HardSciFiMod

This is still on my list of mods to try Tholish. I hope you don't get discouraged by the lack of responses.
 
If you haven't tried it you haven't missed much.
The 1.0 pulls me forward. I will not be discouraged. I know how bad it currently is. I wouldn't give it much attention either.

So I guess, if you can't say anything nice...offer some constructive criticism.
What should I do about buildings? I am using the Terran Headquarters for everything because the cities have to look good both in space AND on planets. And I think that effect from stacking them up is real cool. Is this a bad approach?

What should I do about spaceports? I guess I have to make them not require any resources, or they will be useless in space. Since they are the only means of exporting to space, they have to require no resources. Plus that allows me to eliminate two rather silly buildings.

What should be my priorities in fixing this up? (Other than making sure ALL units other than spacecraft have Low Orbit as a Feature Impassable and that all land units have Surface Liquid as a Feature Impassable, and of course fixing spaceports, which are non negotiable nexts)

Should I just go ahead and finish dumping all vestiges of modern era units and condense all the buildings to one?

How can I differentiate the "religions" more?

I'm going to dump one of the civic options (observation), and some of the communications civics. What should I replace them with?

How important is the fact that all the infantry looks alike? My thought was that units will come, in time, and if I have created a place for them I will be able to just plug them in. Plus I'll learn how to make them myself eventually. Would it help if I reskinned the seal in different ways?

Civilopedia is essential for a finished product, but how important is it at this point?

How priority is original looking resources?

Am I just way off on everthing?
 
Tholish said:
So I guess, if you can't say anything nice...offer some constructive criticism.
What should I do about buildings? I am using the Terran Headquarters for everything because the cities have to look good both in space AND on planets. And I think that effect from stacking them up is real cool. Is this a bad approach?

So long as the game doesn't CTD then it's not a bad approach. Upload a screenie some time so we can see that in action.

Tholish said:
What should I do about spaceports? I guess I have to make them not require any resources, or they will be useless in space. Since they are the only means of exporting to space, they have to require no resources. Plus that allows me to eliminate two rather silly buildings.

They should almost be free or insta-build when a settler or colony pod or whatever creates a new city/colony. Without the spaceport the place is completely cut off so why not either give it to them or simply not mention it assuming it's there?

Tholish said:
Should I just go ahead and finish dumping all vestiges of modern era units and condense all the buildings to one?

I'm a bit lost on this part. If the mod is completely past the point of CivIV then definitely lose the modern units. The condensing of buildings...are we talking about using the HQ for everything again? I do like that...see above.

Tholish said:
How can I differentiate the "religions" more?

Religions are a PITA if you ask me. It's a gorgeous mechanic, but doesn't always feel necessary to mods. And when you try to shoehorn it in just to use it the results are crap. If you don't need religions, don't bother. With a space mod I can't see how to give the bonuses of founding a religion that's been around 2000+ years. New ones, yeah that works, but what about the old Earth ones? Ignore them for now.

Tholish said:
I'm going to dump one of the civic options (observation), and some of the communications civics. What should I replace them with?

Again, unless there's a need don't add a civic just to have another one. If during playtesting a need arises then you can backfill.

Tholish said:
How important is the fact that all the infantry looks alike? My thought was that units will come, in time, and if I have created a place for them I will be able to just plug them in. Plus I'll learn how to make them myself eventually. Would it help if I reskinned the seal in different ways?

This is a toughie. When playtesting I hate having the same unit for everything especially when you're just learning the mod. But, from a mod maker point of view it can be a pain to come up with unique colors just for models that aren't final. I'd check out Rabbit's space units he made for me for SotM. Or check out SotM and borrow some of our new Seal, infantry, and other units/skins. I went through all of this and it does indeed suck.

Tholish said:
Civilopedia is essential for a finished product, but how important is it at this point?

It's not. Even FfH doesn't have a finished pedia yet. In the end it's important, but not now.

Tholish said:
How priority is original looking resources?

If you give me some links, ideas, pics then I'll try making you some. At first I didn't think they were necessary, but when matthewv first made new ones for SotM I was blown away. And with the correct new buttons they make all the difference in the world.

Tholish said:
Am I just way off on everthing?

If you build it, they will come. :) Make the mod the way you want and even if only 1 other person plays it then you've done a good thing.
 
http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads12/Solaria0_31.zip

Slight upgrade here. Made spaceport more available in a lot of ways (still req a tech) and made buildings consume "food" and balanced start map (PS, took mentioned WB back for repairs) so this doesn't cause a malthusian break down.

Only the sans-art part is included. Use sans-units art from Solaria0_3 and unit art from Solaria0_1.

Also, another crash warning: if you have already started the mod and loaded the scenario, then go back out to the main page within the mod, you MUST NOT go directly back into the scenario. If you try to do this it will not crash to desktop it will lock up. You can't warm start, you have to pull the plug. So, after exiting a game if you want to go back into the WB scenario you have to go back out to desktop, start civ4 v 1.61, go to the mod, and then start the WB scenario. Not to scare anybody off, just being at least slightly responsible.
 

Attachments

http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads12/Solaria0_4.zip

Fixed and improved a lot of issues. Have done a full 12 planet 18 civ map, but it plays slow. This 9 planet size seems OK.

One major problem is simply terrain and feature impassables. I was trying to use land for everything and simulate sea units by using jungle placed on all terran land terrain (sea units cannot be made anywhere else as they require a building only placed by WB fiat on Earth) as an impassable terrain for sea units and an invisible oasis placed on all squares of a land domain "coast" (the sea) as an impassable terrain for most land units (not include spacecraft, which are land units capable of traversing any terrain). However, terrain and feature impassable simply do not work. They are apparently there just to keep sea units out of ocean and are not able to do anything else. Until I figure out how to use the SDK, it will be impossible for this mod to work as intended, and it will be unsatisfying. Also, it badly needs one or more map scripts, which means I must also learn to do this. Further refinements on the game itself (what I really want to be doing) should wait for this. I had hoped to do a simple version of this in XML, but alas the XML is less functional than I thought.
 

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I thought I would request a mod making feature impassables work, but first that I would make sure it doesn't work. Did this little modlet. It works here. Why does it work in Dark (Warrior cannot enter Jungle) and it doesn't work in Solaria0_4? Did something turn it off, as Astronomy turns it off for sea units?


Edit PS: Found the problem. It's the map script I borrowed and butchered to make the WB have Y wrap. In a random map units function as intended. Yet another reminder that for this very map dependent mod to get where it is going I need a proper script.

Here are the criteria:
1. World sizes are all 32 squares in Y and a variable number of squares in X. The horizontal length of a map is (32 squares times the number of planets) minus 16.

2. The number of players in a standard game gives the number of planets for the size. The number of planets times 1.5 gives the number of players.

3. There is Y wrap but not X wrap.

4. Regions are 32 squares high and 16 squares wide. Even numbered regions are "space" regions and Odd numbered regions are "planet" regions.

5. The default land "region type" is "rock." A rock planet has a 1 in 5 chance of being type "terra" and a 1 in 5 chance of being type "lava" and a 1 in 10 chance of being of type "volatiles." A planet can be any combination of terra, volatiles and lava.
a. If a planet is type terra, it starts as all ocean, except for volatiles, then the percent of terra is determined from 10 to 100 percent. This is the chance any given tile will be converted to its original terrain to terra, a simple random chance based on the overall percent of terra. All terra tiles have "jungle feature" and all "ocean" tiles have "oasis." Any tile not adjacent to ocean has a fifty percent chance of being hill.
b. If a planet is type lava, 0-100 percent of it is "lava." If it is a rock and lava planet, the remainder is "rock." Desert tiles are randomly determined one tile at a time for each tile. If it is a terra and lava planet, each tile is tested for lava cover after the terra and ocean have been determined, and all lava tiles also have jungle.
c. If a rock planet is type volatiles, two patches of volatiles are added in the center of each 16 by 16 hemisphere, with a 40 percent chance of a 2 by 2, 30 percent chance of a 4x4, 20 percent chance of a 6x6, and a 10 percent chance of an 8 by 8. Each hemisphere is determined separately and they are determined first, then other terrains are overlayed. On rock planets, all volatiles tiles also have the feature Ice.
d. Rock planets have a chance of "ice" feature capping them equal in size to the volatiles, but half the probability.
e. Any rock planet has 0 to 50 percent "pulvierized rock" feature coverage, with the presence of pulverized rock determined randomly square by square, that probabiliy equal to the global percentage.
f. Non terra rock planets have 0-70 percent hills, and on any given planet the chance of a hill actually being a peak is 0-50.
6. The number of a region (counting west to east) minus 1 is the chance (per the number of planets) of a planet being RegionType "ice." If a planet is type "ice" it's default terrain is ice. It will have 0-30 percent of pulverized rock and 0-60 percent ice and 0-90 percent hills.
7. The 3 vertical row of three space tiles adjacent to each planet are of feature "low orbit," and contain no resources or other features.
8. Any given space region has ((0 to 100)-60)+(2(west to east region number)) percent of ice, and a simple (0 to 100)-60 percent of both pulverized rock. The percent of hills will be equal to the percent of pulverized rock-20.
9. Each square has a 1 in 20 chance of having a resource, equally randomly determined among all possible resources it could have.
10. Start locations are determined very simply: the generator searches for the 3 by 3 tile squares with the highest total number of natural food/hammers/gold productivity and those are the start locations. If there are 5 players, the 5 most productive 9 square squares are used. Ties are broken randomly.
11. There are no rivers and there is no forest and nothing is determined by fractal or anything so grain and all that is irelevant.

This will be a project for version 1.1

Edit PPS
The problem was this: FeatureImpassables intrinsically DO NOT work inside your own cultural borders.
What I was doing to turn off Feature Impassables was that I was planting cities.

I can live with that.
 

Attachments

Here, this is a better map.

Edit: actually, last minute inclusion of farms in Jungle caused it to crash. Fixed. Also now included is better BuildingInfos which makes OldEarthBuildings produce batteries and AirlessExplosivesFac require them. This will make robot workers available to any colony with a spaceport and gives the Explosives resource something to do--useful for isolated colonies.

What a distinguished, elegant presentation, eh?
 

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I had made some unit changes so there are no boats in space, completed part of the civilopedia, fixed some map problems. Tried that out and it worked, was playing but unhappy with civics.

So I decided to redo civics. Redid civics, fixed references in Leaderheads and CivInfos and also in VoteInfo. Loaded a game, but before I could do anything I was notified that I had been defeated. All civs had 10000 points. Tried it over and over. The hall of fame screen can't define it as a particular victory type: the only victory type these defeats can be categorized under is "all". They don't show up when you just show "Culture" "Score" etc...

Thought it might be negative values in the new Civics, so I went back and messed up my careful new design of the civics and made them all positive just to see if it was that. Still an instant defeat. No idea what to do. Guess I'll put back the old civics and see what that does.
...
Did that. Fixed the reinstated leaderhead infos to have NONE as all favorite civics. Tested. No problem. Next step, changed the name of just one civicoption, in both CivicOptions and CivicInfos. Tested. Loaded up where you see Roosevelt and click to go ahead, get the loading bar, rotating chariot wheel, it stops rotating. Crash. Totally new problem. Puzzling. I'm going to try going into it by starting civ4, then starting mod solaria5, then playing the scenario instead of just clicking on the WB icon I put on my desktop.
...
OK, went in without the map, just a fractal map, and no problem. The map must not go with the civic modification. Let me see if civic options are mentioned in the text for the map...
Darn right they are. That was it. Put the original stuff back. It works.

Here, this is the XML for Solaria0_5, and the map. Won't burden the server with all the rest.

http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads12/Solaria0_5_XML.zip
 

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Another self bump. Here comes version 0.7, in the first post.
Really it should be called 0_8.

The tactic of breaking this up into small pieces is becoming unwieldy, but this is the last time: I am on a two week vacation (and have spent the last four days mostly working on this mod) so I will post 1.0 in Completed Mods (and get all these interim uploads deleted) before I go back to work.

As for actual game design it is almost finished really. The only reason I haven't put it in the finished mod forum is a lack of polish--text and buttons and credits and movies and stuff. Between 0_6 and 0_7 I did game design balancing and design more, and there's no reason to polish what you might throw away tomorrow, unless you just can't stand to look at it in playtesting.
Although I added a bunch of units, mainly infantry. The tanks are still lame though.

If you are reading this while I am uploading, hang on.
 
Oh, you can safely play it now! I'm going to go do just that.

PS: I know how you do it; you sit there with your email open.
 
Wow, this mod sure is extensive! Looks like you've put a whole lot of work into this one. :)

It seems like a whole lot to jump right into though, especially with the messed up text everywhere. I definitely think that buttons and stuff will make it more accessible.

Do you think you could maybe give an updated introduction in the first post or something? Some type of thing which would help us get our bearings. It seems like the design doc and little thing you have written up on the second post are out of date.
 
I agree with Gunner. You built it, now help the masses jump into your mod Tholish. :)
 
OK, I started thinking about that, but decided to playtest a little first to remember how things are so I can describe them and get pictures, for which I needed a faster (several years old 1.8 Mhz Pentium 4 R, 500 mb memory, what happened to Moore's law?) scenario, so I started doing one and realized I was highly limited by the terrain types, which have sunlight only on rock and terra (and in space with a feature) and atmosphere only on cytheria (i'm renaming magma) clathrate (and Titan's "rich ice") and terra.

So I can pretty much only do planets pretty much like the ones we have in our solar system, or else get incongruities where one region of a planet has sunlight but another doesn't (senseless, long year polar area or tidal locking excepted) or one has air and another doesn't (only so much you can do with altitutude variations). I can imagine callisto in a martian orbit (sunny ice without air) or venus without clouds (sunny cytheria) or a rocky titan (dark windy rock) etc...Plus it makes combinations possible. Currently only cytheria, clathrate, and terra can go together on one planet--the others are all pure.

I had thought you couldn't add terrain types, because of some early experimenting with adding features that didn't work out for me (don't tell me you can do that too, because I'm about to find out if I now can), but I went and tried it and whoa, there it is you can do it. I took the plains textures and named them plain (without the s) and put them in Assets/Art/Terrain/Textures, copied and renamed an entries in ArtDefines, and TerrainInfos, and tried it out. The Plain terrain doesn't get generated, but I can add it in world builder. It had square edges, but I should be able to fix or work around that, just for scenario purposes. I'm going to see if I can make each terrain type into about 4more. Then I can free up some features for other uses and design for a cooler random map game (all that overly productive terra was just to make Earth able to support large starting populations and represent its larger size on the same size map as the other planets).

Which changes will have a ripple effect. However, I think I can do it all with XML, no new art.
 
http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads12/Solaria0_8NewArt.zip
http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads12/Solaria0_8XML.zip

Install these for all kinds of changes. There are now four of each terrain type, mostly variants of available solar energy and atmosphere. All values, units, bonuses, features and improvements have been altered to adapt (except I just remembered I haven't changed the terrain aspects of Promotions).

The art change is to add a marslike terrain and a poisoned sea.

So, the old solar system map won't be right any more. But never fear. Now a random map is actually pretty cool, specifically Lakes.
 
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