HOF Questions & Answers

nice video moriarte.

that does seem crazy though. looks highly exploitative, and fun too. :D

sure hope this is fixed, and not sure how this wasn't spotted sooner if it was there since gods and kings
 
I am.

Will play a test game tomorrow on std/std/settler. Will play normally until research labs. Then save, and see what turn I launch spaceship with normal play, and what turn I finish by exploiting this. I'd expect the exploit to be at least 15-20 turns faster, maybe more.

Did this today. Std/std/settler/inland sea, just played a random, not that great start. Never had access to coal, no CS had expanded their borders to actually include their coal, so didn't build any factories.

t162 I had 4 research labs.

t170 I saved, popped I think 9 scientists without getting any techs. That put me at 52,595 of 43 to research sailing. Got sailing, optics, compass while building the overflow, and I was at 150,454 of 927 for Astronomy, which nobody had.

Kept getting 1 tech per turn, on t199 I had all spaceship techs, 20k overflow left over, and 4 more unpopped scientists (2 from hubble, 2 naturally spawned), good for another 25k beakers. Popped them, t201 I ran out of overflow, I had everything except stealth & future tech, I was 3 turns from stealth.

t204 I researched stealth and launched my spaceship. Bottleneck was production/gold. Popping 1 or 2 extra scientists earlier, to get research labs even earlier, and it would have comfortably been under t200.

Then reloaded t170, popped the scientists normally, heading straight for rocketry. So apollo program was completed at least 10 turns earlier. But this time, the bottleneck was beakers. I didn't get the final spaceship tech until t220, so launched spaceship on t221. That could also have been a couple of turns earlier. Wasted some time starting on ISS, and I let arts funding get passed on the same vote as ISS, so the final scientist that put me over the line came ~2 turns later.

But end result, on settler, without timing it at all well, this exploit saved me 17 turns, nearly 10% faster.

It's not as ridiculous a benefit as available on deity, but it's still significant.
 
Just been looking at the beaker overflow thread Moriarte referred us to, and doesn't that seem to be the definition of an exploit? Getting a significant boost on any level by taking advantage of a buggy formula with a somewhat unnatural implementation? I would think this should go on the "banned exploits" list until it is hopefully patched, but I'm new to this HOF and will leave it to those better to judge :-).
 
Definitely qualifies as an exploit. Its a broken game mechanic that will probably get fixed eventually. In the meantime, just don't use the exploit in games for HOF submission.

If anyone is aware of any games on HOF tables that used this exploit, please let us know (privately) so we can investigate.
 
Problem is, Denniz, that a lot of current games on GK/BNW HoF do qualify for this exploit. Everyone who postponed optics line in the past, effectively might have used this exploit (with or without knowledge of it)

And, we can't just "not use" it. We would have to research all cheap techs in a timely fashion to be completely legit.
 
Problem is, Denniz, that a lot of current games on GK/BNW HoF do qualify for this exploit. Everyone who postponed optics line in the past, effectively might have used this exploit (with or without knowledge of it)

And, we can't just "not use" it. We would have to research all cheap techs in a timely fashion to be completely legit.

As usual, exploits come out as a grey area. It is a question of intent. If you are playing normally, you are not exploiting the bug. At least not more than everyone else.

The tactics outlined in the linked thread is where someone crosses over into exploitation.

Using ("exploiting") an obvious bug to achieve a much earlier victory than would normally be possible is what we want to avoid. Bugs get fixed. Then we end up with games that cannot be beaten.
 
I am so surprised this hasn't been noticed earlier as I am absolutely sure the vast majority of players delays the optics line in every single game.

If it even happened to me I am also sure I would have noticed. It probably never did occur as I never use that congress thingy to decrease tech costs. But if people do get that through, doesn't the overflow thing basically happen every time for them?

The guy who posted the exploit said it also would work without that resolution, however with it it's said to be much stronger. So maybe if you can detect if that resolution was passed from a savegame, you can temporarily forbid it or at least pay a closer look at the games where it was passed (at least for the TSG games?).

This really sucks... are the devs aware of it already? Do they realize how important a quick fix for it is?

I'm afraid to say, but every entry now that is not a domination victory is likely to be abusing this -.-
 
Hi,

I want to ask if the HOF dimensions can be filtered :
Currently, we have too many dimensions (by date or by score is only sorting order),
causing nearly every game to open a new "table".

In civ4 HOF, this was solved quite neatly by dividing major dimensions from minor ones :
Each major dimention entry has it's own table, like it is now, but minor dimensions are "squeezed" into one table.

"Version", "Victory condition", "Difficulty" and "Map size" are the 4 major ones.
"Speed", "Map type" and "Leader" are minor ones and should not have their own table.

We can even keep all the tables and just have a web-page added that will enable searching by "all speeds", "all map types" and "all leaders".

Then, we will finally be able to see who.. has the best score in (my example) civ5 vanilla + time victory + settler + duel , without regards to what speed, leader or map type they chose.

Please consider.
Booga. [submitted my first civ5 game]
 
Then, we will finally be able to see who.. has the best score in (my example) civ5 vanilla + time victory + settler + duel , without regards to what speed, leader or map type they chose.

Log in to the HoF, and go to ad-hoc query. Pick the filters you want to use, don't touch the ones where you want to see all. For your example, you'll see 18 games of various speeds, leaders, map-types: http://hof.civfanatics.net/civ5/adh...er=-1&pubID=70&dtSc=0&exp=0&user=-1&submit=Go

The only annoying bit is that if you do select a size, speed, difficulty or condition, there's no way to unselect it and show all without opening a new query page. And that you can select one or all, but there's no way to pick any number in between one & all.
 
Thanks sanabas -
I missed the "ad-hoc query" !!

Now I know..

Booga.
 
Log in to the HoF, and go to ad-hoc query. Pick the filters you want to use, don't touch the ones where you want to see all. For your example, you'll see 18 games of various speeds, leaders, map-types: http://hof.civfanatics.net/civ5/adh...er=-1&pubID=70&dtSc=0&exp=0&user=-1&submit=Go

The only annoying bit is that if you do select a size, speed, difficulty or condition, there's no way to unselect it and show all without opening a new query page. And that you can select one or all, but there's no way to pick any number in between one & all.

You can with ctrl key.
Except with map and leader.
http://hof.civfanatics.net/civ5/adhoc_query.php?show=summ&condition[]=4&condition[]=2&difficulty[]=7&difficulty[]=6&difficulty[]=5&difficulty[]=3&speed[]=1&speed[]=4&mapsize[]=3&mapsize[]=4&maptype=-1&leader=-1&pubID=70&dtSc=0&exp=2&user=-1&submit=Go

:p
 
Hi, had a good start going, but had to put kids to bed. Left computer on. After several hours of sleep, awoke and continued, but the (very hot temperature) computer only let me complete 1 turn before it froze, necessitating a reboot. On reboot, Civ is not running, so I have to restart from my last autosave. What do I need to do to verify a crash? I will save my game now right after the restart and have saved the autosave files from before. Please let me know if there's anything else I can do to verify the crash. If nothing else, this post should at least time the happening :-). Thx.
 
Hi, had a good start going, but had to put kids to bed. Left computer on. After several hours of sleep, awoke and continued, but the (very hot temperature) computer only let me complete 1 turn before it froze, necessitating a reboot. On reboot, Civ is not running, so I have to restart from my last autosave. What do I need to do to verify a crash? I will save my game now right after the restart and have saved the autosave files from before. Please let me know if there's anything else I can do to verify the crash. If nothing else, this post should at least time the happening :-). Thx.

Use this: http://hof.civfanatics.net/civ5/rules.php?show=crashes
 

Thanks a lot. I had read that page when I started doing HOF stuff, but I'd forgotten about it. As it turns out, I don't need it this time, but I'll know in the future. My computer is pretty reliable, but if it heats up too much with Civ running for hours, it can get wonky.

I had a Spain Lake Victoria start- sounds perfect, right? Well-- no mountains, superfew unique luxuries and an insanely aggressive neighbor still managed to derail the Lake Victoria Express enough that I didn't beat my previous gauntlet time with Korea :sad:

It was still fun though!
 
Why don't I see my last two submissions in the ad hoc query section? Do I need to wait for the next HoF update before my new games are included in the database?
 
Why don't I see my last two submissions in the ad hoc query section? Do I need to wait for the next HoF update before my new games are included in the database?

yes, you need to wait. :)
 
Since I finally *broke* my ceiling of Prince and suddenly figured out how to win on higher levels, I really wanted to challenge myself with HOF games. However, I prefer to play all BNW, and I'm really confused. This thread makes it sound like BNW is now acceptable for HOF games. However, the rules page doesn't reflect that. I don't have all the DLC but I have some - I am having trouble figuring out what would disqualify me. Can I get some clarification on what is allowed for BNW before I start a game?
 
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