How had Gathering Storm changed your play?

[megabearsfan]

I'm curious how the changes in Gathering Storm are changing the way that other players play the game. What are you doing differently as a result of the new features and rules?

For me (I play most of my games on Emperor, BTW):
- I'm keeping at least 1 builder around with 1 charge so that he can promptly repair any tiles that get pillaged by disasters.
- I'm being a bit more conservative with my Scouts. I bring them back to my territory sooner as I await upgrading them to Skirmishers then sending them back out in pairs to support each other.
- I'm more open to the idea of settling 1 tile off of a river if there are floodplains, and building farms early for the faster growth, then putting down an Aqueduct later. Not sure if I'll continue doing this though, as it will depend on how beneficial it ends up being in the long run. If I hit 6 pop before researching Feudalism, then it's probably moot anyway.
- I'm using governor Reyna a lot more thanks to her Forestry Management promotion! With the Maori, I've even taken her before Magnus or Liang!
- I'm trading strategic resources with the A.I. left and right (but I avoid trading away Diplo Favor whenever possible).
- I'm building Encampments in cities that don't border other civs, since increasing strategic resource caps is as important (if not moreso) than the extra bombardment.
- If I don't get a lot of research early in the game, I avoid settling or building districts on coastal lowlands. If I have a lot of research potential early, then I don't worry about Global Warming at all, and just tech to Computers before coastal flooding becomes a problem, and let my spare builder(s) take care of the rest.
- I'm getting a lot more consecutive golden ages. Not exactly sure what I'm doing differently to earn them, however. Perhaps all the extra Era Score for improving disaster tiles?

Also, I was making a lot of alliances before, and so I'm happy that I'm now getting additional rewards (Diplo Favor) for doing so.

I put up a blog post outlining the little tips and tricks that I've found so far (http://www.megabearsfan.net/post/2019/02/21/Tips-for-playing-Civilization-VI-Gathering-Storm.aspx), but I'm curious what other players are finding.

 

[Cakeathon]

Avoid volcanoes/lowland.
Choose light or heavy cavalry and stick with it.
Keep an eye out for any city I can liberate.
Get strategics as early as possible instead of at the last second(still working on that one).
Make a bunch of alliances if the game lasts long enough.
Put all early titles into Pingala but after thinking about it, I think I'll go back to magnus.
I almost never build encampment as first district now since it doesn't reduce resource cost.
More effort to be suzerain of many city-states even if I don't need their bonus.
I'm less likely to attack city-states.

 

[Midgardsormr]

The Grievances system has made me more aggressive. I like being able to smack down Shaka without the entire world getting mad at me.

I won a diplomatic victory on my first game kind of by accident. I built the Statue of Liberty thinking it was going to give me extra Settlers, but I won the game instead. My current thinking is that pursuing a diplo victory in tandem with my primary VC has a reasonably low opportunity cost and may well wind up being a win condition I go for fairly often. I may just have gotten lucky, though. We'll see how my current Eleanor France game goes. I held on to my favor even early in the game instead of trading it away for gold. I think that might be hurting me.

The AI doesn't seem as unreasonable about parting with cities in peace deals now, so pillaging and then buying a small border town is once again my preferred method of expanding my borders.

I used my standard Magnus opening in the first game, but global warming hit me hard (I was playing Dido, so losing coastal tiles was especially punishing), so this time around I opened with Pingala and haven't been as chop-happy. We'll see what the results are in the end-game.

 

[megabearsfan]

The Grievances system has made me more aggressive. I like being able to smack down Shaka without the entire world getting mad at me.

I won a diplomatic victory on my first game kind of by accident. I built the Statue of Liberty thinking it was going to give me extra Settlers, but I won the game instead. My current thinking is that pursuing a diplo victory in tandem with my primary VC has a reasonably low opportunity cost and may well wind up being a win condition I go for fairly often. I may just have gotten lucky, though. We'll see how my current Eleanor France game goes. I held on to my favor even early in the game instead of trading it away for gold. I think that might be hurting me.

The AI doesn't seem as unreasonable about parting with cities in peace deals now, so pillaging and then buying a small border town is once again my preferred method of expanding my borders.

I used my standard Magnus opening in the first game, but global warming hit me hard (I was playing Dido, so losing coastal tiles was especially punishing), so this time around I opened with Pingala and haven't been as chop-happy. We'll see what the results are in the end-game.

It seems to me that Global Warming disproportionally punishes coastal civs. As far as I've seen, the coastal flooding is the only permanent effect of warming. Everything else is easily handled by a single builder or a few turns of repair on the city.

I've yet to play a full game as a coastal/naval-focused civ (part way through a Moari game), so maybe I'll feel warming is more impactful when I try I get to the end of that game.

 

[megabearsfan]

Avoid volcanoes/lowland.
Choose light or heavy cavalry and stick with it.
Keep an eye out for any city I can liberate.
Get strategics as early as possible instead of at the last second(still working on that one).
Make a bunch of alliances if the game lasts long enough.
Put all early titles into Pingala but after thinking about it, I think I'll go back to magnus.
I almost never build encampment as first district now since it doesn't reduce resource cost.
More effort to be suzerain of many city-states even if I don't need their bonus.
I'm less likely to attack city-states.

What was it about Pingala that is more appealing since the expansion? I dont recall him changing.

 

[Midgardsormr]

He now offers a percentage bonus to population science or culture production instead of a bonus to building construction.

 

[Cakeathon]

What was it about Pingala that is more appealing since the expansion? I dont recall him changing.

+1 to science/culture for each population in city. It's a very big early game boost, that's 2-3 monuments or 2-3 libraries worth of science or culture.

 

[pkaem]

My opener changed completly

1. I go scout, worker, settler instead of scout, settler, slinger
2. I totally pick pingala first, only execption is when both of my first citys are completly food starved, magnus then.
2a. If magnus I mostly prepare an archer into horseman assault on my nearest neighbour
3. I put down just one city, exeption: no iron or horse.
4. I go state craftmanship into state workforce decide if my first district is campus or camp, depends on adjacency and barbs
5. I put down the gov. plaza in the city without pingala, put the 2nd point in 1,3 culture / pop, when plaza is built magnus into the plaza city
6. rush to pol. philosohpy and pick autocracy for conquest or republic for peace, try to get pyramids
7. I chop out the ancestral hall, put in 50% settlers and spam citys as I have space. If I end up completly boxed in warlords
8. going feudalism asap, stirrups, start warring with the raid card, mercenarys, more knights, kill 1-2 competetors and pillage the hell out of them. While doing this rushing curassiers and upgrading. Either kill them all from here into tanks or science when I have a clear lead and further conquest is hindered through resources, terrain or not in the moods.
9. If I go peaceful I get down my districts into culture.

E: Gorgo is most op now. More culture = even faster, resourceless hoplite push if necessary, bonus card super useful while warring in classical, medival.

 

[BarbarianHunter]

- I’m able to pick and choose my campus districts due to map generator (more mountains) and geothermal fissure +2 adjacency bonus. I’ll rarely feel the need for generic campus spam in GS.
- Going for x3 Pingala promotions early essentially all the time. Takes the edge off early game deity science differential. Also lessens my perception that I need to campus spam.
- Chopping up population in Pingala’s city. Getting to pop 10 relatively quickly.
- I avoid placing districts adjacent to rivers. Well, maybe I think about avoiding placing districts adjacent to rivers but place them anyway.
- Working the top of the tech tree more often, and sooner. Need to unlock dams at Buttressing.
- No districts next to volcanoes, ever.
- I rarely was able to create alliances before GS, and rarely get them now. Although with my present Eleanor game I am holding on to some hope.
- Selling diplomatic favor takes the edge off the early gold game.
- Cavalry gap units are very effective enabling continuous warring without a stand down period waiting for military science to unlock cav.

 

[Fluphen Azine]

I basically play the same exact style/game except Pangala instead of Magnus now.
I find that the war game has become 3x easier than before... maybe more.
Climate change has not made any difference in my games no matter if 2, 3 or 4 disaster level.
You can build Wonders with ease on Deity as well if that is your thing.
More Gold and basically More of everything you want.

 

[Midgardsormr]

Ah yes, I forgot to mention how huge a difference the Cuirasser made in my Dido game. Carrying the knight rush for an entire additional era was very fun. I'm not having nearly as good a time with Eleanor, though. Shaka's out-teched me into the Atomic era, and I'm just barely holding off his AT armies with massed crossbows. I'm a little disappointed that my loyalty attack isn't phasing him at all. I'm gobbling up my allies at a decent rate, but Zululand is impregnable.

 

[Cherenkov]

Volcanoes are OP when they erupt many times, just don't put a district next to one like I did recently. I had a recent SV deity game where one tile around the volcano ended up with 8 food, 9 prod when I won. The other tiles around it were also putting outrageous food and production. But I found out the hard way to never put a district especially campus next to one. I had no idea what I was thinking

Also of note:
- Powered cities make research labs worth it especially if you are swimming in gold and can buy them.
- Magnus is still good but Pingala is very strong with a fast growing city for extra science and culture.
- Horse and/or iron starved starting locations suck Much tougher to go war if you haven't accumulated enough of those resources especially when the ones holding it are the civs that denounced you.
- Love the new government Synthetic Technology if not going for a CV.

Enjoying the new civs especially Maori, Carthage and Hungary, however R&F still has plenty of OP civs for early deity wars like Greece, Aztec, Sumeria.

 

[Midgardsormr]

I lost my first attempt at a CV with Eleanor. Pericles just had too much culture to deal with. Once Shaka was out of his golden age, Zululand crumbled ridiculously fast to the loyalty assault. I wiped him and Tomyris out completely without firing a shot. That policy where you can choose the promotions for a Rock Band is ridiculous. You can use them to essentially just buy an enemy city with faith. Even if you only get one concert with each, reducing a size 14 city to 0 loyalty for ~2000 faith is awesome!. And then Eleanor assimilates it immediately.

So my first districts in all cities have become Theater Square & Entertainment Complex. Diplomatic Favor has become my new favorite currency for buying Great Works from the AI. Pericles was selling me books for 92 DF each.

 

[Victoria]

A lot more flexibility in the governor taken depending on civ.
A bit more flexibility in pantheon
For most civs my openers have not changed
The addition of extra stock units for cavalry and scout has enhanced my liking these units (which I already did)
I now consider taking out CS I normally may not have done because it is not just Hungary that levies.
English Harbors are better now, you do not need Mali, just a good start.
I still settle on rivers if it works but will go out of my way a bit to settle near a volcano. Never build dams, disaster are not really... not enough drought to care.
I am now very aware of civs with iron amd nitre.
I will build an encampment quite often early as 60=3 and will happily buy the stuff but am much more careful about selling it.

I've yet to play a full game as a coastal/naval-focused civ

Maori harbor / Marae is a crazy game for being able to buy stuff.... I played one early Maori quad game.. very strong, do not need frigates... you have quads at the start and foreign trade for 100% naval is a few turns off the start... and you get great starting production...Super fast, super early, super quick to build... just OP.
The very strong Toa rush is merely one choice of many.
This is by far the most flexible and fun civ I have ever played.

 

[pkaem]

A lot more flexibility in the governor taken depending on civ.
A bit more flexibility in pantheon
For most civs my openers have not changed
The addition of extra stock units for cavalry and scout has enhanced my liking these units (which I already did)
I now consider taking out CS I normally may not have done because it is not just Hungary that levies.
English Harbors are better now, you do not need Mali, just a good start.
I still settle on rivers if it works but will go out of my way a bit to settle near a volcano. Never build dams, disaster are not really... not enough drought to care.
I am now very aware of civs with iron amd nitre.
I will build an encampment quite often early as 60=3 and will happily buy the stuff but am much more careful about selling it.
Maori harbor / Marae is a crazy game for being able to buy stuff.... I played one early Maori quad game.. very strong, do not need frigates... you have quads at the start and foreign trade for 100% naval is a few turns off the start... and you get great starting production...Super fast, super early, super quick to build... just OP.
The very strong Toa rush is merely one choice of many.
This is by far the most flexible and fun civ I have ever played.

Do you use pingala for a fast ancestral hall or still rush early empire and chop out settlers?

 

[Victoria]

Do you use pingala for a fast ancestral hall or still rush early empire and chop out settlers?

I use Amani to ensure I get a golden age sometimes.
Magnus chop early is not so strong but does catapult you so it may be more about how many resources does my city have to chop with.
Ancestral hall is still strong and its roughly 10-12 turns so still a nice reward... If you are wanting to spew out settlers then provision is also handy.
Pingala is a nice to have but you have to consider balance... too much culture or science early can make your districts expensive... Want to go CV but cannot find an early CS... then maybe pin to make a shortfall ... also to super rush Toa or knights if money is not scarce.
Moksha I have used first also
I do not have a golden rule, I play on circumstance and how I feel. For efficiency I will still compare magnus and Amani but for a civ like the maori Pin may be a good choice... thing is some suzes early are also nice so can you turn down Amani in Valetta as Maori with earth goddess?
I never really EE chopped settlers in great number.
Which would you take first playing Hungary?
This version has made things more flexible... it's cool.

 

[pkaem]

I use Amani to ensure I get a golden age sometimes.
Magnus chop early is not so strong but does catapult you so it may be more about how many resources does my city have to chop with.
Ancestral hall is still strong and its roughly 10-12 turns so still a nice reward... If you are wanting to spew out settlers then provision is also handy.
Pingala is a nice to have but you have to consider balance... too much culture or science early can make your districts expensive... Want to go CV but cannot find an early CS... then maybe pin to make a shortfall ... also to super rush Toa or knights if money is not scarce.
Moksha I have used first also
I do not have a golden rule, I play on circumstance and how I feel. For efficiency I will still compare magnus and Amani but for a civ like the maori Pin may be a good choice... thing is some suzes early are also nice so can you turn down Amani in Valetta as Maori with earth goddess?
I never really EE chopped settlers in great number.
Which would you take first playing Hungary?
This version has made things more flexible... it's cool.

Hungary depends on the cs situation. I did a bit of testing with them. First round I enabled the CS wall mod and with a suitable one and a source of iron (just for the eureka) you can stomp the first AI with steroid swordsman while using armani.

After that I diasabled it and it becomes a gamble. When you don't have a CS in good enough range you have to play a regular game with 50% off districts over a river. Pingala let's you get knights earlier, maybe just +2 pingala for more culture and chop chariots with magnus. If you snatch a culture pantheon, you can get there really fast.

My main problem is when I put down my cities either way and end up wothout iron or horse. I'm bad at transitioning into a builder game. If I have terrain with many chops I get greedy with magnus and move him around to place my districts optimal, I think I'd need to clear terrain faster in these cases. I also tend to buy a lot of tiles for another +1 adjaceny and burn lots of money or delay all other districts because I don't want any to finish before all the others are put down.

Gambling for nitre is a risk and I want to be able to play a game while not killing 1-2 opponents every time. I'll go into round three with them on friday and try armani or pingala first and kind of insta placing my districts in suboptimal location over rivers. CS just for safety and see where it goes.

 

[Midgardsormr]

After three attempts, I finally got my French Eleanor victory—Immortal, Standard, Pangea. I usually like to play on Huge Continents, but her loyalty mechanic is more fun on Pangea. And I stepped down to Standard to reduce the chances that there would be a runaway cultural civ in the game again. I think I finally got the hang of timing out the Monumentality / Feudalism / Harvest combo. In fact, I over-did it a little bit, taking two Monumentality Golden Ages in a row and running out of spots to settle. I wound up with one lonely and worthless tundra city that didn't do anything for me. I could still use a bit of practice on timing my growth chops so I can lay out discounted districts earlier. But that's not anything to do with GS…

Since the production card overflow isn't a thing any more, I am taking Magnus third—Pingala early for the culture push, unless I get some good culture from other sources, followed by Liang for the extra Builder charge, which I used to kick-start the fun by chopping in the Gov Plaza and Ancestral Hall. Getting the Classical Golden Age with Eleanor wasn't possible, so this all started in the Medieval period, by which time I had sufficient Governor promotions to support all of that.

I managed a 100% peaceful game. Zulus were a little scary for a while, but Korea was sufficiently weak that he attacked them instead of me. I managed to bribe him into the green and got a DoF that I was able to maintain the rest of the game. Of the rest of the leaders, only Saladin disliked me for very long, but even he warmed up to me by the end. I ended with all five Alliances and Friendships with the other two civs.

Although I was almost finished building Cristo Redentor when I saw the Cultural Victory screen, I hadn't gotten around to building any Seaside Resorts. The Ski Resorts just take so much less effort, and of course Chateaus took a lot of charges. Rock Bands again played a big role in my strategy, but this time I didn't bother using them as loyalty hammers—I didn't need the extra cities, anyway. I felt some tension between buying more museums with Jesuit Education (generously provided by Kristina's religion) and buying bands. The bands are faster, even if they only get one concert in, so I let a couple of artists languish instead of buying galleries for them.

Previously I'd avoided raiding my neighbors for artifacts—there was no upside to it, but now I can reliably get a little gift of 30 diplomatic favor every thirty turns in exchange for stealing one, so I leave the ruins on my own lands until later in the game.

I won at around turn 230, which is quite fast for me. But I'm not really into speeding through the game; I like to play with the end-game techs and civics.

 

[pkaem]

After three attempts, I finally got my French Eleanor victory—Immortal, Standard, Pangea. I usually like to play on Huge Continents, but her loyalty mechanic is more fun on Pangea. And I stepped down to Standard to reduce the chances that there would be a runaway cultural civ in the game again. I think I finally got the hang of timing out the Monumentality / Feudalism / Harvest combo. In fact, I over-did it a little bit, taking two Monumentality Golden Ages in a row and running out of spots to settle. I wound up with one lonely and worthless tundra city that didn't do anything for me. I could still use a bit of practice on timing my growth chops so I can lay out discounted districts earlier. But that's not anything to do with GS…

Since the production card overflow isn't a thing any more, I am taking Magnus third—Pingala early for the culture push, unless I get some good culture from other sources, followed by Liang for the extra Builder charge, which I used to kick-start the fun by chopping in the Gov Plaza and Ancestral Hall. Getting the Classical Golden Age with Eleanor wasn't possible, so this all started in the Medieval period, by which time I had sufficient Governor promotions to support all of that.

I managed a 100% peaceful game. Zulus were a little scary for a while, but Korea was sufficiently weak that he attacked them instead of me. I managed to bribe him into the green and got a DoF that I was able to maintain the rest of the game. Of the rest of the leaders, only Saladin disliked me for very long, but even he warmed up to me by the end. I ended with all five Alliances and Friendships with the other two civs.

Although I was almost finished building Cristo Redentor when I saw the Cultural Victory screen, I hadn't gotten around to building any Seaside Resorts. The Ski Resorts just take so much less effort, and of course Chateaus took a lot of charges. Rock Bands again played a big role in my strategy, but this time I didn't bother using them as loyalty hammers—I didn't need the extra cities, anyway. I felt some tension between buying more museums with Jesuit Education (generously provided by Kristina's religion) and buying bands. The bands are faster, even if they only get one concert in, so I let a couple of artists languish instead of buying galleries for them.

Previously I'd avoided raiding my neighbors for artifacts—there was no upside to it, but now I can reliably get a little gift of 30 diplomatic favor every thirty turns in exchange for stealing one, so I leave the ruins on my own lands until later in the game.

I won at around turn 230, which is quite fast for me. But I'm not really into speeding through the game; I like to play with the end-game techs and civics.

Only way I win before T200 is domination (on sunday with everything working out as planned) . As described above I tend to get my districts down to late. I never had a CV before T230.

How many cities and holy sites did you have? How much of your faith was spend for builders and workers?

How many cities did you have and how many holy cities? Also did you spend all the harvest faith for builders and settlers?

 

[Lord Yanaek]

I will build an encampment quite often early as 60=3 and will happily buy the stuff but am much more careful about selling it.

What's he meaning of those strange mathematics