Greek SG - Regent level

[Håkon]

Yndy - up next...

Then, I'm not sure. Dominix can't play, neither can smellincoffee, so it seems like mad-bax has to play.

So the list:
1. Yndy
2. mad-bax
3. Dominix ?
4. smellincoffee ??
5. Håkon
6. Wizard

Dominix (sorry, should have let you play the 2nd turn instead of Wizard) and smellincoffee are put in for sure if they post here again.

Sorry about this, it's a bit messy at the moment.

 

[Yndy]

Just spotted the save under the and started playing. I'll post some comments on your moves later today.

Preturn: Move settler towards river in the West.


2510BC (2): Athens: Warrior -> Warrior. Warrior sent exploring the North. Game crashed three times when moving the Settler. This is very weird. Reboot. OK, I used PTW instead of Civ3.

2470BC (3): Barb wondering throught the jungle. Sparta founded; builds warrior. Worker sent to Irrigate the cow.

2430BC (4): Athens: Warrior -> Warrior. Warrior sent exploring the South.

2390BC (5): Hoplite kills barb near Athens. Research decreased to 90% as we ran out of money.

2350BC (6): Athens: Warrior -> Granary. Warrior sent to explore the West.

2310BC (7): Barb approaches Sparta. Worker sent to connect Athens and Sparta.

2270BC (8): Sparta: Warrior -> Worker. Warrior kills barb. Another barb closes in on Sparta. Barb camp spotted in the South

2230BC (9): Warrior kills barb.

2190BC (10): Warrior razes barb camp and gets 25g.

We need to build the Granary in Athens and then build Settlers there.
Sparta should have a warrior garrison but I wanted to take a look at the water SW of it.
Remember that our warriors will kill barbs most of the time if they attack but less often if they defend. Attack babs, don't let them attack you.

Click the smilies for the save: __

 

[Håkon]

Ok. How on earth we're gonna manage 20K win on this one, I don't know...but never mind.

Mad-bax - you're up.

Then:
I'm warming up (might take some time for me to finish - got training tonight + homework...)
Wizard
Yndy
Dominix ? (post when you can play, then you can jump straight in)
smellincoffee ?? (same applies to you)

 

[mad-bax]

Got it, but I won't be playing until this evening.
Is this going to be a 20K or 100k game? I don't mind either, but it will affect the way I play the turn.

 

[Dominix]

I have a few days off this week due to some teacher work sessions, so I should be free to take up the game after mad-bax finishes with it.

 

[Yndy]

Time for comments:
I have three points for Håkon and Wizard:
- not irrigating the cow; food is key in the early game
- lack of exploration; exploration is to be done as soon as possible
- excess defense in the beginning; two warriors could have replaced that Hoplite in any case.
You did good researching the Ceremonial Burial so that we could get an early temple. But I would have chosen Mysticism over Writing as Writing is hard to research at the beginning but becomes easier as we get 3-4 cities. For a 20K victory I would see us build the Oracle, The Great Library and the Hanging Gardens from the Ancient Age wonders.

 

[Håkon]

Points noted.

So the roster will then be:

1. mad-bax (playing tonight)
2. Dominix
3. Håkon
4. Wizard
5. Yndy

 

[Ankka]

Sorry, I thought of exploring with the hoplite, but forgot...

And, yes, I like those wonders too. Especially if we get the Oracle before 1000BC. Are we gonna make Athens our 20k city? I we are, then we'll lack the palace prebuild bonus... But we won't have any corruption/ waste... Oops, we will, but it'll be lesser anyway. Difficult choice...

 

[mad-bax]

Generally speaking, the ideal 20k city will be the second city, on a coast and river, with a variety of terrain types in its radius. It should be capable of producing enough food to support 20 citizens.

The ability to pre-build using a palace far outweighs other considerations. In our case, we need the capital to build settlers, hence Yndys direction to build a granary in it. We will also need a city to produce workers in order that we can join them to the 20k city to get the city to size 12 ASAP without the distraction of having to build a granary.

In the ancient age the 20K city needs to build temple, library, oracle, Great library, hanging gardens, forbidden palace and marketplace. Work out how many shields that is and you realise it is not do-able without at least one leader. So then we need cities with barracks to build offensive units for a very early war.
Once you consider that the two most productive cities will not contribute to unit production you will realise that a 20k objective is probably the most difficult victory condition to achieve.

EDIT: In my experience, getting the Oracle and GL will be fairly straightforward. Hanging Gardens will be difficult. Completion of the GL usually triggers a cascade to HG (and great wall to a lesser extent). So, realistically we need to either complete GL before the AI get monarchy, or get a leader.

Of course we don't have to build 3 AA wonders, but that would prolong the game.

 

[Ankka]

I think it'll be ok, with you and Yndy here telling us how to play.

 

[Smellincoffee]

This isn't an "I can play" post, but Best Buy called and said my machine was working, so I may be able to actually join this game tonight.

 

[Håkon]

Smellincoffee - should I put you in 3rd before me then? That means you'll probably play on Wednesday or Thursday.

mad-bax and Yndy - thanks a lot for the help For example, I have never bothered a lot with food in the early game No wonder I've never won anything above Warlord.

 

[Smellincoffee]

Just a warning, I wouldn't be able to play 'til late afternoon on both days.

 

[Yndy]

Well, frankly I thought that Athens will be our 20K city but I remember I did the same mistake before. In this case, I think Sparta has a pretty good location even if not coastal and we should switch the worker to temple right away. Athens will build the Granary, a couple of workers to improve Sparta, another settler, and then peel off workers to join Sparta.

To avoid the problems with Monarchy being discovered by the other AI, we should not research Polytheism.

 

[mad-bax]

Agreed. Though since a temple has already gone into Athens I wouldn't object strongly to Athens being the 20K city as long as we jump the palace fairly early and put the FP in it immediately afterwards.

Spitting out settlers whilst trying to keep the population up and making all the shields we need for the other improvements on top of having no obvious pre-build, make a reasonable arguement for not using the capital for the 20K city IMO.

I was speaking more in general terms than this game specifically, but I will play with a view to developing Sparta as the 20K site if everyone agrees.

 

[Håkon]

No objections here...frankly I was wondering how on earth we could manage to get all the shields in Athens - getting a mine on that mountain must take ages.

 

[Greebley]

One comment on your player order.

The way you have it right now, Madbax will often follow Yndy in play order. It might be better if the two experts were farther apart. That way they can comment more on the smaller micro-management details they notice in the preturn. You don't really need to know a lot about micro-management to win regent; still it is good to start learning about them for when you advance higher.

 

[Håkon]

Thanks Greebley - yes, I'll try to move mad-bax down the order for the next round (if that's OK with you, mad-bax?). That was in fact the plan, but because of not all players being available it turned out this way.

 

[mad-bax]

Hi Greebley

I agree, and once Dominix has finished his turn I would suggest the following play order...

1. SmellinCoffee
2. Hakon
3. Yndy
4. Wizard
5. Dominix
6. mad-bax

Wizard takes the hit I'm afraid. You OK with this Wiz?

 

[mad-bax]

2190BC: Pre-turn
Change Sparta from worker to temple

2150BC:
Continue exploration

2110BC:
Worker mines tile

2070BC:
Disperse barb camp for 25g

2030BC:
Warrior takes a detour to pop a hut
Slider adjusted. Writing due on inter-turn
Research set to Literature to make it possible to get Mysticism from the hut.

1990BC:
pop hut for barbs.
Research changed to Mysticism at 100% (-1gpt defecit, predicted 10 turns)

IBT:
Warrior survives barb attack and is promoted to elite.

Athens granary - worker. Tough call, but delaying the next settler by 2 turns to get a worker is necessary IMO.

1950BC:

Continued exploration.

1910BC:
Warrior kills barb, but is relined.

IBT:
Athens worker - settler

1870BC:
Redlined warrior ends up next to barb camp. He'll have to run away to survive.

1830BC:
Both workers start mines
Redlined warrior spots puple border.
Northern warrior spots hut

1790BC:
Western Warrior spots light blue borders
EOT

Here is our neighbourhood - roughly.

Here is the <<save>>.