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Growing a city to 200 pop - need advice

Discussion in 'Strategy Section' started by CommunistSquared, May 4, 2020.

  1. CommunistSquared

    CommunistSquared Chieftain

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    Just played a fun science victory game as India where I managed to grow the capital of Delhi to 120 pop (663 million inhabitants). I did not use internal food routes, my only luxury monopoly was salt (+10% growth), I didn't have a few food-related social policies, and I never converted the city's massive production to food. Considering all this, I'm convinced that a 200 pop city (2.7 billion inhabitants!) by turn ~500 is definitely possible if I try my best to min/max everything. Right now I'm figuring out the optimal strategy to achieve this. Currently I plan to do this on a hot Terra map (standard size with only 6 players to give me more room for growth, settler difficulty, chill barbarians), also using "Really Advanced Setup" mod to ensure I have the right resources. (painting a perfect custom map is too cheaty for me. Arbitrary, I know)

    Currently top map contender: https://imgur.com/a/BtXeeZH
    Still not 100% certain on this but it's the best generation I got after a dozen or so tries. (Workable resources: 10 wheat, 3 sugar, 3 lapis, 2 truffle piglets)

    Terrain: I'm assuming floodplains with wheat is the best overall food source? Unfortunately due to the distance and shape of the rivers along with no fresh water options in the desert, I won't be able to do any crazy food triangle setups (does the adjacency bonus even stack? as in will a farm completely surrounded by farms have +6 or only +2 food bonus?). If the adjacency bonus stacks then I will strongly consider rerolling the map for better floodplain coverage.

    Civilization: India seems like the best choice due to their UA (growth bonus from religious followers) and their unique building (+1 food from farms). I guess Aztec could also work with their decent unique building?

    Religion: I absolutely must have my own religion due to India's UA. I am conflicted when it comes to choosing the pantheon. Goddess of Fertility might seem like an obvious choice (+25% growth and +4 food) but when you consider that I have 10 workable wheat tiles, God of the Sun (+3 food from wheat) would provide me with an extra +30 food!!! Could this make more of a difference, especially early game? I plan to rush religion and choose divine inheritance (+20% capital city yield during golden age) as my founder belief and asceticism (+1 food for every follower, +15 food cap) as my first follower belief. Further upgrades will be mandir follower belief (+2 food, +10% food in city), medicancy enhancer belief(+2 food from internal trade routes, scaling with era). If I get around to choosing a reformation belief I'll probably do Faith of the Masses (purchase culture buildings with faith, they also get +2 culture).

    Social Policies: I plan to start by fully going through the Tradition branch (every single policy increases food and growth, otherwise decent early-game bonuses). Afterwards I'll move onto Fealty branch (unlocks monastery for +3 food), and unlock Nobility/Serfdom policies (+50% yields from internal routes). Then I'll unlock Imperialism branch for the Exploitation policy (+2 food from all farms) and Colonialism policy (+10% to sum, +3 to flat yields from global monopolies). I'll probably be at the ideology stage at that point, and I'm thinking that Order is the way to go (+20% growth, +5 food in all cities, +2 citizens in all cities, +200% food from internal trade routes). I could also go for Freedom (specialists consume less food, farms produce +2 food), but overall it feels a bit weaker.

    Resources/Corporations: This one is obvious, go for truffle/crab/salt/sugar/olive monopoly and TwoKay Foods corporation.

    Early-game Plan: Rush religion (shrine -> Stonehenge). Then go for early food-based wonders (Temple of Artemis and Hanging Gardens).

    TLDR
    • Are floodplains with wheat overall the best food source? Does the farm adjacency bonus stack?
    • Is India the best growth civ?
    • Goddess of Fertility or God of the Sun for pantheon (assuming 8+ wheat tiles)?
    • Order or Freedom as ideology?
    • Any other tips/advice appreciated
     
    vyyt likes this.
  2. CommunistSquared

    CommunistSquared Chieftain

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    just managed to generate this god-tier starter. this is going to be the one.
     
    Last edited: May 5, 2020
    vyyt and thunderbird_14 like this.
  3. Drakle

    Drakle Warlord

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    How did you get such starts? The most I get with Wheat was like 4 wheat near my capital.

    Yeah, I'd go with God of the Sun for the early boost. You would be multiple eras ahead of population over everybody else's capitals. Slightly weak on production, but specialists and hills will be good enough.

    And at least you have a couple of oasis for freshwater to give surrounding farms the adjacency bonus.

    4nIpE1N.png

    You can build farms in the tiles I marked in blue. So a lot of the Wheat tiles can get adjency from more than just the the floodplain tiles.

    The hills and flat desert that doesn't help with adjacency would be where you put your Great Person Tile Improvements. Tradition gives them a food, so they are the best improvement for hills and flat desert.

    1 food from every 2 farm tiles. So a tile surrounded by farms would be 3+ food, since there are 6 tiles possible adjacency.

    You have some full surround tiles, particularly that southern fork. Remember that you can build farms on desert next to an oasis. Those farms won't really be worth working but can offer adjacency.

    Not sure if Mandirs are needed as a religious belief. This is about growing one city as tall as possible, so grabbing Angkor Wat will give a Mandir in your capital and allows picking a different belief to speed something else. Angkor Wat is such an early wonder, that you can grab it alongside your new religion. I'd go with something else. Cooperation is the only other belief to give food directly, and you will be birthing a lot of new citizens.

    Also in terms of Reformation Beliefs, Holy Land
    Would be the only one to directly give food. +50% food from maritime civs. Thought Faith of the Masses would boost the Holy Cities happiness.


    Also aside from Internal food routes, international trade routes to civs that you are tourism influential over, can give you a percentage based food boost (modelling immigration). And of course, lump sums of food can be rewarded by city-state quests (though not that much). So grabbing trade routes would be key.
     
    Last edited: May 5, 2020
  4. Stalker0

    Stalker0 Baller Magnus

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    So lets look at the usual suspects:

    1) Temple of Artemis, the food bonus will be exceptionally useful to you.

    2) Mandirs: More food!

    3) Ally with every food CS you can.

    4) Save that medical lab until the very very end. It can probably give you your last 2 population.

    5) Freedom might be a tempting choice, but I think order has the strongest growth you need with the +2 population tenant. When your at the crazy food requirements of 100+ pop....I don't think any amount of food is going to offset the power of free population.

    6) Don't forget that local happiness also adds to growth. So keep your unhappiness at rock bottom...use public works if you have to.

    If you want to post your saved game of the start, this might be a fun challenge to try!:)
     
    Drakle likes this.
  5. azum4roll

    azum4roll King

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    With all those percentage bonus on food and growth, even a +2 food can give like +20. Don't forget to keep the city happy, since that offers a growth bonus too.
     
  6. CommunistSquared

    CommunistSquared Chieftain

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    Ended up going with Goddess of Fertility as my pantheon and Mandirs as a follower belief. Figured would work better late-game. Did waste quite a bit of production on wartime efforts in order to ensure resource monopolies. This is turn 300, just reached 100 pop. Looks like 200 pop might take a while.
     
    vyyt and InkAxis like this.
  7. Phosphoraptor

    Phosphoraptor Chieftain

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    This might be a bit late, but trade routes to civs you are more influential over also boost growth. Influential/dominant levels can give 100+% growth!
     
    CommunistSquared likes this.
  8. CommunistSquared

    CommunistSquared Chieftain

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    better late than never! I still have at least 250 turns to go. this is really going to help

    also, is it just me, or does VP crash a LOT during late-game?
     
  9. CommunistSquared

    CommunistSquared Chieftain

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    50 turns later. That is an absolutely jaw-dropping food yield.... Growing 1 citizen per turn, even at 139 pop. This is gonna take less turns than I expected, which is great because at this point each turn takes like 5 minutes. Total empire-wide population is 2.1 billion, next in line is Korea with a whopping 18 million.
     
    SuperNoobCamper likes this.
  10. CommunistSquared

    CommunistSquared Chieftain

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    It is done. Turn 426. 40k food per turn.
     
  11. tothePAIN

    tothePAIN Prince

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    Wow. Impressive.
     
  12. InkAxis

    InkAxis Warlord

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    That's amazing! What difficulty were you playing on? And are you going to continue this game?
     
  13. CommunistSquared

    CommunistSquared Chieftain

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    Settler difficulty. Doubt I'll continue since I have cultural domination, overwhelmingly powerful forces and all the techs researched. Victory is assured. Might play a few more turns just to see how much further I can increase the food yield
     
  14. Stalker0

    Stalker0 Baller Magnus

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    What a beautiful city.....nuke it! :p
     
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