 1 archer, 10 swordsmen (mostly upgraded regulars,) 12 mounted warriors, 1 temple, 1 granary, . 15 techs, incl republic.


Pops:
3700 - Popped a town.
3400 - Popped a map.
3250 - Popped WC.
3100 - Popped 25 gold.
2950 - Popped map.
2850 - Popped 25 gold.
2800 - Popped HB
2190 - Popped nothing.
2030 - Popped map.
1910 - Popped map.

Contacts:
3600 - America.
3500 - Aztecs.
3250 - Egypt.
3200 - France.
2590 - Greece.

Research, pops and trades:
R The Wheel, 3300
P WC, 3250
T BW, Masonry, 3250
T Alphabet (1 turn researched), 3200
T Mysticism, 2850
R Writing, 2550
P HB, 2800
T IW, 2230
R Philosophy, 2230
R CoL, 1790
R Republic, 1325 > Research off.
T Map Making, ? (Traded when I dumped Republic on one of the AI. By the way I think it is better to give them Monarchy - if you have it - when you go for domination because the war weariness they develop from being eaten up seems to keep their last towns from growing past size 1.)

Conquest in BC time is a so called hyperbole - an exaggeration to get one's point across. Templar_x's date is formidable as was the last all time fastest conquest victory. Congratulations!

Thanks also for a great game, civ_steve.

QSC core, final minimap:

 

[templar_x]

congratulations on that awesome ConDom date, Megalou!

when you say ConDom (and insist to call it DomCon) in your game, i understand that you had loads of troops outside the last AI town when you reached domination, as visible on the miniscreen. so for the game it´s a domination victory, right?

from your log, i must address that your mm and gaming skills are incredible!

but then, it is that both of you popped a town?!?! i trust that this option must be disabled in my game. can you imagine me trying to find the right switch to turn this on again???? ---

templar_x

 

[templar_x]

@ Lanzelot - only popping settlers is disabled for XOTMs. popping towns and workers only is disabled for the templar guy...

templar_x

 

[Megalou]

when you say ConDom (and insist to call it DomCon) in your game, i understand that you had loads of troops outside the last AI town when you reached domination, as visible on the miniscreen. so for the game it´s a domination victory, right?

Yes. Thanks for clarifying this.

As for the town, you did not build any scouts and perhaps you were penalized for this - and rewarded with an earlier granary.

If you look at my screenshot, you will see the position of the pop (Niagra Falls). Did you by any chance miss this hut?

 

[templar_x]

i saw the town, and in fact i did not envy you that one too much

probably it would not have had any relevance for conquest. what can you really use well? a popped tech towards Rep, a nearby town and a worker. altoghether, not very likely. i did not want to waste shields on scouts for maps, gold and a 1st tier tech.

indeed, i missed the hut you mentioned. but there you imply that i would have got a town as well if i had popped it. do huts work that way? i thought, the result of popping a hut is calculated by the RNG... not?

templar_x

 

[Lanzelot]

indeed, i missed the hut you mentioned. but there you imply that i would have got a town as well if i had popped it. do huts work that way? i thought, the result of popping a hut is calculated by the RNG... not?

I think it is. I got my town from a different hut than Megalou's Niagara Falls: it was in the utmost N-W corner of the continent. (My first scout went straight west through the Aztec territory.)

 

[Memento]

A very nice Game with fast End.
Have only 4 own Towns.I would build Chariots,but the Scout found HR so i build MW and have an very early GA.

2900 war with Egypt
1725 war with Atztecs->GA
1425 war with America->Leader->Army
1350 Monarchie-stop research
1300 Atztecs gone
1225 war with France
1200 GA Ends
1150 2nd war with Egypt
1125 America gone


qsc 1000bc:
8 towns
22 pop
93 tiles
3 workers, 10 slaves, 3 warriors, 19 MWs,1 Army with 3 MWs
1 Granary,1 Barrack
73g,18gpR
Egypt 3 towns,France 1,Greece 5


975 2nd Leader->Army
925 France gone
875 Egypt gone
??? Greece gone

 

[Megalou]

Have only 4 own Towns.

i saw the town, and in fact i did not envy you that one too much

probably it would not have had any relevance for conquest.

You conquest masters are something special. I'm glad I stayed out. I take it you didn't even wait for your workers to build roads.

??? Greece gone

This new "close race" thing is really positive for this competition. Sometimes. The question is if templar_x is bombarding Memento with private messages as we post.

 

[Lanzelot]

...
1425 war with America->Leader->Army
...
975 2nd Leader->Army

It's already 260AD in my game, and still no leader
BTW, we need the next spoiler, I reached the Industrial Age already yesterday... (I will probably be the only one who's still playing after 500BC... So perhaps we just use this thread for all three spoilers...)

Lanzelot

 

[Memento]

This new "close race" thing is really positive for this competition. Sometimes. The question is if templar_x is bombarding Memento with private messages as we post.

All i can say

I can tell you it is a really close race.

but not so close as last time


It surprised me that you are all gone to rep.
mona needs only three techs.

It's already 260AD in my game, and still no leader

The 2nd Leader was nice but no longer important for my Game.
Ok,the 1st was useful.

 

[Megalou]

It surprised me that you are all gone to rep.
mona needs only three techs.

Domination requires some cash.

 

[templar_x]

The question is if templar_x is bombarding Memento with private messages as we post.

i'd never bombard another forum member with anything.

or, what is the bombard value for the private message unit again? if it is 0(4)/0/1 or better i could be tempted if the unit comes at fair costs

templar_x

 

[templar_x]

It surprised me that you are all gone to rep.
mona needs only three techs.

i surely should not have gone for Rep. my problem is, on low levels i simply cannot convince myself to engage in any serious planning. so i just played and went the typical path.

from your timeline, it really cannot be close, so i think you could post your finish date. you must have finished a couple of turns earlier. well done, Memento!

templar_x

 

[Memento]

A few turns-825bc

I have some luck that i captured 5 or 6 Worker in Washington and that America build a few Roads direction Greece.
So i can build the Main road very fast

 

[Memento]

i simply cannot convince myself to engage in any serious planning.

I think intensive planning is the only way to beat you.

 

[ignas]

3950 found Salamanca S from starting location; game crashes, reload from autosave
Capital built: worker 3650, granary 2850, 4 turn settlers
Scout goes out to find pottery, I start on Mysticism; scout went S then W
Technologies researched: Mysticism 3300, Polytheism 2270, Monarchy 1600
Contacts: Aztecs 3750, America 3600, Egypt 3350, Greece 3000, France 2030
3600 trade for Pottery
3350 buy worker from Egypt for Pottery, 15 gold and 2 gpt
3300 buy rest of Mysticism from America; get Wheel from hut
3050 buy worker from America for The Wheel, 2gpt and 3 gold
2550 build Niagara Falls
2390 build Grand River
2270 sell Lincoln Polytheism for 53 gold and 6 gpt (he has gpt since I borrowed gold for gpt from time to time from him)
2190 found Allegheny
2110 buy worker from Aztecs
2070 found Cattaraugus
1650 granary in Niagara Falls
1575 become Monarchy, turn off research; 2 barracks complete; gift everyone Monarchy
1225 trade for HB, upgrade 9 chariots to MW’s;
RoP Aztecs, preparing for RoP rape
1175 RoP everyone; RoP rape Aztecs and take Tenochtitlan, start Golden Age;
1100 capture Teotihuacan
1075 capture Texcoco; peace Aztecs for one more town
1025 DoW Aztecs, capture a town
1000 capture Tlaxcala; DoW Egypt, capture Elephantine
QSC stats:
21 (7 captured) town, 51 citizens, 226 tiles, 6 barracks, 2 granaries, 19 Mounted Warriors, 8 workers and 5 slaves, 1 settler
975 Elephantine flips back to Egypt
950 capture Thebes
925 peace Aztecs; capture Elephantine
900 capture Heliopolis
825 DoW America; capture Washington, Philadelphia, Boston, New York
800 capture Alexandria;
775 civ crashes, reload from autosave; take Memphis, Atlanta; French DoWs us, great;
750 capture Xochicalco, destroy Aztecs;
730 capture Orleans
710 capture Pi Ramesses and destroy Egypt
690 DoW Greece, capture Delphi;
670 capture Paris, Tours; revolt, will rush few temples while in Despotism
650 poprush 11 temples; capture Chicago and destroy America;
Capture Marseilles, Sparta;
630 capture Rheims
610 capture Corinth
570 capture Lyons, Athens;
550 Domination victory, but game crashes while watching game replay, so reload from 570 BC save and do same things.

Finished 78 tiles over Dom limit. Should have made the final push (went to Despotism and poprushed temples) 4-5 turns earlier.
Jason score was ~12900