How to catch up on science?

[Thomazo]

I'm currently 5% behind the leader in literacy(science) and I can't seem to catch up. I'm building all science buildings as I can and doing research agreements, but is there something I'm missing? I play as Rome on king


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[Lukasper]

Are you adopting Rationalism? If not, this gives you a huge boost to your science

 

[dragonxxx]

Even without rationalism being behind on King is strange. Do you work the specialist slots and do you make academies with the scientists? (these are best to place in the city with NC, thats the capital usually).

And how big are your cities?

 

[Acken]

Most probable issue is that you have small cities and dont build the national college in a reasonable time frame. You can always provide a screenshot and more details for more help.

 

[S.O.T MAHak]

Try and get the "scholars in residence" proposal passed in the world congress

 

[DocRock]

Try and get more Great Scientists by putting specialists in the respective buildings (Universities etc). Later on, it's more use just to pop them for a free tech. See if you can buy them with faith or get some by taking specific social policies.

It's pretty easy to fall behind on technology regardless of the difficulty level. Especially if you have a runaway civ who is much better than all the other competitors.

 

[dragonxxx]

Try and get more Great Scientists by putting specialists in the respective buildings (Universities etc). Later on, it's more use just to pop them for a free tech. See if you can buy them with faith or get some by taking specific social policies.

It's pretty easy to fall behind on technology regardless of the difficulty level. Especially if you have a runaway civ who is much better than all the other competitors.

There is no such thing as runaway civ on king. Around turn 150 the AI has under 100BPT ... If you don't have the tech lead at this point, that means you are doing something very wrong.

 

[DocRock]

That's like a Deity player telling an Immortal one that he is doing something seriously wrong because so game is so easy on Immortal it's almost unbearable.

 

[dragonxxx]

That's like a Deity player telling an Immortal one that he is doing something seriously wrong because so game is so easy on Immortal it's almost unbearable.

Well, the game is indeed very easy at immortal, and I seriously do not think its even possible to lose on king. As long as you get science buildings asap, work science specialist slots, stay happy and have "some" growth in your cities, its pretty impossible to be behind on science.

 

[Uzael36]

Just remember, we were all new at one point. It most certainly is possible to fall behind on King difficulty, after all the AI can fall behind other AI, and they get bonuses. Clearly the OP just needs to figure out or be taught a few concepts to get over the hump and on his way to Emperor level.

The most common mistake for new players is to focus on production and not growth. The other issue might be to focus on getting improved unit techs instead of science buildings (unless going directly to war).

 

[Olodune]

[...] but is there something I'm missing? I play as Rome on king

A screenshot would elicit the best advise.

The most likely remedy is to change your initial development priorities/execution. There are many "Let's Play" video series these days. I personally like Moriarte's stuff. I would check out either the Denmark game (Liberty opener, pre fall 2013 patch) or the Celt game (Tradition opener).

https://www.youtube.com/user/Moriarte1982/playlists

In terms of how to catch up, Civ 5 actually has many mechanisms.

1) Trade Routes with civs that have a tech lead will yield beakers proportional to the tech difference. Mostly useful early game on higher difficulties.

2) Techs researched by civs that you've met will give a modest reduction in their beaker reqs -> scout early and aggressively. Get that caravel across to the other continent.

3) Spies are probably the single most important technology equalizer. If you are behind throw a spy or several into AI cities. I find the best targets are either: the capital of an AI that has a lead over you, but does not have the global tech lead; or the largest non-capital city of the tech leader. (To maximize your rate of successful stealing).

4) There is a World Congress proposal "Scholars in Residence" that gives a 20% reduction in beakers for any tech already discovered by another player.

5) There is a bug/exploit that you can use in some situations involving Great Scientists' Bulbs, Scholars in Residence, pre-discovered tech, etc. This is banned in Games of the Month, most MP, etc, & requires several conditions to setup, so use at your own discretion. Yoruus shows a devastatingly effective example:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vaVNdjOGXK4&list=PLgYopQWwsyjG41klZaOVjtuCQ44yiEnvV

 

[_Dachannien]

As someone who is comfortable on King and will probably make the step up in the near future, I can say that it's easy (if you've never been told about it before) to overlook the massive firepower of the National College. Especially if you tend to play wide in the early game, you can get yourself into a situation where you end up not building the NC for a long time, because it becomes such a big project to get a bunch of libraries in place in your low-production cities.

The importance of the NC (usually in your capital), as well as academies and science specialists in the city where the NC is, is HUGE. But speaking from experience, you don't realize how huge it is until you try it, and many newer players don't know that they even should try it.

 

[nimling]

Getting Education early is useful, especially if any of your major cities have jungle tiles. 2 sci 2 food is really useful for getting good science even at relatively low population.

Getting National College early is helpful and damn near essential on higher difficulties, but sometimes it is more important to rush for useful city sites. If you beeline for Great Library and take Philosophy, then build National College on your first city, you will almost always steamroll the AI on King difficulty, though this often means having few cities. I would usually want 3-4 cities as early as possible, at least on King/Emperor. Getting National College a little later is fine, but it should be operational before Education is researched, and education should be a high priority. The AI techs towards Education most of the time as well.

Avoid unhappiness whenever possible - you will want consistent population growth, so if you found new cities any nearby luxes should be improved early, or you should have enough happiness to allow the city to grow to a useful size (4-5) where it can contribute useful science/production. Picking happiness policies at the right time is helpful as well, though you can and should forestall taking Monarchy or Meritocracy until they are needed. Circuses are incredibly useful for maintaining happiness especially for wide empires, so it is useful to know where horses are when founding cities.

Depending on whether you went with tradition or one of the other options, you will want to use food caravans or cargo ships to accelerate growth. For tradition the food caravans head to the capital most of the time, while for liberty the food caravans direct to new cities in order to bring their population up faster. Food caravans to new cities also allow those new cities to work production tiles, which is useful for getting early infrastructure in place sooner.

 

[SYahoo]

There is no such thing as runaway civ on king. Around turn 150 the AI has under 100BPT ... If you don't have the tech lead at this point, that means you are doing something very wrong.

I believe these forums frown upon elitist attitudes/posts.

The original post is asking how he can remedy this and telling them they "are doing it wrong" is in NO WAY constructive.

Sorry for hi-jacking but this attitude is becoming more predominant on an otherwise very friendly and helpful group of gamers.

 

[The Pilgrim]

Before we take this discussion any further, I think we should ask OP how many wonders he or she has.

 

[dragonxxx]

I believe these forums frown upon elitist attitudes/posts.

The original post is asking how he can remedy this and telling them they "are doing it wrong" is in NO WAY constructive.

Sorry for hi-jacking but this attitude is becoming more predominant on an otherwise very friendly and helpful group of gamers.

Are you serious? Since when stating that something is wrong is elitist?
When I am doing something wrong, I definitely prefer someone to point it out to me, not to tell me " good job, you are doing great".

 

[Acken]

Well, the game is indeed very easy at immortal, and I seriously do not think its even possible to lose on king. As long as you get science buildings asap, work science specialist slots, stay happy and have "some" growth in your cities, its pretty impossible to be behind on science.

My girlfriend loses on king and sometimes on prince. Its certainly possible.
Getting up to deity requires quite a good amount of dedication to sit down and learn the game. Some people dont have the patience to do it and some dont see the point, learning from others not being their idea of fun. Some arent interested in being challenged.

While i do think immortal is very easy for me, its probably on average a difficult level for many people. Hence by definition its considered difficult.

 

[Ryika]

Are you serious? Since when stating that something is wrong is elitist?
When I am doing something wrong, I definitely prefer someone to point it out to me, not to tell me " good job, you are doing great".

Well, it sounds elitist because it's just not universally "wrong", you're assuming that everyone has your experience and evaluate things from that point of view. As a newbie to the genre, there are definitely runaway-Civs on Prince. The difference is not as obvious as on Deity, but it still happens. If you don't remember how it felt back when you started, start a new game, automate everything, stick strictly to what your advisors tell you, only interact with the AI if they initiate the trades, etc.... I think you'll see, that it's rather easy to fall behind even on king.

@Topic: Probably not enough emphasis on food and population growth. A savegame or screenshots would be easy ways to tell what your primary problems are.

 

[Thomazo]

Well, I'm definitely not an expert in civ5, I get it that I'm bad, I get it that I'm doing something wrong, hence this thread. I know some of you guys are really good and playing on diety and whatnot but it's kind of arrogant to say that it's "impossible" to lose on king.

Anyhow, I appreciate your help, I took those tips and I actually managed to get within 2% from the leader. I'm going for domination in this game so I went for a lot of units instead of buildings/growth etc so that was propably the reason. I now control 4 capitals and I can focus more on science so I guess I'm gonna be fine


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[Soltan_Gris]

Taking someone over is always a good option, considering the ai won't always have technologically superior weapons despite having a tech lead.