I want Saltpeter back

[Armorydave]

Copper is not analogous to saltpeter because Ironworking is the next tech up the tree from Bronzeworking. Theoretically, oil would be the "replacement" for SP and that comes way down the tech tree from gunpowder.

I agree with DH-Epic and Proteus pretty much across the board. Removing the hard resource cap on some or all production seems a particularly good idea. If that was the case, I wouldn't have any problem with the addition of SP as a resource.

 

[dh_epic]

... ...

2) Why would saltpeter make peace to weak?

1) The player with the bigger empire would have higher chances to have access to saltpeter ressources.

...

1) This is correct.

 

[ronnybiggs]

I always thought the saltpeter resource was highly unrealistic. The stuff was made from piss and dung! Like that's in short supply around the world!

 

[civ_king]

not 2 complement nazi germany but in 1928 cause they didn't have much oil the figured out how 2 make oil from coal. in other words for for resources u should have 2 discover a special tech to make say oil from coal

 

[civ_king]

also us americans need oil cause all are food has artifical colours and flavours and the thing is its nasty, some people have allergies 2 it others have ADD and ADHD trigger by it. infact i have ADHD and im fine unless i have any food colouring or artifical flavours and same with 4 million other americans and it helps to cause u 2 pack on the pounds fat wise.

btw their is some thing called aspartame thats in most diet drinks and a lot of diet food. the thing about aspartame is when it hits 89 degrees (not celsius) it turns in 2 fomic acid which is in the sting of fire ant, the main thing is it is a poison which mimic multipule scrosis (dunno how 2 spell it) and can kill u if u dont have any aspartame it will go away with in 72 hours sometimes 48.

 

[The Navy Seal]

Commander Bello I completely agree with you.
dh_epic If I agree with you we'll have war elephants even if we live in ice.

 

[KrikkitTwo]

On several points

The 'resourceless Renaissance' is an interesting game play tactic of providing a reshuffling of the deck... and an improvement in defense

It Also has the added bonus of fitting with realism, in that in terms of Strategic resources (rather than trade) Lumber would probably be the most in that period (for ships)

Now It'd probably be more realistic, and possibly better for gameplay, if Intead of giving units that ignored castles, Gunpowder gave units that destroyed Castles faster (say 40% damage per bombard to Castle/Wall defense, 60% for cannons, 80% with Artillery)... maybe let Infantry+ type units Ignore them.


As for Bronze working... I agree the tech is too powerful, and think they should consider moving slavery to AH (essentially making it BW II giving you two, rush to get it options)... of course now that Warlords has beefed up Chariots, and decreased Axes, it becomes less necessary, but I still think it is a good idea.
(of course they should probably also decrease Slavery's power slightly)

 

[Proteus]

On several points
Now It'd probably be more realistic, and possibly better for gameplay, if Intead of giving units that ignored castles, Gunpowder gave units that destroyed Castles faster (say 40% damage per bombard to Castle/Wall defense, 60% for cannons, 80% with Artillery)... maybe let Infantry+ type units Ignore them.

They should at least survive the gunpowder era, as the building style of city walls adapted to the rise of gunpowder, leading to starshaped city walls (for a better overlapping fields of fire for guns positioned at the "edges" of the star) which were somewhat inclined (to better deflect cannonballs).

Here, as an examples, the city walls of Dresden during the 18th century:
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/f/f2/Dresden1750.jpg

As for the higher bombardment value of cannons against city walls:
For the reasons mentioned above (adaptation of city walls to cannons) the bombardment value of cannons against city walls should be lower (for example 40%) or there should be an option to upgrade the city walls to "modernized city walls" which are better able to withstand cannons.

Of course the bombardment value of cannons/artillery against cultural defense should sty the same, so that for example, if you have a city with 80% Cultural Def and Castle + City walls (100%) which is attacked by a cannon (20% vs. Cult. Def., 40% vs. City walls) you would get 60% cult. Def and 60 % City Wall/Castle Def after the first and 40% Cult / 20% Walls Def after the second shot.

 

[Naastriil]

It think having gunpowder as a resource was wrong in CIV 3 anyway. If you want to have gunpowder for muskets then you should have stone for catapult. Wood for arrows so on....


But I think that they should have added rubber for any modern unit.

 

[zeeter]

Ok, I got tired of reading all four pages of this. Stopped after page two. So if I repeat anyone I apologize.

Gunpowder is extremely easy to make. Mix some nitrite with some dirt and I think you're pretty much there.

The Confederates at Vicksburg saved their urine to make gunpowder during the siege there.

Because some nations didn't have gunpowder doesnt' mean they couldn't get it, it just means they didn't feel like making it.

Europeans saved their urine for more than making gunpowder. For centuries they used the ammonia properties within urine as a sort of bleach.

Why do I know so much about urine?

 

[Uiler]

Ok, I got tired of reading all four pages of this. Stopped after page two. So if I repeat anyone I apologize.

Gunpowder is extremely easy to make. Mix some nitrite with some dirt and I think you're pretty much there.

The Confederates at Vicksburg saved their urine to make gunpowder during the siege there.

Because some nations didn't have gunpowder doesnt' mean they couldn't get it, it just means they didn't feel like making it.

Europeans saved their urine for more than making gunpowder. For centuries they used the ammonia properties within urine as a sort of bleach.

Why do I know so much about urine?

I couldn't help add to the urine topic...

The Chinese saved their urine for fertilizer.

Ah, the power of urine...

 

[curtadams]

Sounds like we need to use an outhouse for the icon if it's used as a resource, eh?

The odd thing to me was that when the Saltpeter resource was introduced in Civ3, there was a LOT of *****ing about it. How things change!

 

[EdwardTking]

I always thought that Sulphur should be the resource for Gunpowder