[NFP] Hypothetical New Mode - Plagues & Pandemics (Or, What Zombies Could Have Been)

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Hypothetical New Mode (Or, What Zombies Could Have Been):

In another thread discussing the New Frontier Pass, I saw that many persons, like me, were disappointed with the last new mode featuring zombies. I suggested an alternative mode about health and disease (as many others have also done) but didn’t bother going into much detail. Here is a more fleshed out concept, in case modders (or ideally, Firaxis itself) want to run with it.

Plagues & Pandemics

During each new game of civilization, a random assortment of diseases will be present, with larger maps having more diseases. The player will not initially know what these diseases are, as they will be revealed as the game progresses.

List of afflictions and maladies

Bubonic Plague
Cholera
Coronavirus
Ebola
Influenza
Leprosy
Oncogenic Virus
Malaria
Small Pox
Tuberculosis
Virulent Prion

(Functionally, the diseases operate in the same way)

Map size and number of diseases

Duel: 2 diseases
Tiny: 3 diseases
Small: 4 diseases
and so forth

The first time a plague occurs, a new disease will be “founded”, until all diseases in the game are discovered. Each civilization can only “found” one disease. City-states can experience, but not discover, diseases.

Plagues operate on the level of cities. In the absence of modifiers, a plague state lasts 5 turns, loses one population per turn, and reduces all yields by 50%. Afflicted cities are “under siege” and won’t heal from attacks/natural disasters.

Whether a plague occurs is a function of the new city-specific metric “health,” as well as probability.

A new city starts with “neutral” health (zero). Health decreases when cities become more crowded, as follows:

Size 1-3 = 0 Health
Size 4-6 = -1 Health
Size 7-9 = -2 Health
Size 10-12 = -3 Health
and so forth

The probability of experiencing a plague increases as health decreases, as follows:

-1 = 5% per turn
-2 = 10% per turn
-3 = 20% per turn
-4 = 40% per turn
-5 and below = permanent plague state

(There is potential to control plague frequency and severity with a slider, as is currently done for natural disasters).

Any city experiencing a plague state can transmit the plague to cities in close proximity, as well as along trade routes. The probably of a nearby city or trade route recipient “catching” the plague is dependent upon city health level, as well as any modifiers that may be present.


Pandemics are triggered when the same plague is present on more than one continent.

Any civilization where the pandemic disease is present will infect the lowest health city in any rival civilization sharing open borders or an arrangement which results in open borders (eg alliance). All trade routes originating from cities with plague induce plague in destination cities.

The pandemic condition gives a 50% chance that the pathogen will acquire one of seven new mutations:

Latent Infection - Plague duration increases 60%
Airborne transmission - increases the spread chance of the pathogen in the future
Antigenic Variation - Yield loss cannot be mitigated
Hardened Spores - Can no longer be incinerated by plague doctor/ MRT
Hemorrhagic Fever - Doubles population Loss
Breakbone Fever - Yield loss increases to 75%
Cortical Highjacking - Plagues spawn “infected” that pillage and attack your units and cities whilst spreading disease - a nod to zombies mode

When a pandemic occurs, the same disease may not become a pandemic again for at least 30 turns.
___________________________________

As described thus far, this new game mode doesn’t include any ways of increasing health or limiting the spread of disease. Fortunately, of course, you will have some tools in your arsenal.

Firstly, there will be a new specialty district: The Wellness District.

Due to district bloat, each civilization will be limited to one of these. Luckily, they are powerful and offer broad benefits.

The Wellness District itself provides all cities +1 health, and an additional +1 health to all cities within 6 tiles. Furthermore, there are three buildings that can be constructed as the game progresses:

Tier 1 Apothecary – Provides +1 health to the host city per type of feature present in the host city: oases, reefs, fissures, jungles, and woods, and grants access to the healer unit

Tier 2 Infirmary – Provides +1 health to all of your cities within 9 tiles and grants access to the plague doctor unit

Tier 3 Department of Public Health – Provides +1 health to all cities and grants access to the medical response team.

Healers upgrade to plague doctors, and plague doctors upgrade to medical response teams. The obsolete unit can no longer be trained and is automatically upgraded.

>When a healer is present inside a city, yields drop 25% instead of 50%, and instead of losing one population per turn food is reset and growth becomes 0%.

>Plague doctors have two charges for the incinerate ability. Using a charge immediately ends a plague at the cost of 1 population. When both charges are consumed, the unit is lost.

>Medical Response Teams are sort of a combination of healers and plague doctors. When present, yield loss becomes 20% instead of 50%. They have one charge that immediately ends a pandemic without any population loss and consumes the unit.

Modifiers

-Apostles with the chaplain promotion provide +1 health when inside or adjacent to a city center
-Aqueducts provide +1 health
-Sewers provide +1 health
-The presence of any pillaging within the borders of a cities reduces health by 1
-Factories reduce health by 1, and coal plants reduce health by 1 more

New Policies

-Corpses in Catapults – Siege unit attacks on cities induce plague state (Military)

-Quarantine – Trade routes minus 1 gold but substantially reduced likelihood of spreading disease (Diplomatic)

-Herbal Remedies – +1 health in cities with campuses (Economic)

-Religious Healing - +1 health in cities with holy sites (Economic)

-Universal Healthcare – Plus 2 Health and 1 amenity in all cities, but -3 gold per city (Economic)

New Governor Promotion for Victor
Quarantine Enforcer (replaces Garrison Commander) - Suspends currently active Plagues, and prevents new ones from afflicting his city.

New Spy Mission

-Poison the Well – Induces plague state (can help to create pandemic conditions)


New World Wonders

-Temple of Asclepius – The presence of reef, fissure, and oasis provides +1 health in all cities (up to +3 health per city) / built adjacent to wellness district

-Pasteur Institute - +2 health in all cities with universities / built adjacent to a university

New Great Persons
Edward Jenner - When present in a city, mitigates plague effects; upon retirement, all plagues in your civilization are suspended and up to 2 mutations are removed from any disease founded in your territory
John Snow - Same active effect; upon retirement, all cities in your civilization receive +1 health

Achievements
Superbug - Have a disease in your game with 5 or more mutations
Too Soon? - Lose at least 50 population to coronavirus in a single game
Don’t Dead Open Inside - Have 10 or more infected inside your borders on the same turn
_____________________

Some Thoughts:

My concern is that players would avoid large populous cities altogether, as well as trade routes. Therefore, there could be a buff to tall cities as follows: Specialists do not consume food and produce twice their intrinsic yield, ie +2 science instead of +1 science.

Also, the numbers would probably need tweaking to be balanced and fair. That’s why there are QA departments.

Would love to know what you think!
 
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New Policies

-Corpses in Catapults – Siege unit attacks on cities induce plague state (Military)

-Quarantine – Trade routes minus 1 gold but substantially reduced likelihood of spreading disease (Diplomatic)

-Herbal Remedies – +1 health in cities with campuses (Economic)

-Religious Healing - +1 health in cities with holy sites (Economic)

-Universal Healthcare – Plus 2 Health and 1 amenity in all cities, but -3 gold per city (Economic)
Honestly, the Mongols should have the Corpses in Catapults Policy as an Ability. :shifty:
 
Two thoughts-

Plague should also reduce military unit strength by some measure. Maybe units fighting in a city with plague take damage per turn?

Instead of a district there should be a “health governor” that you can promote and move around to address these issues.

I guess the idea is you’re going to be stricken with plague and as such you’re sure to end up in a dark age as your cities and economies shrink (and this is totally out of your control) and this may keep you from totally snowballing?

Should also have some sort of plague or post plague policies or mechanics to help your cities grow and rebound kind of like a heroic age.
 
I do like these ideas and have some of my own.

I'd like for there to be a Pandemic Emergency, in the world congress, whenever a pandemic is triggered. I would say when it effects at least two different civilizations instead of two different continents, but it doesn't matter. This is similar to an Aid Request for Natural Disaster then the other emergencies, and is scored like a competition.
In a Pandemic Emergency you can gain points by the followings:
Sending plague doctors, medics or other specific units to the affected cities.
Giving gifts of gold to the affected civilizations
Build and maintain aqueducts, hospitals?, sewers (other related buildings)
Run Find a Cure project in cities with a Research Lab.

Rewards can be the same as Aid Requests:
Gold Tier: +2 Diplo points
Silver Tier: 100 Diplo favor
Bronze Tier: 50 Diplo favor

Instead of a district there should be a “health governor” that you can promote and move around to address these issues.
Even though I do think there needs to be some infrastructure related to health, such as at least a hospital building, I like the idea of a "health governor" that you can move around. I don't know why but "Quincy the Quarantine Specialist " just popped into my head. :lol:
 
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Pretty well thought out though probably unlikely given ... the nature of “things”.
I do agree with the above poster that perhaps we shouldn’t add yet another district and instead use the approach of a new governor or something like additional options for existing districts.
 
Quick thought, as I am in Quick read mode now -> not relating city health to the housing system is off. I’d suggest to review the proposal to link the health metric to population to take into account the housing surpl
 
Pretty well thought out though probably unlikely given ... the nature of “things”.
I do agree with the above poster that perhaps we shouldn’t add yet another district and instead use the approach of a new governor or something like additional options for existing districts.
I've seen ideas around reworking the existing aqueduct district into a health district and the aqueduct could be a first tier building.
But a single building like a hospital could easily go into a city center or neighborhood.
 
I blanked on aqueducts being in the game as I wrote that up. I could definitely see aqueducts being crucial.

As suggested, we probably will never get anything like this regardless, but one can dream.

I've seen ideas around reworking the existing aqueduct district into a health district and the aqueduct could be a first tier building.
But a single building like a hospital could easily go into a city center or neighborhood.
 
I blanked on aqueducts being in the game as I wrote that up. I could definitely see aqueducts being crucial.

As suggested, we probably will never get anything like this regardless, but one can dream.
Honestly the spy mission that you suggested, "Poison the Well", could be a mission in a foreign city's aqueduct district.
 
Hypothetical New Mode (Or, What Zombies Could Have Been):

In another thread discussing the New Frontier Pass, I saw that many persons, like me, were disappointed with the last new mode featuring zombies. I suggested an alternative mode about health and disease (as many others have also done) but didn’t bother going into much detail. Here is a more fleshed out concept, in case modders (or ideally, Firaxis itself) want to run with it.

Plagues & Pandemics

During each new game of civilization, a random assortment of diseases will be present, with larger maps having more diseases. The player will not initially know what these diseases are, as they will be revealed as the game progresses.

List of afflictions and maladies

Bubonic Plague
Cholera
Coronavirus
Ebola
Influenza
Leprosy
Oncogenic Virus
Malaria
Small Pox
Tuberculosis
Virulent Prion

(Functionally, the diseases operate in the same way)

Map size and number of diseases

Duel: 2 diseases
Tiny: 3 diseases
Small: 4 diseases
and so forth

The first time a plague occurs, a new disease will be “founded”, until all diseases in the game are discovered. Each civilization can only “found” one disease. City-states can experience, but not discover, diseases.

Plagues operate on the level of cities. In the absence of modifiers, a plague state lasts 5 turns, loses one population per turn, and reduces all yields by 50%. Afflicted cities are “under siege” and won’t heal from attacks/natural disasters.

Whether a plague occurs is a function of the new city-specific metric “health,” as well as probability.

A new city starts with “neutral” health (zero). Health decreases when cities become more crowded, as follows:

Size 1-3 = 0 Health
Size 4-6 = -1 Health
Size 7-9 = -2 Health
Size 10-12 = -3 Health
and so forth

The probability of experiencing a plague increases as health decreases, as follows:

-1 = 5% per turn
-2 = 10% per turn
-3 = 20% per turn
-4 = 40% per turn
-5 and below = permanent plague state

(There is potential to control plague frequency and severity with a slider, as is currently done for natural disasters).

Any city experiencing a plague state can transmit the plague to cities in close proximity, as well as along trade routes. The probably of a nearby city or trade route recipient “catching” the plague is dependent upon city health level, as well as any modifiers that may be present.


Pandemics are triggered when the same plague is present on more than one continent.

Any civilization where the pandemic disease is present will infect the lowest health city in any rival civilization sharing open borders or an arrangement which results in open borders (eg alliance). All trade routes originating from cities with plague induce plague in destination cities.

___________________________________

As described thus far, this new game mode doesn’t include any ways of increasing health or limiting the spread of disease. Fortunately, of course, you will have some tools in your arsenal.

Firstly, there will be a new specialty district: The Wellness District.

Due to district bloat, each civilization will be limited to one of these. Luckily, they are powerful and offer broad benefits.

The Wellness District itself provides all cities +1 health, and an additional +1 health to all cities within 6 tiles. Furthermore, there are three buildings that can be constructed as the game progresses:

Tier 1 Apothecary – Provides +1 health to the host city per type of feature present in the host city: oases, reefs, fissures, jungles, and woods, and grants access to the healer unit

Tier 2 Infirmary – Provides +1 health to all of your cities within 9 tiles and grants access to the plague doctor unit

Tier 3 Department of Public Health – Provides +1 health to all cities and grants access to the medical response team.

Healers upgrade to plague doctors, and plague doctors upgrade to medical response teams. The obsolete unit can no longer be trained and is automatically upgraded.

>When a healer is present inside a city, yields drop 25% instead of 50%, and instead of losing one population per turn food is reset and growth becomes 0%.

>Plague doctors have two charges for the incinerate ability. Using a charge immediately ends a plague at the cost of 1 population. When both charges are consumed, the unit is lost.

>Medical Response Teams are sort of a combination of healers and plague doctors. When present, yield loss becomes 20% instead of 50%. They have one charge that immediately ends a pandemic without any population loss and consumes the unit.

Modifiers

-Apostles with the chaplain promotion provide +1 health when inside or adjacent to a city center
-Sewers provide +1 health
-Any pillaging within the borders of a cities reduces health by 1
-Factories reduce health by 1, and coal plants reduce health by 1 more

New Policies

-Corpses in Catapults – Siege unit attacks on cities induce plague state (Military)

-Quarantine – Trade routes minus 1 gold but substantially reduced likelihood of spreading disease (Diplomatic)

-Herbal Remedies – +1 health in cities with campuses (Economic)

-Religious Healing - +1 health in cities with holy sites (Economic)

-Universal Healthcare – Plus 2 Health and 1 amenity in all cities, but -3 gold per city (Economic)



New Spy Mission

-Poison the Well – Induces plague state (can help to create pandemic conditions)


New World Wonders

-Temple of Asclepius – The presence of reef, fissure, and oasis provides +1 health in all cities (up to +3 health per city) / built adjacent to wellness district

-Pasteur Institute - +2 health in all cities with universities / built adjacent to a university

New Great Persons
Jenner - When present in a city, mitigates plague effects; upon retirement, all plagues in your civilization are suspended
Salk - Same active effect; upon retirement, all cities in your civilization receive +1 health

_____________________

Some Thoughts:

My concern is that players would avoid large populous cities altogether, as well as trade routes. Therefore, there could be a buff to tall cities as follows: Specialists do not consume food and produce twice their intrinsic yield, ie +2 science instead of +1 science.

Also, the numbers would probably need tweaking to be balanced and fair. That’s why there are QA departments.

Would love to know what you think!

You put much more though than Fxs into this... Actually, you put probably more thought into this than Fxs into all NFP modes combined... Which is why all modes are dissapointing at best and speaks volumes on how they threat us, the players.

And I have nothing more to say.
 
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I still think Civ is actually structured in a way that could not only be fun with cooperative modes, but maybe even become a more fun as a consequence of it.

And I think, as the game Pandemic illustrates, fighting against something like epidemics is a natural fit for that kind of gameplay. (The other mode I think which would work for cooperative play is alien invasion).
 
Quick thought, as I am in Quick read mode now -> not relating city health to the housing system is off. I’d suggest to review the proposal to link the health metric to population to take into account the housing surpl


I like this. I think cities close to the housing cap should be more likely to have plagues, and cities with excess housing should have less impact.

So plague could devastate your capital but it could also devastate a small city off fresh water that you just settled.

Although honestly current housing mechanics and their impact on growth rate seem to account for this pretty well.
 
A lot of work. Well done and thanks for sharing.
In general, I like the idea. As for some minor concerns.
- Somehow you should be able to stop diseases in different Civilizations cities. In some situations, it can be beneficial for you if plague affects AI, but on the other hand, AI can just fail and trigger a Pandemic that can spread to just one of your cities. In general, if AI could not handle this mechanic the world could be in a state of permanent pandemics, or the player must become a Global doctor.
- If the Wellness district would appear too late in Tech or Civic tree in the early - very important part of the game you and AI would be almost helpless after reaching a city with 7 population. Perhaps some early game Policy Card or city center building would help to manage with this
- I think this is always a good idea in designing the game to keep the proportions between punishing and beneficial factors. So I would add some small local buff after you get rid of the plague in your City, and a larger buff for all after the World fightback the Pandemics.
But in general very good ideas.
 
Been thinking, giving diseases different traits might add some flavor. EG, ebola more lethal but less communicable than influenza.

Also, when pandemics occur, there could be a chance for any disease to acquire one of seven mutations:

Latent Infection - Plague duration increases 60%
Airborne transmission - increases the spread chance of the pathogen in the future
Antigenic Variation - Yield loss cannot be mitigated
Hardened Spores - Can no longer be incinerated by plague doctor/ MRT
Hemorrhagic Fever - Doubles population Loss
Breakbone Fever - Yield loss increases to 75%
Cortical Highjacking - Plagues spawn “infected” that pillage and attack your units and cities whilst spreading disease - a nod to zombies mode

After a pandemic occurs, the next pandemic would be blocked for 20-30 turns.
 
I remember a while ago when this sort of idea was first circulating, and I dug up an old post of mine with the ideas I added to it. Here are the ones that aren't redundant:
Sanitation tech: +1 Health to all cities.
New civ ability for Rome, Cloaca Maxima: +1 Health to all cities with the Construction technology. Sewers do not provide Health.
New civ ability for Arabia, Islamic Golden Age: During a Golden Age, +25% Science, +1 Health in cities with a Campus, and medical units are 30% cheaper to train.
New ability for Abu al-Qasim al-Zahrawi: Passively mitigates Plague effects; when retired, generates a Healer unit.
New promotion for Victor: Quarantine Enforcer, which replaces Garrison Commander. Shortens the duration of currently active Plagues, and prevents new ones from afflicting his city.
 
I took some suggestions ya’ll made and incorporated them. Specifically, about aqueducts and Victor. Thank you so much. I am going to try to email this to Firaxis:)
 
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