Help with Temples?

[rtdoplex]

I play a lot with religious civs like the Iriquois and they have cheap temples, obviously. I am wondering how crucial these are and at what times they should be used. I play mostly multiplayer but this would be valuable in singleplayer as well... basically, in multiplayer games, you won't get out of the Ancient age without a war. Which makes deciding if and when to build a temple instead of say a barracks or mounted warrior crucial. So I'm asking:

1) Are temples worth cranking out?
2) If so, in what cities? (ie: only on land that there is competition for, only in cities that have valuable resources outside them? What about a city far away from any enemies that you just use to crank out military units?)
3) When? As soon as possible or is it an afterthought, preceded by barracks and military?

Thanks for anyone that can help me with the use of temples.

rtdoplex

 

[e_a_olson]

If you have one unhappy citizen causing a revolt in a size 5 city, a temple would make that citizen content, ending the revolt. Temples make one unhappy citizen content. They also produce 2 culture per turn.

 

[anarres]

I'd rather have another horse or two than a temple. Capture those lux's and there is no need for happiness. Obliterate any nearby AI cities and you can stop worrying aout culture flips.

In extreme cases I build culture buildings on my borders, but more often than not I prefer to just take the bastards out.

 

[Masquerouge]

I build temples in every city when my civ is religious. But it's probably my builder side speaking too loud again
If you're not religious, don't bother ; grab/deal luxuries or increase the lux slider...
And don't forget to rush culture buildings in cities you've captured ! Temples for religious, libraries for scientifics

 

[TomOC]

I use temples to expand my borders, which slows down AI attacks to my cities. So... let's say an AI attacks with a knight. With my expanded borders, the knight may attack, but can't retreat out of my territory before I have time to annihilate them.

I find that if I don't expand my borders, the knight gets out of my territory, thus my Medieval Infantry can’t move and attack, unless the knight is sitting right outside my border.

 

[IceBeast]

I basically say use temples if you find a resource right out of your reach which would be easier to build a temple then settle a new city, especially if you're already past the OCN. You never really NEED temples. I also agree to rush culture buildings, it can help with the flips alot.

 

[dresdor]

I prefer libraries to temples (extra culture & science) but that's because I like scientific Civs...

I'd say in the beginning, you should build temples...the longer they stand, the more culture they give off (and the faster they'll become venerable and double their output)

 

[wvfoos]

I'm playing my first game of c3c. I'm a civ1 and civ3 longtime player. I could beat civ1 (many many moons ago) on the hardest level, provided you got a decent starting point.

With civ3, I haven't quite got the time to do all the micromanaging that I could back then, so i'm a bit slower on my difficulty progression.

That being said, I've found regent level of civ3 pretty easy. Even without maximizing your play (ie, looking for settler factories, etc), its pretty easy to beat, even with contrasting your style of play with the civ's attributes, like warmongering with the greeks.

So, I moved up to monarch the other day for the first time. On regent level (and back in just vanilla civ3), lux's and strat resources were more than plentiful. I played on a continents map with like 10 ai civs, and just in my own little chunk of hte continent, I had like 3 lux's and like horses and iron right off the bat. So did about 80% of the civs on that continent too. That was regent vanilla.

But with c3c, and the lux and strat resources availibility diminished, I find temples are a bit more important than just getting all the luxes from the ai, and using marketplaces to do the happy face multiplier.

 

[JonFitt]

They're the cheapest and first improvement which generates culture. I use them all the time in every city to quickly expand the city radius to grab as much territory as possible. When I'm filling in the gaps they're not so useful though.
The happiness is just a nice side effect when I play.

One way to use them is to place a city on a single free square on an enemies continent, build a temple, force you border out, build another city, etc. Without going to war you can get a good foothold.

 

[TomOC]

They're the cheapest and first improvement which generates culture. I use them all the time in every city to quickly expand the city radius to grab as much territory as possible. When I'm filling in the gaps they're not so useful though.
The happiness is just a nice side effect when I play.

One way to use them is to place a city on a single free square on an enemies continent, build a temple, force you border out, build another city, etc. Without going to war you can get a good foothold.

I've done that to snatch resources/luxuries from the AI. But once in a while, it would NOT expand into their territory. I guess they had a much greater culture. I have also seen my borders expand into their territory, then a couple of turns later, their borders expand back (when their cultural borders expand).

 

[JonFitt]

Yeah, I have noticed that. AFAIK the 8 squares surrounding the city will definately belong to that city unless they are also part of the 8 squares surrounding the next city (Then for some reason it goes one way or the other). The reason that a non 8 square will not become yours must depend on the civ's culture and/or the city's culture, I don't know quite how it works. It doesn't make sense that a new temple could steal away a square from the capitol city for example.

Someone can probably tell us the answer...

And while they're at it, could they give me the deal about culture flipping as of PTW 1.27? In vanilla civ I thought the culture of the city nearest it didn't affect a flip, but people keep saying that they build cultural emprovements to encourage a flip on the nearest city. Is this just because they want to increase the number of sqquares that would belong to their civ if the enemy city wasn't there i.e. the number of joint squares?

 

[Rik Meleet]

(Then for some reason it goes one way or the other).

The reason is that the tile goes to the civ with the highest local culture. Tiles further away from city A than city B => then city A needs a lot more local culture.

And while they're at it, could they give me the deal about culture flipping as of PTW 1.27? In vanilla civ I thought the culture of the city nearest it didn't affect a flip, but people keep saying that they build cultural emprovements to encourage a flip on the nearest city. Is this just because they want to increase the number of sqquares that would belong to their civ if the enemy city wasn't there i.e. the number of joint squares?

Flipping is a chance you can influence. By building culture in a city near a "target-city" you address 2 of them at the same time. Number of tiles of the city's 'production area' decreases thus influencing that percentage and you increase the national-culture. Flips are also influenced by the fraction of your culture and my culture.

 

[Denarr]

Although you may be able to piece together the answer from reading the posts, here, I figured I might be able to provide a different view on the matter.

Build a Temple. It will cause your borders to expand within five turns of being built.

If the town you built is surrounded by your own cities, then you could probably get away with holding off on the temple, since your borders will likely already be expanded into the surrounding cities.

If you're looking at getting smilies, and you have at least three Luxury resources, build a Markeplace.

Borders/culture - Temple
Smilies - Marketplace

 

[IbnSina]

The number and timing on temples I build depends on my goals. If I want to win by 100k culture, diplomacy, or space race, then I build temples early and often. If I plan to win by domination or conquest, then I usually build one very early, and build barracks everywhere else. A single early temple can provide enough culture to keep the flip danger low through most of the ancient age.

 

[Longasc]

Temples are a must. Before you have a market place, you have probably built lots of temples.

In the ancient age, on higher difficulties, keeping even one citizen happy is great. They are also cheap and quick to built, especially as a religious civ.

 

[tao]

Temples are a must. Before you have a market place, you have probably built lots of temples.

In the ancient age, on higher difficulties, keeping even one citizen happy is great. They are also cheap and quick to built, especially as a religious civ.

It all depends on the circumstances.

If you are religious, temples are only 30 shields and you might want to build them, if you need culture expansion.

If you are scientific, libraries cost only 40 shields, give 3 instead of 2 culture points, plus increase your research capability.

If you go conquering the world, temples are a complete waste of resources, since you will stay in monarchy with 3 military police, later substituted by luxuries.

 

[t3h_m013]

yes, in republic with low luxuries (im learning this now in cotm2) temples are more than vital. they arent good enough, you need cathedrals as well...
i cant trade as im on an island andonly have 1 luxury on the main land and one in overseas cities but they are blocked by sea until i get navigation (or whichever one it is)