How to keep up with AI in Tech in 1.29?

[rookie]

Any suggestions for keeping up with the AI (Technology) on Regent and above on large maps. The warmonger style is not very productive for this new patch. When I try to sell a tech they offer me $40, but if I try to buy one they want $4000 or say it can't be done. This is so stupid, even the smallest civs have all of the techs from the other AIs but they won't sell it to me.

I need ways to keep up with the new patch. I would just demand techs for peace before, but that won't work anymore.

 

[wohmongarinf00l]

yup, welcome to the club. for example, in ancient and middle ages i can't get research in less than 40 turns without running a huge unmanageable deficit.
the easiest solution is to play an expansionist civ and get techs from goody huts for the ancient age (trading them away immediately of course). a better fix is to get the great library by any means necessary preferably after folks are way past education (so u can get tons of techs). when u get the free techs, trade them away to any civ with some cash. in the industrial age, make sure to build the ToE (u can't get the benefits by capturing it) and trade away the one newest tech u get. they will give u a small fortune for electronics.
otherwise i think tech research for the human is busted. i built libraries, universities and research labs in about 20 cities and still the tech was 40 turns. what is interesting is that 1 scientist takes 40 turns producing 1 beaker a turn. 100% science still takes 40 turns even though the domestic advisor column for the beakers shows tons of beakers being produced in different cities.

 

[rookie]

I agree,

Unless I can find a way to keep up I am going back to the old patch. I have the most cities in current game and am #1 in the power and culture ranking, yet I am behind even the smallest civs in technology.

 

[Padma]

I don't even try to keep up with the AI in techs on Regent. I put minimal funds to researching techs the AI doesn't, and buy the ones they do. By Late Middle Ages or Industrial Age, I am strong enough (gold and power) that I can outresearch the AI from then on.

 

[Evincar]

Well, it's sure that keeping up with the AI has become pretty hard, but there are ways to do it. On Monarch and above, where the cost raises for the player, it's a good idea to have 1 scientist and make the 40 turns research strategy. Research the most expensive tech, and buy the rest from the United Team. Once a tech is known by anyone else, the AI sells it for very little money. Also, you may get many techs in a single turn by buying a tech not everyone has, then trade it to the other players for another one and so on...I got the 5 final middle ages techs for 2500 gold, so yes, you can keep up.

Anyway, in the Industrial Age, you may begin your own research if you have expanded enough and have the adequate structure. What you say, not being able to research in less than 40 turns sounds weird to me. Rookie do you ever do libraries and universities?? do you have roads in EVERY tile??. You should be able to research far more

 

[DaDoo]

I take it you don't use accelerated production. Beeline for Literature and have one of your best city (usually capital) start building the pyramid and switch it to the Great Library once you get literature. After you discover Literature, put science to 0 and pump out military and city improvements like mad with your other cities and start trample and extort tech and money from other civs. It should keep you relatively up to speed with the AI until education is discovered. By then you should have the biggest empire on the map with the most cities and have all the city improvements. With Republic govt going you should have no problem keeping up with the AI. Don't forget to go to your foreign advisor screen once in a while and chat up with a random AI to see if they have a tech you don't have and trade for it.

 

[Hades]

Trade is the best way to get tech. Just set your science to 0. Until you have a large empire and every city is loaded with science buildings you don't have any other choice.

 

[nicuss]

Stop building mines all over the place and do some irrigation instead (on wheat/cattle tiles too). This will allow your cities to grow quickly, and a larger city produces proportionally more science/gold than a smaller one. That's why automated workers always seem to irrigate too much if you've wondered. In despotism it's not useful to irrigate regular grassland, but as soon as you switch to a better govt immediately irrigate some of it to grow fast to size 12, then turn it back to mines till you get hospitals, at which point you irrigate again. It halps a lot to be an industrious civ.

And yes, you should start building the Pyramids very early on, in your capital, after you built a couple settlers, a few units, and maybe a temple. Then go out and explore, most importantly meet new civs. Trade science, keep in mind that innitially every civ starts with a couple different techs so it's very important to trade yours for theirs. Then aim all your research for Literature, make sure you get it before someone else builds the pyramids, and switch your pyramid to the Gr.Library. After that, it's important to meet all other civs as fast as possible, you won't get their techs if you don't have contact with them. Build a few galleys and send them accross the ocean to the other continent, hopefully at least one will make it and establish contact there. Then trade maps, but don't trade contacts until somone discovers navigation, you're better off keeping them separated and brokering techs from one side to the other.

From GrLibr to Education keep Sci rate at 0% and make lots of moneyn needed later on for wars/improvements/etc. When education comes switch sci to 100% even if you lose money (don't lose all of it tho) and aim straight for Military tradition.
Then go to

This seems to work just fine on Emperor.

 

[nicuss]

wohmongarinf00l, did you know you can switch your government to something better than despotism? republic is good and democarcy is best, although communism is better for wartime.

the other thing it could be is that you don't build any roads except for communication. you have to build roads and then railroads on every square in every city radius if you want to get any science output, besides building librarie/univs/courthouses.

i can't explain otherwise how you manage to get 40 turns techs. right now, on emperor in the middle ages it takes me just about 5 turns to do one whitout loosing too much money. and i'm at war too.

 

[Desmond Hawkins]

The key is to at all costs get darwin's.

Then take Atomic Theory and Electronics with your two free techs. You can then trade those for every single tech you missed on the way.

That is of course if you are going for a late-game underdog surge.

 

[Hades]

Originally posted by Sobieski II
The key is to at all costs get darwin's.

Then take Atomic Theory and Electronics with your two free techs. You can then trade those for every single tech you missed on the way.

That is of course if you are going for a late-game underdog surge.

Make sure you stop researching one tech before the Darwin completes otherwise one of the tech it gives you is the tech with only 2 turns left for reseach

 

[dannyevilcat]

I've decided never to research my own techs at all. I just pay money for them until I become communist, then use my veteran spies to steal them all. It works beautifully, and let's me save up lots of cash for upgrading units immediately, too.

After all the fuss over the uselessness of spies, I've started to use them constantly as a commie. This system won't allow you to jump ahead, obviously, but since I found that nearly impossible, it doesn't bother me.

 

[Tweedledum]

I've been having the same problem. I suspect that warmongerinf00l is right, and that trying to do the research yourself is a crock, so it looks like Goody-Huts and the GL is the way to go...

This raises an interesting side-effect about the perennial question of which is the best Civ to play. For Goody-Hut popping you want Expansionist, and for getting the GL you want Commercial (they all get Alphabet at the start and thus are one tech closer to it)...

Put this together, and what do you get? Expansionist/Commercial=English !!! And you thought they were the worst Civ to play... (and you weren't the only one)

 

[etj4Eagle]

I play regeant and have never had a problem with researching techs. In the ancient and beginning of the middle ages the AI gets most of them first, so I mainly trade. But starting about middle ages I get about half of the techs and then it just starts to steam roll after that.

This is with about 50-70% of my income devoted to science. Plenty of luxuries ensure that I don't need to devote tax revenue there. And dropping many cities, roading all that I can, and making sure every coastal city has a harbor helps. Also having Adam Smith's and markets and banks in every city helps as well by balancing your budget so that way you can devote even more money to science.

 

[Yzman]

I play monarch with the newest patch and have no problem keeping up in techs. Most of the time I'm a head one or 2. The key is to have strategic wars that bring the civs down economically and when they get low enough no matter how cheap they get sold techs by the other AI they never recover. Do this about every 20 turns to certain civs and eventually you can have the msot land and all of them will be too broke or war weary to research at all. I also dont buy tech, I research it all and trade. It not hard to keep up. Just keep your economy built up during the game.

 

[Lt. 'Killer' M.]

A lot of nice ideas here - give them all a shot.

Mine: try to be the guy who gets contact with everyone else before the others do (i.e. suicide a few galleys). Then, you can sell contact for quite some tech and money. Sometimes, this can give a huge boost.....

 

[Hurricane]

Originally posted by Yzman
I play monarch with the newest patch and have no problem keeping up in techs. Most of the time I'm a head one or 2. The key is to have strategic wars that bring the civs down economically and when they get low enough no matter how cheap they get sold techs by the other AI they never recover. Do this about every 20 turns to certain civs and eventually you can have the msot land and all of them will be too broke or war weary to research at all. I also dont buy tech, I research it all and trade. It not hard to keep up. Just keep your economy built up during the game.

This screenshot is a good example of that tactic. By selling a tech, I get a required luxury (at 8th luxury price) as well as lots of money from the Indians, who will bankrupt themselves with this deal. Note that I can keep tech at 80% to keep research at 4 turns while still netting several hundred gold per turn. This is on Emperor level.

 

[rookie]

Tried a bug I found in another thread.

I was researching Gunpowder, With research set to max without losing money it would have taken 15 turns to research it. I switched research rate to 100%, now losing -158 Gold per turn! It will now take 4 turns to complete.

1st turn lost one catapult
2nd turn lost one catapult and one worker.
3rd turn lost barracks in capital
4th turn lost another barracks and one worker

Finshed gunpowder on same turn as strongest rival. Sold it to everyone else for appprox. 200 gold total and 100 GPT. This let me increase science rate for next on list (Astronomy).

Not a bad trade. I can rebuild my barracks in 2 or 3 turns. This must be something overlooked by Firaxis. No matter how much money you are losing you only lose one structure at a time.

 

[alexander dumas]

Rookie,
There was a lot of good advice here. The only thing I can add is to look at some upper level succession game threads, and perhaps download old Game of the Month saves. Then you can see how other people are maxing research.

From your last post, it looks like you may not have adjusted the slider as you got closer to finishing your research. That's always good for another 50-500 gold.

You might also want to tailor your research for trading. The AI usually always goes for Gunpowder, Nationalism, and Democracy. You might consider researching other techs first for the purpose of trading them. The AI won't pay as much for a tech they are already researching.

 

[mad_stork]

Hurricane, are you using V1.29? I can never get any gold/turn from the AI since I upgraded. Of course, I'm not sure if I've ever tried to trade electronics....