I would like at least some kind of defender in our towns. Archers are cheap to build. That is why I would build some.
Handy 25 AWP Persian Oppressors
- Thread starter handy900
- Start date
handy900
Deity
Immortals cost the same as archers and have a 50% bonus to them so we can use them as city defenders verus AI archers. Their mobility is a big plus as a defender also. If we start chopping immortals asap we should be able to pillage and stagnate the AI before they have the time & techs to build enough good units (axmen) to pose any real threat to our cities. If the AI was aggressive and streamed units at us like in C3 we would need to be worried. As long as we immortal rush their capitals we should be okay without archers.
Sir Bugsy
Civ.D.
A Bugsy update - I am on my second attempt at downloading the patch. For some reason I lost the internet connection on the first attempt, so I lost an hour's time there. I have 15 minutes left on my second attempt. After this, the playing will be easy.
Sir Bugsy
Civ.D.
Pre-flight – (1625 BC) Well first I have to get the patch. The loading time is about 10% of what it was. And the game is so much smoother to play. I like it. No changes to our city.
IBT – Our immortal in the woods kills three Incan Quechuas and earns two promotions.
Persepolis: barracks=>immortal=>immortal
1525 – Our first immortal finally gets into Japanese lands and begins to pillage.
1425 – We reach the Japanese city of Osaka with our second Immortal and we kill a defending warrior.
BW=>IW We revolt to slavery.
1400 – I kill the defending warrior and Osaka is rubble.
1375 – Kill a Japanese archer.
1350 – Kill a Quechua.
IBT – Immortal=>immortal
1325 – Kill another Japanese archer and we’re able to move forward for some suppression.
1300- Move an immortal off towards the Incas.
IBT – Kill an Indian warrior. Forrest chop gets us an immortal.
1250 – Start pillaging in Indian lands. I have lost track of the number of turns I have played. I think it is 16, but 1250 BC is a traditional stopping point, so I’ll stop here.
Here’s the situation in Japan:
And here are our fierce troops approaching Delhi:
Save: http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads10/H25_AWP_BC-1250.Civ4SavedGame
IBT – Our immortal in the woods kills three Incan Quechuas and earns two promotions.
Persepolis: barracks=>immortal=>immortal
1525 – Our first immortal finally gets into Japanese lands and begins to pillage.
1425 – We reach the Japanese city of Osaka with our second Immortal and we kill a defending warrior.
BW=>IW We revolt to slavery.
1400 – I kill the defending warrior and Osaka is rubble.
1375 – Kill a Japanese archer.
1350 – Kill a Quechua.
IBT – Immortal=>immortal
1325 – Kill another Japanese archer and we’re able to move forward for some suppression.
1300- Move an immortal off towards the Incas.
IBT – Kill an Indian warrior. Forrest chop gets us an immortal.
1250 – Start pillaging in Indian lands. I have lost track of the number of turns I have played. I think it is 16, but 1250 BC is a traditional stopping point, so I’ll stop here.
Here’s the situation in Japan:
And here are our fierce troops approaching Delhi:
Save: http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads10/H25_AWP_BC-1250.Civ4SavedGame
handy900
Deity
Roster
1. Handy -
2. Greebley -
3. ThERat -
4. Sir Bugsy -
5. LKendter - UP
I've never reolted to slavery since I seldom whip cities to finish a build. Is there another reason to revolt? Not being critical here, just trying to understand if there is a benefit I'm missing. Good call to attack a city defended by a warrior.
If a city is defended by archers I usually like an attack ratio of 2 to 1. Thus for a 2 archer garrison attack with 4 immortals. Worst case the first round of attacks lose, but wound the archer. The second wave can then finish them off.
If a city has a new lux/resource or provideds borders on the way to the front we should consider keeping it. Otherwize rubble.
Main goal now is to find each capital, pillage it and sentry the archer in forest nearby where he can move out each turn to make sure no settlers or improvements are boing made. Any non capital city will also need an oppressor, but capitals are prioruty #1.
Once we have the AI locked down tight we can build an attack stack to begin taking cities.
Chop all the forrest for fast rax, workers, settlers, immortals.
Sir Bugsy
Civ.D.
It was only one turn of anarchy so I went for it. I didn't think we planned on whipping our people, I just thought it would be better to have something other than the basic civics. Wouldn't be the first time I've been wrong, and it certainly won't be the last. There are a lot of things I need to learn about this new game.
Sir Bugsy
Civ.D.
Did I mess up posting the game? Please let me know. 
Well of course you're going to let me know. 
Well of course you're going to let me know. 
- Joined
- Aug 15, 2001
- Messages
- 20,074
Sir Bugsy said:Did I mess up posting the game? Please let me know.
The problem was late night my wi-fi connection went to wi-try. I did eventually get the file.
- Joined
- Aug 15, 2001
- Messages
- 20,074
http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads10/H25AWPBC-1000.zip
1250 BC
It seems so weird to play an AW game and have the whole map exposed. This goes so against my minimal map exploring from my Civ3 AW days.
This early in the game there isn't much to review, so no changes.
(IT) Japan throws away an archer.
1225 BC
India loses a warrior.
1200 BC
(IT) Even our warrior can kill an archer on defense.
1175 BC
The pillaging campaign begins at Cuzco. It also begins at Delhi.
1050 BC
Pillaging begins at Tenochtitlan.
(IT) I see the first barbarian warrior. Will this map get flooded with barbarian cities?
==========================
Summary:
Immortals seem broken with AW. I expect Handy to wipe Delhi off the map.
Roster
1. Handy - (currently playing)
2. Greebley - (on deck)
3. ThERat -
4. Sir Bugsy -
5. LKendter -
1250 BC
It seems so weird to play an AW game and have the whole map exposed. This goes so against my minimal map exploring from my Civ3 AW days.
This early in the game there isn't much to review, so no changes.
(IT) Japan throws away an archer.
1225 BC
India loses a warrior.
1200 BC
(IT) Even our warrior can kill an archer on defense.
1175 BC
The pillaging campaign begins at Cuzco. It also begins at Delhi.
1050 BC
Pillaging begins at Tenochtitlan.
(IT) I see the first barbarian warrior. Will this map get flooded with barbarian cities?
==========================
Summary:
Immortals seem broken with AW. I expect Handy to wipe Delhi off the map.
Roster
1. Handy - (currently playing)
2. Greebley - (on deck)
3. ThERat -
4. Sir Bugsy -
5. LKendter -
ThERat
Deity
Maybe as handy suggested, thisa can be taken at monarch difficulty. or, to have a nicer challenge, use a different Civ which makes it a tougher game. but an archer rush with GOS should also be possible.
handy900
Deity
Just one of many tactics that worked well for C3 but hurts you in C4 because of how the AI reacts. Given that so many civs have or build scouts in C4 it's hard to avoid meeting everyone unless they are across the ocean.
I got it.
handy900
Deity
Not flooded, but the barbs will have the best units (swords and axe-men) so we need to watch for that. I've yet to see a barb spear. I wonder if they make them.
Turn 1 980
We take Delhi and 128 gold.
Worker starts chopping a rax.
Turn 2 960
Locate Bombay
Turn 3 940
Pillage Tenochtitlan
Turn 4 920
Pillage
Turn 5 900
Kyoto is locked down
Turn 6 880
Aztecs have a settler and 2 archers loose. Perhaps we can intercept.
Turn 7 860
Silly archer at Bombay suicides on our immortal sentry.
Kill one of the archer escorts.
Half a rax chopped at Delhi.
Turn 8 840
The Aztecs founded a second city on a hill before we could trap the settler.
Might be time for us to chop a settler and grab the ivory lux W of our capital. Roads for Immortals would be good also.Turn 9 820
Kill a warrior for the easy promotion.
Two Japanese archers are approaching the capital, so a immortal is sent to deal with them.
Turn 10 800
We enter classical era. Select Masonry.
Kill the 2 Japanese archers near the capital.
Monty has an archer & 2 warriors moving on Delhi, which should be no problem.
Start chopping a settler in the capital that can go and secure the ivory. The setter is in the queue after the immortal.
May want to also chop a second worker in the capital.
As soon as the barracks in Delhi is done you can chop all the forest for quick immortals there to go and sentry the smaller secondary cities that have been founded to make sure no copper gets hooked up. We can’t afford to fight spears.
Exposed AI units on forest-free tiles offer easy promotions.
If you don't think we need another setter you can change the queue.
Roster
1. Handy -
2. Greebley - UP
3. ThERat -
4. Sir Bugsy -
5. LKendter -
FYI this is a good bit harder on a Regular sized map. If you have to found a second city to gain access to horses even more so.
I got it and will play this weekend.
Well I continued to build Immortals and to suppress the opposition. The AI totally doesn't know how to respond to this threat. This is one case where the AI in Civ3 is stronger than in Civ4, since the response of sending units towards the offending player means he has to defend.
Send more units to suppress Yellow AI. They have some cities with no suppression. I drew arrows in the picture below to show what I mean.
Be aware that the AI is next to our Iron (indicated in picture below)
I would be really suprised if the immortal didn't get an increase in cost in a patch. A speed 2 strength 4 unit that costs as much as an Archer to build is definitely unbalanced.
We got our Iron connected and starting to build a swordsman. We actually used Archery BTW. Since our new town didn't have horses, it was that or a Warrior.
Once we have some swords, I think we can go on the offensive.
Science is set to go straight for Catapults. Not sure if there are side techs that make more sense. Cats to lower city defenses will make it much easier to take out the AI. Right now the Archers in a city with +40 defense are too strong for us.
There were very few battles my turn.
We now have iron within the radius of the capitol We may want to connect it.
I would also build another worker or two.
Send more units to suppress Yellow AI. They have some cities with no suppression. I drew arrows in the picture below to show what I mean.
Be aware that the AI is next to our Iron (indicated in picture below)
I would be really suprised if the immortal didn't get an increase in cost in a patch. A speed 2 strength 4 unit that costs as much as an Archer to build is definitely unbalanced.
We got our Iron connected and starting to build a swordsman. We actually used Archery BTW. Since our new town didn't have horses, it was that or a Warrior.
Once we have some swords, I think we can go on the offensive.
Science is set to go straight for Catapults. Not sure if there are side techs that make more sense. Cats to lower city defenses will make it much easier to take out the AI. Right now the Archers in a city with +40 defense are too strong for us.
There were very few battles my turn.
We now have iron within the radius of the capitol We may want to connect it.
I would also build another worker or two.
handy900
Deity
Roster
1. Handy -
2. Greebley -
3. ThERat - up
4. Sir Bugsy -
5. LKendter -
Good point about using archery. We will have to remember that in future games.
Also agree with beeline for cats, although with a big enough stack of immortals we can suicide a few and take a capital.
1. Handy -
2. Greebley -
3. ThERat - up
4. Sir Bugsy -
5. LKendter -
Good point about using archery. We will have to remember that in future games.
Also agree with beeline for cats, although with a big enough stack of immortals we can suicide a few and take a capital.
ThERat
Deity
save
Pre-Turn
capital will finish settler in 2, but there is no unit to even protect the worker outside our borders, change to immortal in 3 first
we don't need nasty surprises here
Delhi is pop4 and at happy limit, MM and the sword build goes down to 6
I think we ought to go on the offense on flat land where odds are in our favor. swords will surely help
IT 2 foolish India archer commit suicide on our immortal on the iron
1. 580BC
defeat an archer, but lose 1 immortal at Bombay.
IT our western immortal defeats 3 Incan archerd on defense (he ran into them near their 3rd town)
2. 560BC
lose another immortal totally against all odds, but succeed to beat 2 more archers and Bombay is ours.
kepp it since it's in a nice strategic location. India is gone
3. 540BC
healing, capital built immortal, back to settler
4. 520BC
writing is in, maths next
IT now this can get nasty, we lose an immortal to a jaguar (strength 5). I think we should try and get rid of Aztecs first
they are the biggest threat.
5. 500BC
beat an Incan archer next to Bombay
6. 480BC
our first sword is done, send it towards Aztecs
7. 460BC
moving, set capital to worker after it has produced 2 more immortals
8. 440BC
there is an Aztec jag out now near Delhi
odds are no good, try to get him to attack us instead
found a 4th city, income is horribly low
9. 420BC
jaguar now next to Delhi and iron but both tiles are defended by 2 units
IT jag dies at our archer in Delhi, also defeat another jag outside their capital.
10. 400BC
send sword out now, suggest we go after that Aztec town that is on flat, the hill town has bad odds
We have some more units from the capital coming to reinforce. Suggest to go after that Aztec town then some
Incan towns and also the Japanese capital, all on flat with good odds.
just sent a worker to connect iron at capital
Pre-Turn
capital will finish settler in 2, but there is no unit to even protect the worker outside our borders, change to immortal in 3 first
we don't need nasty surprises here
Delhi is pop4 and at happy limit, MM and the sword build goes down to 6
I think we ought to go on the offense on flat land where odds are in our favor. swords will surely help
IT 2 foolish India archer commit suicide on our immortal on the iron
1. 580BC
defeat an archer, but lose 1 immortal at Bombay.
IT our western immortal defeats 3 Incan archerd on defense (he ran into them near their 3rd town)
2. 560BC
lose another immortal totally against all odds, but succeed to beat 2 more archers and Bombay is ours.
kepp it since it's in a nice strategic location. India is gone
3. 540BC
healing, capital built immortal, back to settler
4. 520BC
writing is in, maths next
IT now this can get nasty, we lose an immortal to a jaguar (strength 5). I think we should try and get rid of Aztecs first
they are the biggest threat.
5. 500BC
beat an Incan archer next to Bombay
6. 480BC
our first sword is done, send it towards Aztecs
7. 460BC
moving, set capital to worker after it has produced 2 more immortals
8. 440BC
there is an Aztec jag out now near Delhi
odds are no good, try to get him to attack us instead
found a 4th city, income is horribly low
9. 420BC
jaguar now next to Delhi and iron but both tiles are defended by 2 units
IT jag dies at our archer in Delhi, also defeat another jag outside their capital.
10. 400BC
send sword out now, suggest we go after that Aztec town that is on flat, the hill town has bad odds
We have some more units from the capital coming to reinforce. Suggest to go after that Aztec town then some
Incan towns and also the Japanese capital, all on flat with good odds.
just sent a worker to connect iron at capital
Sir Bugsy
Civ.D.
I have it. I'll play tomorrow.
handy900
Deity
I
Good idea. The Aztecs don't need any resource to build their UU.
Sir Bugsy
Civ.D.
Pre-flight - 400 BC – Go through our cities. The capitol isn’t growing, but it is throwing everthing into making immortals. Since I haven’t heard that the old adage “pop is power” has been rendered null and void in Civ IV, we’ll start it growing ever so slightly. Everything else is looking pretty good. We are running a serious deficit on our budget. -17gpt with nothing in the bank. I have to drop science to 10%.
IBT – Tokogawa moves one of his three defenders out of Kyoto.
380 – Move our immortals next to Kyoto for attack. Start marching on Azteca.
360 – We kill one archer at Kyoto, attack with the second and…
Well the 67G helps our deficit spending over the short term. Start marching on Tlatelolco.
340 – Attacking Tlatelolco, we lose a sword, but take the city.
Well that is certainly one way to stay solvent financially.
320 – Continue marching and healing. A barb city has popped up southwest of Persepolis.
300 – Almost ready for the Aztec capitol.
IBT – A Jag warrior step out of their western city.
280 – That’s a force of two Jags and an archer. Kill an archer in the new Barb City.
260 – Attack the barb City and…
We now have six attackers at Tenochtitlan.
240 – Attack at Tenochtitlan. Those 40% defenses cause us to lose three immortals and only kill one archer.
Here is the developing situation at Bombay:
IBT – We lose an immortal outside Tenochtitlan, and we kill an attacking archer. That leaves one defender in the city.
220 – We lose an immortal, but our sword kills the remaining defender and…
IBT – We win two of three at Bombay. Iron is on-line.
200 – Marching and healing.
After Action: Here is the situation in Old India:
I’m sure Lee doesn’t need any instruction . In hindsight, I’m not sure it was such a wise move keeping all those cities. I think they are costing us some $$$ that we really don’t have.
Save: http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads10/H25AWP_BC-0200.Civ4SavedGame
IBT – Tokogawa moves one of his three defenders out of Kyoto.
380 – Move our immortals next to Kyoto for attack. Start marching on Azteca.
360 – We kill one archer at Kyoto, attack with the second and…
Well the 67G helps our deficit spending over the short term. Start marching on Tlatelolco.
340 – Attacking Tlatelolco, we lose a sword, but take the city.
Well that is certainly one way to stay solvent financially.
320 – Continue marching and healing. A barb city has popped up southwest of Persepolis.
300 – Almost ready for the Aztec capitol.
IBT – A Jag warrior step out of their western city.
280 – That’s a force of two Jags and an archer. Kill an archer in the new Barb City.
260 – Attack the barb City and…
We now have six attackers at Tenochtitlan.
240 – Attack at Tenochtitlan. Those 40% defenses cause us to lose three immortals and only kill one archer.
Here is the developing situation at Bombay:
IBT – We lose an immortal outside Tenochtitlan, and we kill an attacking archer. That leaves one defender in the city.
220 – We lose an immortal, but our sword kills the remaining defender and…
IBT – We win two of three at Bombay. Iron is on-line.
200 – Marching and healing.
After Action: Here is the situation in Old India:
I’m sure Lee doesn’t need any instruction . In hindsight, I’m not sure it was such a wise move keeping all those cities. I think they are costing us some $$$ that we really don’t have.
Save: http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads10/H25AWP_BC-0200.Civ4SavedGame
Similar threads
